Sneaky is right. They're bringing it back and we'll have to wait and see. Why would ford do so much with the GT now. They haven't before. Now I understand ford going all out for the cobra, but not the GT. They haven't done it before. Why would ford change now?

 

Actually, the "big fans" that scrutinize everything are the ones no one listens to. No offense, but I doubt you'd ever be satisfied. Even if the Camaro DID have more power than the Cobra, you'd STILL have something to b*tch about. Just like when the Camaro was faster pre 2003, no one was happy so everyone complained about the "cheap interiors".

Most of us are happy it's coming back, and aren't b*tching one bit. You should be happy that the Camaro is coming back as a RWD V8

 

Wrong. I would be satisfied if the car meets my expectations and lives up to what it should. It is absolutely not a case where there will always be something to bitch about. I think your last sentances are kind of what has been going around where people have lowered thier expectations and are willing to call any car that has a V8 and rwd a Camaro "just as long as it comes back". That is the wrong attitude to have in my opinion.

 

First, let me say that I'm with Sneaky here. Watering down Camaro to suit GTO would be a mistake. Many here say that there is no "Corvette Rule" (something that I believe DOES exist)...but now we're saying that there WILL be a "GTO Rule"?

Second, the above quote makes alot of presumptions.

-"There will be no Z/28 model"....is a pretty definitive statement. Who knows...what ends up happening with Z/28 may surprise you.

-I'd doubt Camaro will have less performance than before.

-Maxing out at 5.3L to stay price competitive, doesn't make any sense to me.......please splainit to me.

 

 

IMHO

Is there a Corvette rule? YES

Is there a GTO rule? NO

THe Camaro will go by the Corvette rule, so if the base Vette is 405HP them we may only have a 400HP Camaro

The GTO on the other hand does not live by the Vette rule and is free to roam above the base Vette HP, just like the CTSv.

 

I know it's crazy, but unless it's a caddy, I can't see any car GM makes will have more power than that same year Z06. Has this ever happenned?

 

It's pretty apparent that Caddy has free reign to do what they want. When the C6 Z06 gets the LS7...if Caddy wants it, the Corvette team will be powerless to stop them.

Somehow......I don't see Pontiac having that kind of pull.

 

I don't see why some of you are so upset.

If the following is true, where is the problem?

Camaro =(better be greater than) Mustang and Mustang GT, same price range

GTO = (or greater than) Mustang Cobra, same price range.

C6= Still playing it's own game.

Seriously, I don't think they're going to water-down the Camaro just to fit under the GTO. It's not like the Camaro was going to get a 1,000hp quad-turbo engine until GTO came along.

Camaro should do what it's supposed to, be faster and handle better than the Mustang GT at the same pricing level.

If you're worried about Cobra's, put more money into your ride, or (GASP!) buy the car that's going to be competing with it. Those saying you would buy a special edition Camaro that's faster, you'd be paying a premium for it. And who says GM won't do a special edition that's faster?

I'd say just sit tight, all this bitching is pointless until GM ACTUALLY SAYS SOMETHING. If they come out with something you don't feel lives up to the Camaro name, bitch then, but until then, be patient

 

One more factoid. Stock-for-stock, LS1 F-bodies were often known to pull better numbers on the dyno than their C5 counterparts. "310 HP" Z28's indeed.

 

The fact that there will be a > $40,000 Mustang branded as a snake that is faster than than the stock $27,000 - $30,000 Camaro is why we have an aftermarket.

 

That's only because the Vette's power-robbing IRS. What cars pulled better track times?

I'm curious to see just how long this list of "expectations" is Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying any RWD V8 will do, but I'm not expecting something as great as the Vetter, and you shouldn't either. I'm not saying that's what you're expecting either, that's just what it sounds like.

As far as it "living up to what it should", I believe that's to have near-Corvette performance without the quality of course. Who said that it needs 500 hp like the Z06? Why not have 400 like the base models? Are we getting greedy now?

I understand how you might think the Camaro's getting bent over by the GTO, but like already state, Pontiacs have always been better, except for one exception: the 4th Gens. Even the 89 TTA was better than the VETTE of that era. What can you say about that? It was only a matter of time before a Poncho came out that could do it again.

Don't get your panties into a bunch, now. I'm sure GM has everything under control. The Camaro will NOT disappoint.

 

OK here's the story.

There is an unspoken vette rule.

The '06 Cobra(~500hp) will beat the base C6(~400hp) like red headed stepchild.

THEREFORE, no Camaro is going to come within a country mile of the new Cobra's performance.

Whaddaya got left? The 300+hp Mustang GT at $25K. That's it. That's the Camaro's economic competition. The Camaro SS( I believe everything Chevy performance is going SS, right?) will have those parameters to operate in. The bottom line is you got $25K to work with to beat the GT. There ain't no 400hp 6.0 for 25K sorry.

There's really no point to make half assed attempt after the Cobra if you can't go past C6 performance. Plus you have GTO(350hp low $30Ks) and then GTO+(at ~400hp $40K), and finally C6(~400hp low$40Ks). GTO has the range of car you guys want the Camaro to take. Well just go buy a GTO. That's my read.

As far as BEATING the '06 Cobra? It's gonna take a Z06, just like today.

 

Now, do you really think GM is going to consider this view? Let's get real. You pay for performance.

A cheap car isn't going to outperform a more expensive car from the same company, let alone the same division. That's life. That's business.

Let's look at what you are saying here:

You are saying that you are unhappy if you have to resort to buying a Corvette to out perform a Cobra to remain brand loyal, yet you also say Chevy should make a "limited edition" Camaro that outperform a Cobra, with cost being NO object.

You do realize that you just blew your own argument clean out of the water here, right?

1. Corvette is quicker than Camaro. Period. They are both in the same showroom, have different buyers, Corvette has more performance than Camaro because it costs more than Camaro. Always have. Live with it.

2. Expensive "Limited Edition" Camaros simply won't sell, won't make a profit. Camaro is sold at Chevy prices. Anything done to Camaros will be done with an eye as to how much will it cost to sell.

3. What "WE" really want is a V8, RWD, Camaro that beats Mustang on a dollar for dollar basis. Let's be completely honest here: Are YOU actually going to buy a $40,000 Camaro?

You may go $28K or $30K, and so will a heap of people. But you'll sell quite a few a loaded upmarket GTO that'll runs with Cobras. GTO isn't even in the shorooms, and almost 18% of the 1st year's allotment is sold already!

New Mustang Cobras ALREADY outrun f-bodies by a pretty big margin. CADILLAC has cars that will outrun your f-body. And the next Camaros will get quicker, not slower.

CTSv, Z06, and GTO will have the top LS* engines, and. Corvettes, Camaros, and perhaps Chevy's RWD sedans will have LS* that aren't quite as powerful, but will be cheaper than the high powered rides.

You pay for performance. Either buy aftermarket (which Camaro owners traditionally do), buy a Corvette, or buy a GTO.

 

Just some personal impressions.

I can see CTSv and Z06 sharing a 500 hp LS7.....but I have a hard time seeing one in a GTO. Getting back to the "you gotta pay for performance" argument....why would I buy a CTSv for say $50K when a $40K GTO will give me the same performance?

You really think Caddy would let that happen? (Let alone Corvette team).

I think the top GTO will share an engine with the top Camaro.

If GMPD does a Camaro version...AND WHY WOULDN'T THEY???.......does everyone really think it'll be some milktoast version playing second "performance" fiddle to GTO?