<They are the cars that are making 350-360 rwhp stock and run like crap for the most part>

While I'm not nearly as intelligent as you (obviously) I've always assumed that high 12's/low 13's@107-110 was pretty good for a 3700 lbs. car that makes 335-350 rwhp (haven't seen any make 360 like you claim). Also, while you obviously have more experience with the GTO than myself (seeing as I only own one, and you own so many), I assume that when I see the same car in question run high 13's and low 14's, it's the driver's fault. I'd think, with your claimed 3000 + passes down the 1320 you'd realize that not every car performs to it's potential every run. Guess it'll take a few more passes before you realize that little things like the car's DRIVER might have an impact on the final result. For instance, the first time I ran my GTO it ran a 14.2@102. The last time I ran it that same night it pulled a 13.3@104.9. How can the same car be both a low 14 sec. car and a low 13 sec. car?????? The mind boggles....I can't fathom what might cause such a drastic margin there. Maybe sunspots or something.

In other words, please remove your head from your *** before you talk to me again. LS1 or LS2gto.com would be a good place to start with that...

 

Here's some things to consider before you generalize the entire run of GTO's based on the one car you witnessed in S. Dakota:

Was traction control turned off? (That could be the problem right there.)
What was the 60' time?
Did he power shift?
What rpm was he shifting at?
What kind of tires?
Did the driver have ANY track experience?

Without knowing the answer to any of these questions, you sound stupid making the statements you're making about these cars.

 

Im gonna chime in real quick and point a couple things out that your missing though ...

You run mid to low 13's at 105, he is running mid to low 13's at 101 or 102 ???

He has a live rear axle. You get IRS ****. So basically, from the factory, your stuck trying to launch a 3700-3800lbs car with poor rear suspension. And from a stop, LT1 cars tend to kick ***. They are an awesome stop light to stoplight kinda car. They also have a live rear axle. This makes it alot easier to take out "faster" cars on the street where most races dont get up too fast. 1st and 2nd gear runs, it kinda puts IRS cars at a weak point. They cant launch very well ... And if they can, they probably already have broken parts ...

 

i will admit that the GTO is faster car then mine, yet i have not witnessed it. i would love to run one and find out for myself.
and i am not basing my decisions only of the ones i seen in north dakota. it is of vids i have seen on many differnet sites.
you guys bother me. yes i know u car should be faster, but i have to see it. to me, THE AVG GTO IS A HI 13 CAR THAT TRAPS 104. easy as that.
and put this to work. the GTO that are trapping 108, that is probably in good weather correct?????????????
well in good weather i trap 104, possibly 105 now that i have done some more lil mods.

i am trying to be logical, but sems u guys are thickheaded and dont comprehend that a LT1 is capable of putting up a fight against a GTO.

 

http://www.ls2gto.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90604

please read GTO owners. right there is the guy thati seen run. all of ur ?'s should be answered about this guys driving and conditions.

 

ok dude....ya know what....I think we have signals crossed here.....

first I apologize for fueling the fire and being somewhat immature here.

I am NOT denying that an LT1, especially a modded one could give a stock LS2 GTO a run for it's money (or beat it depending on what mods it has)

I'm really not.....I don't think the LT1 is some kind of hopeless boat anchor or anything. I owned one and it was a decently quick car with a couple mods.

My only problem is that it seemed to me that you were saying that an LS2 GTO simply would not go any faster than a high-13/low-14 @ 100 mph.

I dunno WHAT the deal is with the ones up there in north dakota (including the one in the thread you linked to) but all I'm saying is take my word for it.....they're capable of much more.

The quickest i've ever heard of BONE STOCK is a 12.92 and the fastest MPH i've heard of BONE STOCK was 110 and change. (not the same car, the former was auto, the latter manual)

Naturally, not everyone can get these kinda numbers out of them, and some of those who can are hindered by elevation and climate. There are a million variables.

Unless the C5 corvette is a 14 second car (sorry I keep bringing that up, but they're all I ever seem to get a race with and thus all I have to gauge by), my GTO isn't either (and wasn't when stock).

...and contrary to what CANTONRACER says, what YOUR timeslip says does not dictate what your particular model of car is capable of. The fact that other people who own the same car have gone quicker and faster would positively prove that to be false.


ALL I'm trying to say is that a competent driver (biggest variable of them all) with even DECENT air will drive a mechanically sound LS2 GTO to at least 13.30s if not a bit quicker.

 

I went back and read this again....it does answer my question.

If a hayabusa can barely run in the 10s, I'm not surprised a GTO ran 14.0.

98 degrees is absolutely ridiculous. not only do internal combustion engines make crap for power, but when the track is THAT hot, it ain't hooking. It gets greasy.

in those conditions I understand why the car ran slow (who knows how the guy drives too).

like I said, the point I'm trying to make is that saying the GTO is a 14-second car because of THAT example is an over-generalization.

 

Yep ... driver does make a world of difference. I know I would launch an IRS car like a big pooosay. I wouldnt wanna go breaking ****, and I would for sure end up with a ****ty 60' until I could beef it up ...

 

14 sec. c5, you need to get around a few more.

 

dude, i was saying the C5 is NOT a 14 second car.

 

Oh, o.k., then you'd be correct.

 

the guy whos thread i linked u to has a milllion excuses for everything. anyway i have the vid of the busa running 9.4@14x. anyway all 13/14 sec cars were .3 and 3 mph slower then normal. the D.A. that day was hovering just above 3k. i already did the math for the guy and posted what his times in corrected air were. 13.7@103
if he couldve hooked better then his 2.1 he wouldve ran better, maybe a 13.5 who knows. i have videos of many cars running that day.

anyway i know the GTO is a faster car, but i just expected more out of them and after seeing so many hi 13 low 14 slips, it grew on me.
well hopefully in the next month i make it out to OSW (orlando speed world) and will see more then 5 running. then i can get a more general idea of what they run.

 

I'll take my overpriced piece of crap over any **** bucket you have in your sig any day. Maybe you should spend a little time around newer GTOs. The interior quality is just about the best I've seen from GM (on par with C5/6 cars), and I guarantee it's heads and shoulders above your V6 muffstain, '96 Z28 and your Lightning in build quality.

If 106-108 MPH for ~ $30k is slow in your book, so be it. That's your problem.

 

Not to be a dick, but the interior is the only thing they have thats "nicer" ...

Their not the kind of car a GTO used to be. They ARE NOT a muscle car. Beg to differ? Go look at your IRS. And dont forget that Grand Prix-ish super aggressive mean looking styling.

If you buy a car for superb interior quality, go buy a Bimmer, Benz, or ANY new Chrysler ... They are leaps and bounds past the GTO's inside.

Now dont get me wrong, I like the new GTO's and I know their fast. But to say their better then a 4th gen F-body in every way is like comparing apples to oranges. Its not a Muscle car ... Modern sports car, yes. Modern muscle? No. The 4th gen fbodys dominate in exterior looks, design ( As far as muscle cars are concerned ... Example: No IRS )...And for what its worth, I have to say that the interior in my camaro, is by far one of the nicest out of the pony cars I have seen. The way the instrument panel, gauges, and overall layout of the interior is, is pretty damn sweet. I dont know about you but I like slouching down into it kinda like a cockpit of a plane or something.

Stop bashing each others cars. And yes some GTO's have been in the high 12's bone stock. But as far as that goes, Even Smith, the same guy who plowed a GTO down the 1320 in high 12's, had a LT1 Camaro Z28 running 13.2's or 13.4's ... Yes stock for stock, a new GTO, properly drivin SHOULD beat a stock LT1 car ... Anything can happen on the street. I beat a 600cc sport bike 0-50ish ... Im not fast then him by any means though. And as far as that goes, anythign can happen at the track. The real question isnt how fasta car can go, its how willing are you to abuse your car and how well can you drive ?

Now seriously, enough ...

 

Having owned both, I will say that the GTO is superior to an F-body in every way to me. The important distinction to be made is that my comparison is only valid for me and my needs. You have your reasons for loving your F-body, and I have my reasons for loving my GTO. We can all like different things for different reasons, and no one has to be wrong. People often end up thinking that their type of car is the greatest thing for everyone, all of the time, and this is when the bashing begins. Although you seem to understand that, I feel the need to mention it anyways. I respect the F-body, and I respect their owners as fellow car enthusiasts (unless they give me reason to think otherwise). We certainly have no reason to look down on one another.

The F-body and GTO are indeed an apples and oranges comparison. In the case of LS1 F-body vs. LS1 GTO, they share a powerplant, but that is where the similarities end. Two different approaches were devised to address two different goals. The F-body is the modern descendent of two GM classics and muscle car philosophy merged with modern technology. The GTO is the result of Holden's success in building a high-performance sport / touring coupe. In principle, the GTO has more in common with a BMW M3 than an F-body. The Holden Monaro was not designed to be an F-body replacement, or a Pontiac GTO. The word raw comes to mind when thinking of the F-body. The word refined comes to mind when thinking of the GTO. Fast accurately describes them both.




Styling is entirely subjective. For proof of this, look at the fact that people actually spend money on a Honda Element. They are ugly to me, but not everyone. If I felt the Z28 was more visually appealing, I would still have one.

As for the F-body interior, it is indeed the nicest of all F-bodies. I also prefer the last generation F-body interior to that of the Mustang (all versions). The interior was an absolute deal breaker for the 03-04 Cobra. I still miss the T-tops often.