and you haven't even seen one yet? You don't know what the style is going to be like......and you don't know what the weight's gonna be.

 

Alright...for the concept or for production?

You wanted a G35esque Camaro from my memory, and you wanted it at 3200lbs. Sounds ok, but how much better I guess is still up for grabs

That line scares me a tad. I do have great affection for First gens...because they are First Gens. Lets hope that it caries more coke-bottle body design then front end design.

Thats not saying much. Lets just hope that the window motors work after 50k.

So they had to go with what design they had at some point in the time line, and make a concept car out of it. That means that the concept is ready to go, or nearing the end, but further design studies will be conducted

Im not sure what you mean by the Solstice, but where is the "real" Velite and Insignia...cause as of right now they havent hit production. Insignia was supposed to be on "Zeta" but concept was built on Sigma. Velite was also said to be built on "Zeta", and I dont know what it was really built off of.

So if I wrap it all together, what I hear is that the "Camaro" will Zetaish or some sort of heavy Sigma, or very much like the GTO is in size but lower weight, and shapped with a first gen flare. Long story short, GM took the road Ford did, and will be beat up for it.

Thats if all the info Charlie speaks of is truthful. Looks like there could be a lot of dissapointed people out there. I will have to wait till we finaly get to see what GM has been up too since 2002. I hope that Charlie is full of it, and that I wont be let down when I show up in Detroit.

 

Same, except I might look for a C5 after school. I'll just have to wait and see though, I just know I don't wanna be driving around something too heavy (my Z28 is already 35xx and that is a lot to me).

Thanks for the updates though Z284ever, they're appreciated.

 

I think a lot of readers of this message board need a reality check...

 

So, if everything is true in the original post... it will be likely be the best quality, most powerful Camaro ever built, and should have IRS to be the smoothest riding (and I'm sure, at whatever weight it will handle most excellent.)

I don't like retro styling as a progression of a given car... have been saying that for years here now... but considering the market and how it reacts to "value priced" retro vehicles.... I can't blame them.

Sounds like they have another winner on their hands.

Anyone who says this car will fail is smoking crack. For God's sake, Mustang sells out... at capacity... you know, they actually can't build any more, at 200,000 units (all the people saying "Uh, ya... well, the old Mustang sold somewhere close to that, so it ain't so great" keep avoiding the whole THEY CAN'T BUILD ANYMORE tidbit...)... and if Camaro sells just half of that, it will sell twice as well as the 4th Gen was doing.

Also, being piggybacked on an existing platform, means Camaro won't have to sell so many units to be profitable and make a good business case.

Enough with the doom and gloom. Sheez.

 

Are their a lot of people looking to buy an 03+ cobra that just WON"T buy it because it weighs a lot. No....... I have a feeling the 5th gen will have plenty of power.

TONY

 

I'm not really interested in playing The Guessing Game 4 months before the concept debuts and 3 years before the production car hits the street.

I would like to see the car come in at or under ~3500 lbs. If the car carries "heritage" styling, I'll be OK with that. What I'll be looking for is acceleration, handling, and good fuel economy. If the build quality is similar to what GM's been doing lately on passenger cars, I'd be very happy with that. I don't need a fancy interior, just one that's function and doesn't fall apart.

 

If the car comes out and they don't release the curb weight of the car, how many people on this board would actually be able to tell if the car was over 3600 instead of under 3400? Of course if you are a hardcore racer and you NEED a car that is as slim as it can be, then weight might be an issue for you. But lets say that you are that hardcore racer on here, how many of you go to the track without pulling all the weight out of the car that you can? And even then... How many people buy a brand new car to use it for hardcore racing??? In 6 years when you buy a used 08 Camaro, it will already be a smash hit or a huge miss and who cares then?

I know there are some people here that do race and will race it soon off the showroom floor, but most people are not going to know the difference between a few hundred pounds if they make it fast and handle well.

And ****, wait for the car to come out before you say you aren't going to buy one. You people are insane. If you are trying to threaten GM by saying you wont buy one if they don't make it exactly how you want it, I'll tell you right now they can't make the car perfect for everyone.

 

I think the point of most of the posts about people's concerns about weight is this; yeah, they could wait until the car comes out to complain if it is too heavy, but by then their complaining will fall on deaf ears, because any impact they could have made, no matter how small, will be too late. This is a discussion forum, and since this issue keeps popping up on here repeatedly, obviously it is an issue that concerns many performance enthusiasts on here, and is worth discussing. It is, after all, our money that will be spent as well, and at the very least, most of us understand on here that the car has to be more than just performance if it is going to sell well this time around, but don't want the sacrifice to performance to be that great. We may be in the minority over the rest of the automotive world, but it is often our voices that speak the loudest, which is something that I would definetly be aware of if I was in a positon to produce an automobile. Red has instructed to wait for the car to come out, and that it won't be as bad as many are anticipated on here, but I still can't help but be concerned about it.

 

But bitching and complaining that if it's too big or too retro on a website isn't the best way to have your voice be heard. Especially on a board where there is so much bitching and whining that it just gets mixed into the mumblings of "This sucks and I'm not buying GM products anymore", or "I want $70k worth or car for $26k". No one is going to come to this board for insight on future products the way people on here act. I just wish that people on here would try something like "You know, I really hope the people at GM can find some way to keep the fif gen under 3500# and still give it to us at a decent price to compete with the mustang." Instead of "GM always does something wrong so I know the fif gen is going to weigh nearly 2 tons and Im not buying it unless its closer to 1 ton." I just think its ridiculous.

 

To those who are talking about weight I suggest you read ACAR. In this book it talks about the need for the C5 to keep its performance needs and loosing weight is the easiest way to do that. But there is a cost put on weight. For example in the C5 the cost per pound was $5 per pound. If it cost less than $5 to change something to loose a pound then the change was approved. In the C6 book it said the cost per pound allowabe was $10 per pound. Keep in mind that the C5 was a virgin platform and said platform would not be shared with anything else. In the C6 you had the XLR to share some of the cost. The XLR with its higher price point allowed a lot more leeway with the cost for removing weight. Also some peices that were developed for the XLR, for example the aluminum radiator guard, transferred to the C6 because there was no need to recreate the wheel when that worked and worked well was already developed.

So let me ask you how much is it worth to you to keep the weight down. Lets say that the price per pound is $7 per pound, in between the C5 and C6 cost. So that extra 100 lbs you want to take off is $700, 200 lbs becomes $1,400. Also keep in mind this will be a shared platform, with the RWD sedan where weight is not much of a deal.


So what is it worth to you?

 

I think he's trying to make you mad so that you can yell, "The Camaro is coming, its gonna weigh 3564 lbs, and here's a pic!"


Thats some cool information. To me, if at all posible (but probably not), I would like to get one without an A/C / heater. I don't like them for some reason and I'm a young guy. You'd think i'd be spoil senseless and not be able to do without seat warmers, but I guess not.
Personally, I'm in love with this interior, especially the seatbelts and stearing wheel.
http://img58.imageshack.us/my.php?im...ocruzinter.jpg

 

Um I was referring to this THREAD.... specifially the comments on WEIGHT. But thanks for pointing out what I already knew, captain obvious.

 

Right on all counts.

To add my 2 cents worth on some things (without getting deleted )

* The 5th gen won't be lighter than the 4th gen.
Why? IRS and a body structure that's engineered to handle a godawful amount of power. Hint: what's the most horsepower that GM currently has in a production vehicle.

* What's under the body of the "Design Study" as Charlie said won't exactly be what we'll get. This car is a Design Study. Its being made to get reaction & feedback to it's looks.

* It's going to be about the same size of the Mustang, but it may appear larger. The long wheelbase and relatively modest length (like the Velite) is rumored to throw the size a bit (perhaps why the fear that the car's too large).

*It's going to be one Bada** ride when it comes out by every account.

 

In a heartbeat - it is well worth it to me. It might not be worth it to you, you, you or you.....but I'll be spending my money, not yours, yours, yours, or yours.

I just think it is people expressing their opinion - just like you are expressing yours. Their opinion is no more right, wrong, better, or worse than your opinion. Or mine.

Sounds like a redesigned Chevy version of the current GTO (sounds like...not implying it is).

And finally...I think it is ok to disagree with someone, even if that someone is at the top of the ladder (perceived or real).