I think this is the case to an extent also and is hurting the Cobra. When a car serves as both your bread and butter mass production sales cow and your niche market high performance icon, there are bound to be compromises. Maybe a separate "Cobra" model is in order to better take on the Corvette and appeal to those buyers who do not want the $17k rental car interior of the base Mustang.

As it stands, it is aligned (in price and capablities) against the GTO in the high performance grand touring coupe category. I'd consider the 350Z, G35, and even 3Series/M3 their rivals in this arena. To me anyways, it's a bit short of the competition in the areas already mentioned.

 

You were doing so good carrying on a mature conversation with me until this.

I'm not gonna respond to that comment (as I have about 1000 times before). You see, you just did it again... scrutinizing the car for it's capabilities. I have NEVER seen a car so brutally scrutinized as this one. Just realize that the more scrutiny it gets, and overcomes, the larger the legend will be, so keep spewing that crap Brer Rabbit!

Thanks for living up to my expectations.

 

I'm sure come Nov. the car will have tail pipes coming out from both sides, remember they are still calling the GTOs that have been shown "concepts"

 

After reading this whole thread, ive came up with a few thoughts.

First off, Im pretty sure that every 04 GTO will be sold. Scoops or not. Next, I really admire the understated and nice looks of the GTO. Lately, many of the performance cars that have come out, have had all kinds of scoops, spoilers etc. The GTO is a classy yet powerful looking car, without a bunch of useless scoops and vents. The GTO is definatley marketed to a more mature and affluent crowd than cars like The SRT-4. The 04 GTO is a different car than the original GTO's, yet the spirit remains, good looks, nice interior, and plenty of power under the hood. Let's face it, the new GTO is not marketed at the same type of people the original was (those are the people who would buy a Civic Si or WRX today). Nor is it marketed only to diehard fans of the original. It's a car for people that want a mature, yet muscular coupe, with a legenday reputation.

 

last year,motor trend ran the cobra against the M3 and a maserati,and the cobra came out pretty good,offering similar or better performance for much less money,but was knocked for its lack of refinement and low-rent interior.an M3 is pretty damn good company to be keeping for a lowly blue oval.

 

So why did they use the GTO nameplate? And what would you guess would be the demographics of those old GTO owners?

It's a Monaro and should have been called as such....there's no shame in that......the ONLY reason to use a legendary nameplate is to try and use that legend to sell cars...to people who knew WTF a GTO was.........and to say otherwise is a blatant lie......

 

Hi there Doug 'ol buddy! Pleasure having you 'round about now.

Well friend, here we are, still at, 7 months later...

I can't tell you how badly I'd like to meet up and invert a couple beer containers with you right about now...

 

I like what I'm hearing, but I think this arguement can also apply to the Mustang "Cobra" nameplate. To me, a Cobra is an AC Cobra, an awesome hybrid of a hand-built British sports car and top-notch Ford mechanicals. The "Mustang Cobra" began with the Mustang II, and was revived in the final years of the Fox-platform Mustang. Unless you can argue that the name is a homage to the old Cobra Jet 428 engine, this is a definite example of name exploitation.

Comments aside, you have to respect Colleti for what he's finally accomplished with the '03 Mustang Cobra. This is a car with a defined purpose and customer base. Think of it as a moderately upscale production car, and its just awful. However, as a fully waranteed factory alternative to Roush or Saleen modified cars, its brilliant. In that light, any reasonable person can forgive a "borrowed" MN-12 rear suspension, or bargain-basement Mustang roots. If any Mustang has ever deserved a Cobra badge, this is the one.

On the other hand, the new GTO isn't as focused or distinctive. From where I stand, this car could have just as easily been called a Buick Riviera T-Type. Lutz is relying upon the GTO nameplate to give the Monaro instant marketing credibility. I can see why Colleti refered to this car as a "Cavalier," because much like the original J-platform Chevy, this car looks like it could have be marketed by any GM subsidiary or division. (For reference, the J-car was sold as a Chevrolet, Pontiac, Oldsmobile, Buick, Cadillac, Isuzu, Holden, Opel and Vauxhall.) I suspect that most of us criticised GM "badge-engineering" back in the 1980s. Suddenly, with the F-body gone and our GM performance option decreasing, we've all become hypocrites. I'd like to thank Colleti for his comment. I guess I needed reminding, even if that probably wasn't the intention behind his trash talk.

 

That's an interesting point you bring up. I also find it interesting that the top-of-the-line Mach 1 in the late 60's is now a mid-level V8 trim package. With all the howling of the Z28 guys, why is the new Mach 1 positioning not protested in Ford's camp? Sure it's got some uniqueness compared to GT but the fact remains that the name Mach 1 is being used on a less desireable Mustang when compared to Cobra.

Sorry to get off topic.....

 

The Mach1 was not top of the line, and was offered with several different engine displacements (351C, 351W, 390, 428). The Shelby and Boss Mustangs were really the top of the line. Mustang GT's also existed through 1969. The Mach really fits almost the same niche today - with the Saleen and Cobra Mustangs occupying the old Boss/Shelby levels. This is why there is no "howling" among Ford fans.

Also, the new Mach1 is not a "trim package". It includes a unique engine (It is not the cobra engine) and other performance upgrades.

 

Haven't had the time to come onto the site in the past two weeks...and have not read this entire thread....

but one thing strikes me...

This is from the fellow (or company) that advertised 320hp?????

 

actually,the "mustang cobra" began with the '65 shelbys,they were promoted as a mustang mixed with a cobra.starting with '67,there were no mustang badges,horses,or a mustang name found on the shelby and in '68-'70,the shelbys were simply promoted as a COBRA GT350 or GT500,you also had the torino cobras and cobra jet mustangs from '68 to '73,then you had the decal-powered cobras from '76 to '81,take a 11 year break and you got the '93 cobra,so you basically got a cobra name of some kind in the ford line-up since '65.none match the original AC 260/289/427 cobras,but name exploitation?i say no.the GTO,that's name exploitation,30 years since your last goat,and GM comes out a half-hearted badge-engineered import with your very basic pontiac styling(slap a split-grill on it,sprinke some arrowheads and we're done).it's a rush job,sure lutz can say retro is easy,but how much easier is it to slap a GTO badge on an dull-looking import?

 

By "top of the line" I guess I meant the 428 Mach 1 was the highest horsepower Mustang available. That obviously isn't the case today. Now if you wanted the best handling Mustang you bought the small block Boss. The drag racers bought Mach 1's. Today you have to buy the Cobra to get both drag racing and handling supremacy. Any way you slice it, that makes Mach 1 less desireable.

 

Ouch that's hitting Coletti blow the belt I wonder what a 99' Cobra's resale value is anyway?

 

There we go!!