How can they be already sold?

I dont think that is possible.

 

To the dealerships. They've been alotted (sold) and some have been "ordered" (read: reserved for rich friends). I could be wrong, but I believe I read somewhere that only SVT dealerships are getting them.

 

Actually, it was your attitude that prompted the response. I must really be pushing your buttons without even realizing it...

Paper Tiger is cool too. I've actually been called that before, so it doesn't bother me I fear you've misunderstood most of what I was trying to get across. I merely gave an opinion based on past history and current thinking. Fact is, the GT is a badass car whether you like it or not. Whatever your problem with me is, it sounds like a personal issue, and not mine. If you've got a specific issue with something I've typed, tell me what part and I'll try to explain it.

People can compare whatever they like. But, as I mentioned above, we still know very little about the Blue Devil and bench racing means nothing. I'm sure that IF the Blue Devil is produced, it will also be one badass car. I could care very little if it's twice as fast as the GT and handles twice as well. My point was that it's just a faster Corvette and while special in its own way, the fact that there are other Vettes out there only take away from its uniqueness.

Would that high horse be a Mustang? But seriously, if I post facts, I'll post them as such. I don't think I've done anything here that you are anyone else hasn't done.

You have your opinion and that's cool. I'm going by what I'm reading on other forums where other exotic owners are. BTW, I HOPE the Blue Devil looks different that other Vettes. But as I mentioned farther up this thread, what's to keep a Z06 owner from putting the same body kit on his Vette and making it look like a Blue Devil? It would be a lot easier for someone to do that than someone to make a GT look-a-like or Ferrari look-a-like.

Never said that. Just read what I'm typing. It's not that insane and hard to believe.

As has been mentioned by someone else, the GT doesn't weigh 3700lbs, the Cobra Mustang does. Considering it's nipping the heals of Z06 Vettes that weigh 600lbs lighter than it, it's very impressive. The weight difference between the GT and Blue Devil will most likely be less than that, but we don't know for sure.

I wouldn't call the the GT overpriced, but it's more than I can afford But then again, the Blue Devil most likely will be too. We just don't know enough about the Blue Devil yet to call it exotic. At this point MY OPINION is that it's not exotic because it's not unique enough FROM WHAT WE KNOW. For others, I'm sure it's exotic. Further information may change my opinion. I'm ruling nothing out.

BTW, my GM friends will tell you that I was seriously considering buying a Z06. I think it looks good, goes fast and it a nice car for the money. Some people on this board seem to think I hate GM, this is not the case...

 

Ah.

I did not realize Ford had done the dealer allocations yet.

 

My SVT dealer is getting one, only one. I've not heard of anyone getting more than two per year so far. One dealership (I think in Alabama) is getting two. They're keeping one for their showroom and auctioning the other off to charity. Must be nice!

 

Actually let me be clear I am not down on the GT. I am actually impressed to a degree. Impressed that Ford would build it. Impressed that it would ignite GM to retaliate.

There are some key things I don't care for. The curb weight is 3400 (Motortrend Jan 04) for one. (So I was off by 200, but 3400lbs still means the BD gets a 500lb advantage, which is HUGE in handling and acceleration, 100lbs is roughly equivalent to 10hp, so that's 50hp the BD makes up on weight alone). The required use of the supercharger to get the power levels needed (I think a car like this getting beat on repeatedly around a track is going to have some durability problems at that HP level with a supercharger). And lastly the price.

Now, $153K (Motortrend January 04) is surely a bargain in the world of supercars, and I understand with a total run of 3500 there's not a lot of volume to spread costs over, but you can buy Ferrari's for under $200,000 that are hand built. The GT is also hand built but takes advantage of tons of off-the-shelf Ford products like seat adjusters, steering columns, windshield washer motors, etc. etc. etc.

I would expect the economies of scale there to bring the price down. However, I guess when all the cars are already spoken for one could even make the case that it is underpriced for the market.

But, my "attitude" about the Blue Devil comes from the fact that we do know it will have a better power to weight ratio than the GT and it will be substantially cheaper.

So the GM detractors can only come up with two arguments...1. It's going to look plain even though nobody knows what it will look like yet and 2. Its not a real "exotic" because its just a Corvette in the end.

Last time I checked 575hp was > than 550hp
Last time I checked 2900lb curb weight was < 3400

Check out the test Motortrend did VS the Viper. For double the price its not as impressive as it should be. For double the price I'd expect more than 50 more HP, inferior braking, & roughly equal performance (I understand MT's test car had only supposedly 500hp).

If we are comparing a not yet existing car to the GT on subjective things like which is more "exotic", I guess I'll have to ceed the argument to Paper Target. If we are comparing based on factual data of what is known about both cars, I think from what we know so far the BD will be all the GT can handle at 1/3rd the price, which I think burns the ford guys up.

 

That's cool. From what I'm seeing so far, I think the Blue Devil will be faster and handle better than the GT. I think one of the problems that Ford had with making a new GT is that they wanted it to look like the old one. This limited what they could do in several areas. And you're right, MT's car was only the 500 HP GT. Car & Driver got their hands on the 550 HP version which they ran 0-60 in 3.3 and 1/4 in 11.6. I still don't think the Blue Devil will be 1/3 of the price though. My opinion is that it will be north of $100k because of the way other car companies have done these kinds of cars in the past.

 

11.6 is better but still only .2 faster than the Viper for twice the price.

Not saying that is the only measure of a car..performance...because it's not. The pure nostalgia of the GT alone cannot be ignored, and you are right, it limited what they could do with the car.

But I did see some stuff on TV about it, particularly about how they basically flipped the front suspension to make more footroom inside the car. There clearly are some things Ford did really well with it.

You may be right, the BD may come in at $125,000...still a whole well optioned Camry cheaper than the GT, but like I said it will be moot because all the GTs will be sold at that point I'm sure.

But both cars are going to have a hard time in the Magazines separating themselves enough from the Viper to make them look like good deals.

 

What makes a car "exotic"?? Exclusivity?? high price?? All in the eye of the beholder?? Not arguing at all, just curious...

 

I agree. The Z06 is already a tremendous deal. The Viper is one step up and is a good deal too. The GT is pricier than I wished it was (base is $139,000). It's a lot of car for the money, but others may find the Viper a better deal. Once you get over $100k then money really doesn't seem to matter much anymore as the people that can afford these cars have more than they can spend.

Personally, I think that $125k for the Blue Devil will be a decent price for the type of car that it will be. It too will be a Ferrari slayer and will most likely slay a few GTs too I'm impressed that GM and Ford are building cars like these. It's about time American companies got out there and duked it out with the Europeans.

I can't wait for the Magazines to get all three at the strip and track!

 

Agreed. I think the trap everyone is falling into is a bang-for-the-buck argument, which at the price levels we are discussing is really irrelevant.

These cars are going to be sold to people with deep pockets and an urge for a toy or collector's item. Very few will ever be raced or even driven for that matter more than probably 1000 mi. a year.

These cars are going to be like owning a Minor League Baseball team...you can't really make any money at it but you buy it for bragging rights.

The GT probably was not priced based on cost, it was priced based on what they knew the market would support. I would bet they are making a healthy profit on each car simply because buyers are willing to pay it.

 

I believe Bill Ford made it a requirement that the car make a profit. I'm pretty sure they have. I think the dealers will be the ones making the most though with the auctioning of the cars that aren't spoken for.

 

Actually, from things I have read on the GT, I don't think it will make a profit for Ford.

Ford had to develop some expensive new technologies for the cars aluminum structure, platform, and bodywork. With only being able to amortize over 3500 units, it will be hard to show a profit.

The "profit" they are looking for is recognition, respect, and a draw into the showroom.

One Ferrari guy, who seems to be in the know on these cars, seems to think that the car will get the N/A V10 for the last model year.............. at 600+hp.

I guess we will have to see.

I also have a tendency to think that Ford is sandbagging on the performance of these cars. They throw these non factory spec, preproduction cars out there for the magazines to test............. just to wet peoples appetite, and to gain instant basic respectability in the exotic car market. Then they hit them with the production car that performs even better.

Think about it............ it takes more than 550 flywheel hp to run 212mpg in a 3360lb car. The Viper is within 50hp, weighs about the same, and can't even hit 200mph. What it takes to gain 1mph once you hit 200 is a whole hell of a lot more than what it takes to go from 150-160.

Anyway, we shall see. My husband is checking market value on our 2-year-old to try to get one (joking of course........... however it is our screensave, and there are pictures all over of the car).

Oh, top award Ford dealerships were automatically allocated 1 car. The rest of the dealerships entered a lottery for the chance to win an allocation.

 

I heard that Ford is not making a proft off the cars, but making a halo car so to draw in more sales for other cars. I heard Ford loses money on each GT. I read in MT or C&D that they would have to sell the car at near 200k to break even. Just what I heard... dont jump down my throat.

and here in NJ, Downs Ford has at least 1 GT. I talked to the owner of the dealership saturday night. He said the car is insane. They arent gunna sell it.

 

That's part of it. Exclusivity for sure. High price helps with that. Performance from the factory (anyone could make a Mustang or Camaro perform like or better than many exotic cars). Location, some cars are just more exotic depending on where you live. A good example is the Vette. Not very exotic here in the states, but in Europe it is much more exotic. Based on this criteria, I believe the Blue Devil could be exotic in Europe, I just don't see it being exotic here in the states (from what I know so far). Some of it is "in the eye of the beholder" and that's ok too. Limited production is part of it. But I think uniqueness is the biggest factor to me. That's why I don't see the Blue Devil as a true exotic. It's being built on a known platform, a known car which most don't consider an exotic. To me a similar comparison is taking a Camaro and giving it a carbon fiber body, aluminum frame, body kit to destinguish it somewhat from other Camaros, giving it a great interior, reduced weight and a really powerful engine. Sure, it'll be a badass Camaro, but in the end, what's really unique about it? What makes it an exotic? In my opinion, that's how Ferrari and other exotic owners will see this car. Even the Viper isn't considered exotic by many people. Strange I think, though for some reason I don't see the Viper as exotic either. It fits the criteria for the most part, I like it, but why don't others feel that it's exotic either? I really don't know. Many Porches aren't considered exotic either. Some are like the 959 and GT2 (I hope that's the one I'm thinking of). Most Ferraris are considered exotic as well as Lamborghinis. Tell me what you think.