Maybe not but '11 Mustang has a host of performance options including diff ratios, bigger wheels, etc... that they can supply for test purposes. Camaro comes in just one flavor.

 

They sure are. We'll see if GM can deliver.

The reason expectations are so high is that we have afew knowns.

1) It will be smaller than the current Camaro. Everyone I've talked to says "3 series sized".

2) It will be substantially lighter than the current Camaro. How much so is speculation, but I wouldn't be surprised at a 35xx pound V8.

3) The crosshairs for it's chassis dynamics are on the BMW 3 series and Mark Reuss even stated that they are spending the money and time to get the steering "feel" just right.

4) I CANNOT wait to see the final powertrain configurations for the architecture.

All of those things would by default make an Alpha Camaro a better Camaro.



Don't be so touchy - we're all friends here.

 

Alpha is vaporware untill prototypes are on the street. That fact that "package protecting" is still being discussed tells me that several decision impacting weight, cost, and flexibility have yet to be made.

As for Zeta..I am not saying it is the perfect pony car platform. I am saying it is suitable for what most people need out of a Camaro. With minimal investment and work in weight reduction it could serve the Camaro nameplate for a while if Alpha misses it's targets. It is certainly not the oversize dumptruck wearing a 69 Camaro costume some people make it out to be.

On another note..with hybrid, and battery powered cars becoming the rage..I think weight is gonna be here to stay. Batteries and the structures to support them are heavy. We will be lucky to have most cars maintain weight. There won't be no magic bullet where a lot of weight is lost like early 80's.

 

Hardly vaporware. You'll see a concept in about 6 months - give or take.

As far as "package protecting" still being discussed, well that ship sailed years ago....

 

Yes and No. Take the US-bound Ute. It was hitting car shows when it got axed. By contrast, once the development has gone so far that there are body in white studies done, most of the major design work is done. The Camaro Z28 has been DONE for a while now - but sits on the bench. Nothing is solid till you can actually order one.

While we sit here talk about package protecting.... aw man. I got beaten to the punch. We're talking about it - but the decisions have long since been signed off on.
I'd much rather have a G8 GXP to a Camaro SS. Not because the G8 handles better (cause it doesn't) or because it looks better (cause it doesn't) or because it's faster (cause it isn't) or that it's even much better build quality (cause it isn't!) but for ONE thing - the way it feels. Somehow, the Aussie spirit of the Camaro got plastered over by American "dynamics" and it just doesn't quite give me the same smile factor. The steering on the Camaro is more numb and it feels like I'm just a smidge more disconnected from the road than I am in the G8. Mind you, the 5th gen is awesome to drive - but I'd expect every "sport" part of it to be better than the G8, and every part is but the wheel. The weight really doesn't bother me that much.

So hearing Reuss talk about how critical steering is for alpha - that raises my hopes. GM wants to take on the 3 series, which is pretty much the king.

 

That all sounds great. Whatever size we choose to call it, I think the 3 series is a great size for a second-half-of-the-'teens Camaro. I hope it comes with better visibility, but the styling of the current model is so popular, and the small windows are so much a part of that, I suspect they may keep the turret looks.




Okay, okay

 

I wonder how much of that is the 20s. The G8 never went bigger than 19s, and I'm pretty sure 20s were added for one reason only, and that reason had nothing to do with handling qualities.

It'd be interesting to see someone evaluate the GXP wheels and tires on the Camaro.

 

Concept really does not matter much..concept Camaro had zero to do with production Camaro in terms of platform. Again..untill you see mules on the road, nothing is set in stone.

 

Are you saying that you don't think Alpha is coming?

 

Darn those high expectations. We should all expect GM to aim lower.

 

Gm is the one setting the expectations with this chassis . The select few doubters on here making it sound seemingly impossible to deliver the goods . Let the weight wars begin finally

 

Just my personal take, and I could be wrong, but it's the way I see it..


I think some people have a heavy emotional investment in Zeta. They bought into all the initial internet hyperbole on it's incredible graces and now find themselves in the unexpected position of Zeta (for Camaro) defenders.
The mention...even the very thought...that something might be coming, which will be better than Zeta for Camaro is seen as personal threat to their emotional investment in it.

Let's call it: Zeta derangement syndrome. (ZDR)


ZDR: No automotive architecture can be better, cheaper, more flexible, have better chassis dynamics, be easier to produce, have a better business plan, be more fulfilling, grow larger breasts, in ANY automotive application globally for the next 20 years. Anyone who deviates from this belief should be quickly liquidated.


I could be wrong though...

 

FWIW, I do not want a BMW 3-sized Camaro. In fact, I am perfectly happy with the size of the Zeta Camaro. While I would prefer that it were a tad lighter, I'd much rather see GM work on improving the Zeta Camaro than starting over from scratch on a smaller vehicle, especially when all is said and done that will be only a few pounds lighter than Zeta, much smaller and cost a lot more.

That said, I am not against Alpha or even the idea of an Alpha-based coupe. I just don't think it needs to be a "Camaro". Quite frankly, IMHO that Alpha needs Camaro, more than Camaro needs Alpha. In fact, I think forcing the Alpha coupe to be a "Camaro" might actually hurt its development. GM should focus on improving the Camaro they already have before they throw the baby out with the bathwater and start over.

 

I'm sort of on the flip side. I wouldn't mind seeing Camaro's Zeta 2 architecture carrying on to something other than the Camaro. Of course, the business case for that is very weak and once the 5th gen is gone, all further Zeta development will be handled by Holden or GM Asia and whatever we get here will be imported.

 

Who are these 'some people'? I haven't seen anyone come close to calling Zeta the best possible platform ever for a Camaro.

Okay now you're really being silly.