Gt500: Loses weight, get's faster avoids gas guzzler tax.
02-10-2010, 07:53 AM
#61
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Payson, AZ USA
Posts: 1,181
I really haven't seen that in this thread. There are plenty of people who are excited by the GT500. And while there are some that question the extent of the improvement and accomplishment, I've not seen any significant trollage.
Sure there are a couple of people questioning the weight reduction, and the health of the Ford horses. But it's been respectful, I think, and not ad hominem. In fact, I think I've seen at least as much criticism of the Camaro as the Mustang in this thread.
Sure there are a couple of people questioning the weight reduction, and the health of the Ford horses. But it's been respectful, I think, and not ad hominem. In fact, I think I've seen at least as much criticism of the Camaro as the Mustang in this thread.
Frankly, this is just a much more mature crowd. This is part of the reason that I enjoy this site so much.
02-10-2010, 07:58 AM
#62
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Sterling Heights, MI
Posts: 6,166
You can option up a GT500 that high - a quick search found that MSRP on a GT500 droptop is north of $53k.
At that point, I'm buying Corvette all day long (though I understand why there is a certain market that wouldn't). Therein lies the problem with an uber-pricey Camaro though - it has to share the same showroom with the Vette.
At that point, I'm buying Corvette all day long (though I understand why there is a certain market that wouldn't). Therein lies the problem with an uber-pricey Camaro though - it has to share the same showroom with the Vette.
Last edited by Z28Wilson; 02-10-2010 at 08:01 AM.
02-10-2010, 08:06 AM
#63
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 1,217
Have you priced one lately!?! It can get there real quick.
'11 GT500 Coupe (including Destination & Delivery) MSRP = $49,495.
'11 GT500 Convertible (including Destination & Delivery) MSRP = $54,495.
Optional equipment....
$2,340 = Electronics Package
$3,495 = SVT Performance Package
$1,295 = Shaker 1000 Audio System
$1,995 = Glass Roof
$ 375 = Shelby Car Cover
SVT PERFORMANCE PACKAGE – (67F)��
• Includes:
— 3.73 Limited Slip Rear Axle
— Unique 19'x9.5"(F) 20"x10"(R) Painted Forged
Aluminum Wheel
— P265/40ZR19(F) P285/35ZR20(R) Tires
— Unique Front and Rear Springs
— Unique Rear Shocks
— Unique Gear Shift ****
— Unique Shelby Stripes
— Unique Side Stripes
— Spoiler with Unique Gurney Flap
The GT500 is priced right with the Corvette now and a few options put you at base M3 cost. Loaded up, its almost at base CTS-V price.
Now perhaps the lighterweight, better balance, stickier tires (all we will see compared at first will be SVT optioned cars) and slight bump in power means it will be deserving of its price. I think it will, but time will tell.
'11 GT500 Coupe (including Destination & Delivery) MSRP = $49,495.
'11 GT500 Convertible (including Destination & Delivery) MSRP = $54,495.
Optional equipment....
$2,340 = Electronics Package
$3,495 = SVT Performance Package
$1,295 = Shaker 1000 Audio System
$1,995 = Glass Roof
$ 375 = Shelby Car Cover
SVT PERFORMANCE PACKAGE – (67F)��
• Includes:
— 3.73 Limited Slip Rear Axle
— Unique 19'x9.5"(F) 20"x10"(R) Painted Forged
Aluminum Wheel
— P265/40ZR19(F) P285/35ZR20(R) Tires
— Unique Front and Rear Springs
— Unique Rear Shocks
— Unique Gear Shift ****
— Unique Shelby Stripes
— Unique Side Stripes
— Spoiler with Unique Gurney Flap
The GT500 is priced right with the Corvette now and a few options put you at base M3 cost. Loaded up, its almost at base CTS-V price.
Now perhaps the lighterweight, better balance, stickier tires (all we will see compared at first will be SVT optioned cars) and slight bump in power means it will be deserving of its price. I think it will, but time will tell.
02-10-2010, 10:06 AM
#64
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: SoCal
Posts: 3,463
Personally I think there are several factors in why Chevy hasn't released a 550+ HP, 4000 lb, high $40k Camaro yet. I think the least is actually making money on it.
02-10-2010, 10:15 AM
#65
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Coppell, Texas
Posts: 1,215
For the record, I wasn't advocating that GM should/could try to go with my scenario, I just think that the longer they wait on releasing a car that's just sitting on the shelf, the less sense it makes to release it at all. Especially if its going to be bringing a knife to a gunfight. Probably be best at this point to just wait till the alpha 6th gen to bring back the Z/28.
02-10-2010, 11:23 AM
#66
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Hemlock, Mich.
Posts: 329
You can option up a GT500 that high - a quick search found that MSRP on a GT500 droptop is north of $53k.
At that point, I'm buying Corvette all day long (though I understand why there is a certain market that wouldn't). Therein lies the problem with an uber-pricey Camaro though - it has to share the same showroom with the Vette.
At that point, I'm buying Corvette all day long (though I understand why there is a certain market that wouldn't). Therein lies the problem with an uber-pricey Camaro though - it has to share the same showroom with the Vette.
The biggest reason I picked the Shelby over the Vette. One is 3 years old and the other is 7 months. How do you pick which son goes for a ride with dad?
02-10-2010, 12:04 PM
#67
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 1,217
I would have bought a Vette, but have you added options to one of those? I dont need any of the options that Ford offers. Glass roof, not for me. Big bumping subs, maybe when I was 16. Navigation, I will just use my $150 tom tom. The SVT package will ride very harsh, I am certain the base car will fullfill my needs. I am glad they dont even offer heated seats in this car.
The biggest reason I picked the Shelby over the Vette. One is 3 years old and the other is 7 months. How do you pick which son goes for a ride with dad?
The biggest reason I picked the Shelby over the Vette. One is 3 years old and the other is 7 months. How do you pick which son goes for a ride with dad?
The electronics package is a nice option on the GT500's though. I'm seeing used one's, even 08's with low miles, in the low $30's now. Very nice! The other great buy out there if you need 4-doors is a STS-V.
Last edited by ZZtop; 02-10-2010 at 12:08 PM.
02-10-2010, 12:15 PM
#68
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 3,650
I would have bought a Vette, but have you added options to one of those? I dont need any of the options that Ford offers. Glass roof, not for me. Big bumping subs, maybe when I was 16. Navigation, I will just use my $150 tom tom. The SVT package will ride very harsh, I am certain the base car will fullfill my needs. I am glad they dont even offer heated seats in this car.
The biggest reason I picked the Shelby over the Vette. One is 3 years old and the other is 7 months. How do you pick which son goes for a ride with dad?
The biggest reason I picked the Shelby over the Vette. One is 3 years old and the other is 7 months. How do you pick which son goes for a ride with dad?
I don't have kids yet, but we are planning to go that route sometime. This is what keeps me from splurging for a nice C5 ragtop to replace my Camaro when the time comes. I have been looking quite a bit lately at '05-'07 Mustang GT droptops, which I also love.
I'd love to have a Vette (Dad has a red '01 six speed convertible), but with a kid, it becomes a car I'd pretty much only get to enjoy solo. Any time the wife and I would go somewhere, I wouldn't be able to say "let's take the Vette" unless the kid is with grandparents or a sitter.
It's not necessarily a done deal, however, as even with my current car, my wife rarely rides in it. It could turn out that when we go somewhere as a "family," she'll only want to take the family truckster (whatever that ends up being) and not the toy car. Not just for a longer drive out of town, but maybe even for local stuff. In that situation, the Vette would serve just as well.
I'm pretty torn about it, especially since you can find '01 - '02 C5s with low miles that are priced similarly to '06 - '07 Mustang GTs with similar miles. I love both cars, and while I know the Vette is the superior platform and a true sports car, the Stang is just hot to look at and is still very fun to drive.
*sigh*
02-10-2010, 12:27 PM
#69
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Payson, AZ USA
Posts: 1,181
In the end, if you have the kids, I would think a Vette would just sit, most of the time.
Wait until your kids get a few years older, and even the youngest is begging to go for a ride with Daddy. Then what do you do?? Break one kids heart??? Strap one on the roof??? Look at the wife, and say "sorry, you don't rank today???
The vehicle that will seat your family, will get the use. The other will just sit there, and look pretty.
Wait until your kids get a few years older, and even the youngest is begging to go for a ride with Daddy. Then what do you do?? Break one kids heart??? Strap one on the roof??? Look at the wife, and say "sorry, you don't rank today???
The vehicle that will seat your family, will get the use. The other will just sit there, and look pretty.
02-10-2010, 12:46 PM
#70
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Middle of Kansas
Posts: 2,688
In the end, if you have the kids, I would think a Vette would just sit, most of the time.
Wait until your kids get a few years older, and even the youngest is begging to go for a ride with Daddy. Then what do you do?? Break one kids heart??? Strap one on the roof??? Look at the wife, and say "sorry, you don't rank today???
The vehicle that will seat your family, will get the use. The other will just sit there, and look pretty.
Wait until your kids get a few years older, and even the youngest is begging to go for a ride with Daddy. Then what do you do?? Break one kids heart??? Strap one on the roof??? Look at the wife, and say "sorry, you don't rank today???
The vehicle that will seat your family, will get the use. The other will just sit there, and look pretty.
02-10-2010, 12:46 PM
#71
Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 3,650
In the end, if you have the kids, I would think a Vette would just sit, most of the time.
Wait until your kids get a few years older, and even the youngest is begging to go for a ride with Daddy. Then what do you do?? Break one kids heart??? Strap one on the roof??? Look at the wife, and say "sorry, you don't rank today???
The vehicle that will seat your family, will get the use. The other will just sit there, and look pretty.
Wait until your kids get a few years older, and even the youngest is begging to go for a ride with Daddy. Then what do you do?? Break one kids heart??? Strap one on the roof??? Look at the wife, and say "sorry, you don't rank today???
The vehicle that will seat your family, will get the use. The other will just sit there, and look pretty.
I do tend to drive the Camaro to work (except for 4 months out of the year or so
), so on work days I'd still get to take my "toy" car at least fairly often.The thing is, I like the Mustang quite a bit too, so it wouldn't necessarily be like "settling". I'm not a road course racer or auto crosser, so it isn't like I have to have the Vette's outstanding handling capability to enjoy tossing the car through the occasional curve. What I WOULD miss, however, is the LSx engine family.
I've gone so far as to look into Kenne Bell superchargers for the 3V 4.6L, and simply bolting one of those on nets you around LS7 hp (500+ flywheel). But those kits are nearly $6k, and I'm such a cheap ***, I can already see myself putting that off indefinitely.
I'm way ahead of myself, obviously, since I still have my LT1 that I've owned for over 7 years now.
02-10-2010, 12:52 PM
#72
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: Coppell, Texas
Posts: 1,215
In the end, if you have the kids, I would think a Vette would just sit, most of the time.
Wait until your kids get a few years older, and even the youngest is begging to go for a ride with Daddy. Then what do you do?? Break one kids heart??? Strap one on the roof??? Look at the wife, and say "sorry, you don't rank today???
The vehicle that will seat your family, will get the use. The other will just sit there, and look pretty.
Wait until your kids get a few years older, and even the youngest is begging to go for a ride with Daddy. Then what do you do?? Break one kids heart??? Strap one on the roof??? Look at the wife, and say "sorry, you don't rank today???
The vehicle that will seat your family, will get the use. The other will just sit there, and look pretty.
02-10-2010, 01:45 PM
#73
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Payson, AZ USA
Posts: 1,181
I understand that. If the Vette was the ONLY car that he was interested in, then it would be a different story, as he would have already weighed the pros and cons.
However, he has already stated that the Mustang is high on his list also.
If you can make the entire family happy, at the same time, and not "settle," in your own mind, then where is the choice of the Mustang, wrong??
BTW, if my husband came home with a 2-seater, I would be angry. See, we are a family of 3, and go everywhere together. I sold my '94 Lightning (which I loved dearly, and is the only vehicle I have owned, that I regret getting rid of, every single day), when Corey was born, because it was a 2-seater. I was not willing to make it not stock, to accomodate my son............... so I got to sell it to someone who flew 3000 miles to buy it, and who would appreciate it.
I understand that every family is different, however.
That said, every time my 7-year-old sees a GT500, he about jumps out of the window in excitement. This is the ONLY vehicle that he does that with (well, except a Ford GT which is rarely seen). So, one isn't sacrificing much in attention getting, with the Mustang.
However, he has already stated that the Mustang is high on his list also.
If you can make the entire family happy, at the same time, and not "settle," in your own mind, then where is the choice of the Mustang, wrong??
BTW, if my husband came home with a 2-seater, I would be angry. See, we are a family of 3, and go everywhere together. I sold my '94 Lightning (which I loved dearly, and is the only vehicle I have owned, that I regret getting rid of, every single day), when Corey was born, because it was a 2-seater. I was not willing to make it not stock, to accomodate my son............... so I got to sell it to someone who flew 3000 miles to buy it, and who would appreciate it.
I understand that every family is different, however.
That said, every time my 7-year-old sees a GT500, he about jumps out of the window in excitement. This is the ONLY vehicle that he does that with (well, except a Ford GT which is rarely seen). So, one isn't sacrificing much in attention getting, with the Mustang.
02-10-2010, 02:52 PM
#74
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Santa Clara, CA
Posts: 3,132
Agreed, but don't forget that the CTS-V is 300-400 pounds heavier than the GT500 and competes with or beats it on the track (1/4 mile and roadcourse). Now thats a 2010 GT500 and we will have to see what the 2011 GT500 does. So a 4000 pound S/C Camaro would be a relative lightweight (haha) to the CTS-V which is already kicking **** and taking names.
One of the keys to the CTS-V's success has been traction, both from tires, suspension tunning, and weight balance. Contrary, this is what has hindered the GT500. The 2011 GT500 will have better balance with the aluminum block, but I see no mention of wider or sticker tires on the base model and no mention of control arm changes to correct the wheel hop it suffers from. The SVT package adds some very sticky tires, but the price starts getting really high!!!!
One of the keys to the CTS-V's success has been traction, both from tires, suspension tunning, and weight balance. Contrary, this is what has hindered the GT500. The 2011 GT500 will have better balance with the aluminum block, but I see no mention of wider or sticker tires on the base model and no mention of control arm changes to correct the wheel hop it suffers from. The SVT package adds some very sticky tires, but the price starts getting really high!!!!
Also, don't forget that the CTS-V has a nice gas guzzler tax, which the GT500 is finally doing away with. The Z/28 would have the same tax. I think high prices go with 500+ HP.
I agree that weight is not everything, especially when the percentage differences are in single digits, and Ford could screw up things like the electric power steering (though knowing how big a black eye this would be, I hope they did it right). As it stands at this moment without any third party reviews, the whole 2011 Mustang lineup looks pretty exceptional.
02-10-2010, 03:51 PM
#75
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: South Bend , IN
Posts: 2,801
I understand what you are saying, except for one thing........... the LSA is not a base, "standard" engine. It is the hoity toity, high performance Cadillac engine.
If they made a Z28, that the only basic difference was the luxury features, and 2 doors (meaning that it would handle just as well, as everyone here seems to think)............ and made it $20K less than a CTSV.......... as a CTSV customer, I would be pissed.
Standard, run of the mill CTS, having the same engine as standard, run of the mill Camaro............ not so big of a deal.
If they made a Z28, that the only basic difference was the luxury features, and 2 doors (meaning that it would handle just as well, as everyone here seems to think)............ and made it $20K less than a CTSV.......... as a CTSV customer, I would be pissed.
Standard, run of the mill CTS, having the same engine as standard, run of the mill Camaro............ not so big of a deal.