I agree with this. When you think about it what is there that hasn't been done before or really merits advanced tech. There were some guys that were able to really make you think and give you another point of view, but they have moved on.

 

I miss Mindgame.

 

I think some of the problem (which was briefly touched on) is that what was once Advanced Tech is now more commonplace and has become just plain old Tech. However, I do think that there is some life to this forum yet. Maybe if we could get some more theory based questions that might possibly dig into a little bit more than just questions related to engines then we could possibly get the juices flowing again. A great example of this would be the thread that Gatorhead posted in the Drag Racing Technique section. It didn't garner much attention in the LT1 tech forum but I think it would do better here.

https://www.camaroz28.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=640599

 

I think you should keep it alive until the new Camaro has been out a while and see if it picks back up. I haven't been around long but I think you do a good job Injuneer. You have helped me more than once and yes I am one with very little experience except what I learn as I go along and read from others here. It really doesn't matter to me either way on this but I do think it may pick up with the new arrival and might bring some new experts with it.

 

Long before I ever posted here I lurked and read many hours worth of old threads. Of course I noticed that some of the guys who seemed most knowledgable no longer post. If I understand the Members List search function correctly, if I can't find their screen name they are no longer able to post here even though there are many of their posts still in the archives. Maybe I'm just doing it wrong.

I looked around at other forums for some of the names missing here and found them. Some even responded to personal contact about why they no longer post here. Banned is the word they used. In some cases everyone knows that certain posters were publicly banned by the administrators, but in other cases I was told that while they were not officially banned, any post they tried to make had to be cleared through an adminstrator and none of them ever made it into a thread. One guy called it backdoor banning. He though it was chicken-stuff that the admins never bothered to tell him directly that he was no longer welcome. He could not even contact the admins because his PM stuff was turned off. If that is true, I tend to agree with him on the CS part.

By the way, the banned bunch of bad boys (BBBB) had no bones to pick with Fred.

As for giving away the farm or proprietary knowledge, I see that on the more open forums some knowledge is shared in a general way but with specific numbers or secrets not mentioned.

I am fortunate enough to get to hang around with some pretty smart engine guys in the course of my shop job. I get to listen to them and occasionally get to ask a question. They often say things similar to what the BBBBs posted when they were still here or what they say on those other forums.

The only thing I can suggest that would put some pee an vinegar back into this forum woud be the return of some of the BBBB. I can't see that happening from either side of the fence. I certainly don't attempt to speak for them. Fred just asked for input. That's about all of mine. Sorry for being so wordy.

Joe Urban

 

Speaking of BBBB. Hi Bret!

As you can see, it's still possible to get around the ban filter, and the 'backdoor' banning Joe speaks of has to be in reference to senior Joe.

Back to the question posed by Fred: The forum is still relevant, if not only just a source of useful information in archive to some folks. New posts, and subsequent discussion, has been few & far between due to a few reasons IMO.

First, the successful and super-resourceful boards have not been model-specific, or cater to a model that is still manufactured/relevant. We all know there hasn't been a Camaro Z28 since 2002 and, ignore it all you want, but the L98 and LT1 platforms will continue the downward decline in development and interest. The LS1 will continue to some degree, but the new GM powerplants are hard to beat for most users - the good part is that we can fit these into the older f-body chassis.

Second, I feel that the F-body LT1/LS1 platform is undergoing 'new ownership'. By that, I mean that the guys who bought/built these cars have moved on to other platforms, hobbies or careers. The result of this, generally, are cars that have been returned to stock and sold to a younger generation, who will hopefully see the potential for a hotrod should gas stay at a reasonable level and not be lured away by the the 'newer and different' platforms that offer better performance, cheaper. The result of this is a group of owners who are likely utilizing the search function much more frequently to gather the information previously discussed for their platform. The curve will come around again for those who are interested in truly pushing the envelope. More power to anyone who finds solace in working within the confines of any 4th generation f-body.

Third, I think that to the guys that are still in it have moved on away from boards that have romper-room antics. The internet has a unique way of taking fiction and making it fact. This, coupled with unsubstantiated bashing, name calling, parroting, 'sponsor privileges', and general 'sheeple' attitudes by those who are afraid to look misinformed, make the truly knowledgeable folks (still in the 'game' so to speak) move on to boards more accommodating and mature. I've noticed that the above scenario has happened to a far lesser extent within this forum, but not so much elsewhere on this and other boards of similar topic. Also, there is some stiff competition as there are some really good boards out there, particularly for the 1st generation models.

Will the forum return to its glory? Hard to say, but I think the long-anticipated release of the Camaro will only refuel interest in the f-body community, both old and new. That can only bode well for this forum IMO.

 

Joe Urban's and SS MPSTR's post seem to have some very valid points/truths. I won't speculate on the reason(s) why some of the more intelligent members have been banned (or have just choosen not to post here anymore) because I don't know specifics regarding most of them, but retrospect, I wonder if both parties have some regrets? With knowledge and wisdom, comes opinion and ego and sometimes it's difficult for them to all peacefully co-exist in an enviroment such as this. The fact is most of us seem to miss the "outside the box" thinkers and maybe there's a lesson to be learned through all of this.

And since it was asked, I do observe a fair amount of "bashing" going on, not only here in advanced tech, but in a lot of other sections of this board from time to time. Sometimes it appears to be due to an "unrealistic" question being asked and sometimes it's just a personality clash or a strong difference of opinions. Where ever the reason, it may be worth re-thinking and/or re-wording what you are about to post. If the post is not "constructive", is it really worth hitting the "enter" key? Additionally, if a member or moderator has a real issue with someone else's opinion, statements or dialectic, there are better ways to deal with their concerns rather than posting negitive comments in the thread.

I believe this section of the forum is an integral part of this board and should be kept, but all parties involved should realize the types of personalities an "Advanced Tech" section will attract.

Maybe in a seperate thread, the question should be asked: how to entice some of the "expert" types to post questions and answers here, since that seems to be what really drives this section of the forum.

 

I think the forum should stay. One thing you also have to remember is that what may seem advanced to some may not seem advanced "enough" to others. The regular LT1/LS1 engine forums are full of questions like "Will this 58mm throttle body help my bone stock motor?" so mant of the questions asked may be a little more advanced than what people in those forums are used to but if theyre asked here, they may seem trivial to some so they're deemed not "advanced enough". I think there is some very good information to be found here and there are still good discussons to be had. JMHO.

 

Keep this Place open! and keep it as is. i really don't see a problem.

It's a perfect place for the natural progression of knowledge. Plus there is such a repository on good answers in. I have found probably 80% of the answers I needed by doing a search, so it's rare for me to need to actually post.

I've been on this board for years. The basic sections are a good place for common questions. And I give Injuneer and Shoebox and the rest allot of credit for always answering all those "which header, what's this code mean” type questions.

I'm on a few other boards and the problem with most high tech question is people want answers that would require a person to almost write a book for the response. Then people get mad if they are told it's not an easy answer.

 

That's a very good point. The more I learn about engines or cars or CNC machining, the more I realize that there are not easy, simple answers to many things especially such complicated things as engine performance. That also means that to understand the real answer to something you must have some background that may involve math and physics beyond the highschool level.

When I took some college science courses it really did help me understand more about how engines and machine tools work. Unfortunately those courses require a lot of work to master. Fortunately there are many good colleges that offer night courses and even degrees.

Joe Urban

 

I have noticed you are replying/answering post in here that do not belong in here.

example:
https://www.camaroz28.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=661699

https://www.camaroz28.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=590550

https://www.camaroz28.com/forums/sho...38#post5565838

https://www.camaroz28.com/forums/sho...65#post5791365

shouldnt these post get moved to the correct forum (along with a helpful reply from you)

i think that nonadvanced tech stuff should be moved to the correct forum like how it was done in the past.

mayby having more than one mod would help (ken has not been on the board for 6 months)

i went through the posts (at least 6 months back) and noticed a lot of posts that did not belong here (i reported them so they can be moved). I figured at least once a month a mod could go through the new posts and move the ones tha tneed moving

 

What belongs, and what doesn't belong is highly subjective. I often leave a post like the "Snap On" thread, because is does generate good info. Questions may seem simplistic, but often they offer some interesting developments. I left the simple question about retuning for a cold air intake because the guy was a complete "newbie" - it was his first post, and I didn't want to intimidate him and scare him off. I try to put a little thought into what I do, and to be sensitive to the people who are posting. Apparently you think these are bad ideas.

I read all the posts, every day. I move lots of posts, because they don't belong here. But when I move them, the "redirect" is set to expire (disappear) in 3 days. That's why, in your rereading (more than) 6 months of posts, you didn't find anything that had been moved. People that visit the forum regularly know that I move at least 1/2 of the posts, becasue they are not appropriate, and I advise the person why his post has been moved.

Apparently you don't happen to like my style, and I'll take that as a constructive critcism.

Thanks for you input.

 

It is tough to have an advanced or innovative forum on a vehicle that has been out of production for 7 years- most of the 'new' has become old, and the experimenters have moved on to the LS2 and LS6, etc.

That said, there is the 'next generation' user that has come in- the second owners that have bought a used car, and now have new, to them, questions about what is best, what works. They probably need this forum as an archive, with the ability to ask a question or two about their specific conditions.

I also miss the old-time posters that had all the answers- I hope that, with the new Camaro coming out, that there will be a resurgence in cutting-edge tech on this and other forums, as the guys with deep pockets buy the newest models, and start learning how to mod them-

No complaints about the moderators in here- you guys are unsung heroes in my book- keep it up!

 

I have just noticed that tthe way the forum is managed has changed. when this forum started and in the following few years the types of post that I linked to were moved to the correct forum. its true that some post can be pretty subjective and some can turn into advanced tech topics but i think the examples I used were pretty far off from belonging here. I have noticed that you do a good job about putting thought into your postings but I think you could do a good job at moving the needed posts without intimidating him or scaring him off. I can understand how that would be easy to do though.
the only reasons I think they are bad ideas is because its teh advanced tech section and the sticky is worded pretty strongly regarding what this place is for and most people that are interested in this section dont want to wade through nonadvanced tech stuff in here (it will kill this section IMO)
I think this section needs to be moderAted more like it was in the past. what do tyou think?


glad you took it as it was ment to be taken.(as posative input) IMO you have a good style overall, I just think you could be more picky on what you let stay.

keep up the good work

 

I just skimmed over some of these post and I have been banned from another site and know that some things get out of hand.


But as far as this forum goes at one time there was more to read and knowledge to be learned. After a while it is the same things over and over. I don't think it is just a problem in the advanced section but look at the drag race and nitrous section too. There isn't much happening. I've got some good info here in the past. I've spent more time on yellowbullet lately because there are more people there like bret(business men) Some are more willing to help then others but that is doesn't pertain to this thread. Without real machine shops or head porters sponsering boards and selling their products they don't tend to give out info that keeps people interested.