I'd say yeah, but since I'm a trained monkey, my answer is predictable. "cost effciency", just like "globalization" are just euphemisms for busting anybody below the executive level in the *** and not feeling bad about it.

 

I would say it is a North American car. And The bulk of the profits go to an American company. GM.

 

So would you describe yourself as a democrat?

 

I'm putting my money on that being a yes.

 

Here, here!

Better be sure about that outcome first, hot rod. I don't think your bench racing enthusiasm can withstand the shock if what you say happens in reverse. Next year's Camaro probally won't run down an SRT8, and the 2008 SRT8 Challenger isn't going to be the quickest Challenger by the time Chevy does bring out the LSa based Camaro.

Just a warning.

That's funny, Eric.

Of 6400 SRT8 Challengers to be produced, 4,300 have been sold so far and the paint on the 1st ones isn't even dry yet, let alone the fact that none-zip-nada-zero have left the factory yet for showrooms.

Seems like unless you know someone on the waiting list who'll take a big cash bribe, or have carnal knowledge with your local dealer, your chance of getting one of the 2100 remaining '08 Challengers (that's only about 2 cars for every 3 or 4 Dodge dealerships) is just about on par with finding a Shelby GT500 at list price. Pretty low.

Hardly enough Challengers to keep any snow off any dealer lots.

Those connecting rods on the Z06 aren't on any other LSx engine, so that point is as useless as comparing a Viper engine to a Hemi 6.1. However, since you obviously know nothing about the 6.1 Hemi, I'll take a moment to school you:

1. higher-flow cylinder heads
2. high volume intake manifold w/larger-diameter shorter runners
3. exhaust headers with individual tubes encased in a stainless steel shell
4. larger-diameter hollow valves and reshaped ports (exhaust valves are sodium filled).
5. longer duration higher lift camshaft
..... and of particular intrest.....
6. reinforced engine block
7. forged steel crankshaft
8. high-strength powdered-metal connecting rods
9. floating-pin pistons (cooled by oil squirters)
10. oil pan modified to manage oil return to the pan sump at high engine speeds

Finally, GS Motorsports makes a supercharger kit that sends over 500 horsepower to the rear wheels...... reliably.

Being that GM decided NOT to use the Z06 engine as the basis of the new supercharged LSa due to durability issues, I wouldn't exactly use that engine as an example of something that can take adittional power... that plus the fact that engine costs something like $14,000!

Moral of this story...... don't talk about things of which ye know nothing about.

 

well, we'll just have to see what GM Powertrain has to say about that.

 

Especially conisdering the likely heavier Pontiac G8 GT kept within a fender of the Charger SRT-8. I think the chances of a Camaro keeping up with a CHallenger SRT8 are pretty good.

I think this is GM's chance to shine, release the ~430hp V8 in the base Camaro and steal some of the thunder back from the Challenger SRT-8 release. Also, knowing the Mustang GT will be getting a bump in power, I hope GM doesnt give us the 360ish hp LS motor, considering the Camaro might come in a little heavier than the Mustang. It wouldnt look good in the magazine comparisons for a 350hp Mustang to beat the all-new 360hp Camaro down the drag strip.

 

Let me assure you that the g8 will not keep within a fender of the srt8. It will be almost a half second behind by 60 and almost a second at the 1/4. Not only that but the srt8 will destroy it on a road course. Lets try not to make crap up because we want reality to be diffrent.

 

That's true, On another forum that I'm on, the numbers released for the G8 are 5.3 0-60 and 13.7 1/4 mile. That is WAY behind your average SRT8. STOCK SRT8's are running 4.8 0-60 and dipping into the 12's. That equals a spanking, not a fender.

 

He was referring to the video in the future section. Still crap..........

 

guys at edmunds didnt think it was crap....

http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...hotopanel..1.*

 

That's interesting. Must be the slowest Superbee on the planet. Those cars have a built in 0-60 timer. And on www.chargerforums.com there's plenty of guys posting pictures of thier EVIC displays showing 4.8 0-60mph with their STOCK SRT8's. So Like I said, either that is the slowest SRT8 on the planet, or maybe it wasn't broken in and G8 WAS. Who knows? Now the G8 VS a 5.7 Hemi Charger? No contest. The G8 should routinely beat it. I own one. A 350 hp Daytona Charger, so I plan on finding the first G8 I can find and see.

 

They say copying someone is the greatest form of flattery....Put a Hemi block up beside a GM LSx block and you can almost not tell the difference in the design....The LSx was out before the Hemi engine....It`s funny how they were using a 4.7 modular design getting away from the pushrods, then the LSx came out and wala dodge was back to a pushrod style after seeing how great the LSx was. I own a 4.7 modular in my 03 Durango, What a slug...Not to mention the mileage...It does tow well enough though (probably due to the 3:92`s) and does great on the beach... My next SUV will definetly have an LSx in it. Or a turbo diesel if one is offered in the future.

 

Those numbers that they ran are typical........for an RT. Way off for an SRT8.

 

I love great competition.... even if I have to fan the flames to get it started.

I think it's safe to bet the far there won't be a 430 horsepower V8 in a base Camaro, but I think I know what you mean. The L78 isn't likely either as far as I can tell. Also, I wouldn't worry about magazine comparos. The Mustang and Camaro are shaping up to be pretty close to neck and neck in performance, so I'm betting there won't be more than a couple of tenths between them and can go either way.

Have you actually taken a look at a Hemi engine and an LSx side by side?
Have you ever taken a look at the heads?
The valvetrain?
Ever taken a look at the Hemi block and compare it to the LSx?

Or are you just parroting what some clueless individual said in typical internet herd-mentality fashion?

You don't know that Chrysler went back to pushrods because it's cheaper to produce. You also don't know the camshaft sits high up in the Hemi block in order for it to use shorter pushrods to reduce valvetrain losses. Or that Chrysler chose tougher iron over alumunum. You don't know that the Hemi uses 2 spark plugs per cylinder, and that each coil pack sends one wire to the cylinder it's over and another to the opposite cylinder to increase power on the downstroke (the reason why they put out high torque numbers) and to run cleaner, using less restrictive catalytic plates in the converter.

You obviously are clueless that the new Chrysler Hemi was the first to use cylinder deactivation in a high volume engine. You didn't know the valvesprings are beehive instead of the LSx's standard which is lighter, has less mass, and is just as durable, if not moreso.

If you ever put a Hemi next to an LSx, you'll notice the Hemi has a higher deck height. The pistons are eutectic alloy, unlike the LSx's. The crankshaft has larger counterweights than the LSx. Oh, the LSx engines don't have anything resembling a Hemispherical combustion chamber.

There's other items that make the Hemi engine resemble the LSx engine as much as the LSx engine resembles a Ford Windsor, but I think that I've made my point.

This is not to say the LSx isn't a fantastic engine. It is. GM had a huge mountain of obsticles developing that engine from seal & head gasket leaks (they dropped a bolt from the small block design to gain more intake port space for starters ), to oiling problems, to pretty bad clanging noise which still plague LS1s when cold. I have 173K on my 2002 and it's still going strong (and still sounds like a damn diesel on cold mornings), and GM powertrain got alot of power out of the thing and it's more emissions friendly than most Japaneese V6s. But Chrysler's Hemi is a marvel in it's own right..... and it doesn't owe anything to the LSx engineeringwise.

Don't trust opinions from individuals who know no better that morph into a "truth". The Hemi is an all new design that has more in common with the old Chrysler 360 and old Hemis than it does with the LSx.


Being that it's not often to look at a Hemi and LS1 side-by-side, here's some mandatory reading for you before posting anything else about the Hemi and LSx engines:
http://www.idavette.net/hib/ls1c.html
http://www.allpar.com/mopar/new-mopar-hemi.html
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tec...iew/index.html