Now that you have written ALL THAT TEXT, I suggest you do a search and discover what the average age of the buyers are/were recently for Camaro and Mustangs. (Hint: Yes, I know what the ages are, and they are NOT baby boomers.) I think you are going to be surprised at just WHO is buying pony cars these days.

The fact that YOU are unimpressed with this car is acceptable - I have no problem with it.
BUT, if you think for one moment that Ford hasn't done it's homework on this car, you need a labotamy.
Ford has probably spent as much money researching the market for this car as some automakers spend on their entire ad campaign for a vehicle launch.
There have been focus groups galore, MCA involvement, mags and rags questionaires, website response, solicited feedback, forms sent in from recent buyers, polls by Ford dealers and corporate admin, and just plain old knee-jerk reactions from styling exercises - you name it.

Bottom line is, Ford is giving the public what they are asking for, plain and simple. Not just a couple of 60y/o retirees who want a car that harks to their teen age days for them to drive to the golf range with.

Many smoke, some don't.
Many eat meat, some don't.
Many drink liquor, some don't.
Many like this new Mustang, YOU don't.
Ever see anybody buying cigs, burgers, or beer?
Like I said, bash retro all you want. Big deal.

 

The T-Bird "failed" for numerous reasons, retro probably being the weakest of them, if it even was a reason (nothing has proven it to be). The first two years you couldn't hardly get your hands on one. A lot of people gave up trying and bought something else! That killed some sales off later down the road. A lot of people that wanted one just couldn't afford to buy one. They were normally stickered at $42,000 (if you could find one the first two years at that price). Not a whole lot of people can afford a $42,000 car. The car only came in two colors every year. Not much choice there for people. There were no real options on the car, though at $42,000 I would hope it had everything you wanted! The car was also a pig. It weighed 3800lbs. Not great for the type of car IMO. It was underpowered too. Ford used their smallest V8 in it, the 3.9L (yep, smaller than the 4.6L).

The biggest reason it has been considered a "failure" is because it didn't meet Ford's sales goals. Ford wanted to sell about 25,000 a year if I remember correctly. They ended up selling between 19,000 to 20,000 (after the first two years of incredible sales). Despite all this, the redesigned T-Bird was the 3rd best selling convertible in America while it was being built. It sold more than the Corvette covertible (which was supported by its other models), the Miata, the MR2, etc...only the Ford Mustang and Chrysler Sebring convertibles outsold it. Not bad for a limited run, niche vehicle IMO.

BTW, not all the press give retro black eyes, just some. Many of them love the Beetle, the PT Cruiser and the new Mustang.

 

When I found this at one of the Mustang sites I go to, I just had to post it here as a response to this.
21 year old Firebird owner who wants a 2005 Mustang

I've talked to lots of younger people like yourself and they love this car (unless they're die hard Chevy people). Personally I think several of the die hard guys are jealous and don't want to admit it

 

That's nice that you found one guy who had a V6 Firebird who likes the Mustang. I havne't talked to one non-Mustang fan thatlikes the car......so take that.
Jealous? Yeah right. IfGM pulls the same crap for the camaro that Ford did, I have alreadysaid thatI won't be buying one

 

 

Your missing my point 100%. Its not people that are into muscle cars, because they will like this car. But the other 90% of the population arent muscle car enthusiasts. Go ask any kids that are just on the brink of buying a car, and ask them if they had the money, would they get a Mustang or a 350Z. If you say nothing on performance and handling or any else, just based on pure design. I bet you that more kids will want the 350Z.
What a few enthusisats thing about this car is not what Im concerned with. Im sure you can find just as many people who dont want the Mustang as there are that do. You only have talked to a small market.
Sorry, but this car is not going to appeal to kids who are in an import dominated mind set. Dont talk to people that already own a muscle car or are part of the muscle car group, but talk to people that have no bias yet. I know I have talked to my little brother. Hes 8 years old, and he piced the 350Z because it looked fast. I know hes not the only one. Trust me, asking a bunch of enthusiasts are gunna get you more yay's then nay's, but talk to the people that are coming up to buy this car.

 

Ok, but I have done that already. I've asked young women if they would buy this car, many said yes, because they like the way it LOOKS. It had nothing to do with the performance. On top of that, most people who are interested in buying this car consider its looks before its performance. The same went for the older models. How do I know? Because more people bought a V6 than a V8. That alone tells you that they're not buying it for performance. I went to the car show a couple of weeks ago. When I look at cars, I also look at who's looking at them (I'm a people watcher). Most people around the car were in the 24 to 35 range. Some were younger, some older. Most had no clue what was under the hood, however, they were really excited just looking at it! It looks good to a lot of people. Ford has done their homework on this car, trust me. They know that the affordable V6 version keeps the Mustang alive and to this end they will make sure it sells to non-performance oriented people.

BTW, I love the 350Z. Think it's one sharp looking car. But I have to tell you it's an enthusiast's car. Nissan advertises it this way. They advertise it as being "fast" whether it is or not. That's one of the reasons why the public's perception is that it's fast.

 

Funny how Al says kids nowadays don't want an old looking car. The ONLY american cars that get ANY respect from the import crowds are the classics. Bring up a 4th gen camaro, or a new Mustang GT, and they'll **** on it. Bring up a 68 camaro SS or a mint 69 Mach 1, and tongues start rolling. If there's American cars the import camp respects, it is the classics.

Then there was the concept Mustang. I remember the responses on the various boards i frequent. This car was a BIG hit on the import boards (honda, supra, DSm, etc....), and after seeing the production mustang, a lot more have gone on to say that this is the best mustang they've seen in years.

1) Young people still like this car
2) A lot of them are NOT turned off by the 60's cues, and are embracing it.
3) Non- Mustang fans seem to like it as well.

Either way, all these speculations and opinions will be layed to rest in the years to come.

Btw: Average age for a new Mustang, Camaro, Firebird, and 350z buyer is north of 40 years old, and with an average income of 60,000 dollars. Young people (18-25) are not the majority of new sport coupe buyers.

 

SS was mostly a trim package only until the supercharged engine. And the supercharged engine was a 2004 addition-- my comparison was with 2003's sales, although I did not explicitly state it.

Nothing, really. It's just that PaperTarget said, "[the Beetle] has been out for how long without a revision? Any car will get stale after a while". I was trying to show that the length of time in the market doesn't necessarily matter, as the Impala doesn't seem to have suffered.

 

I think that's BS. There are import owners out there that like the modern muscle such as 3rd's, 5.0's, 4th's, current M*stang's, etc. And why do we even care what they think LOL?! I'm willing to bet the only reason that some of them like the way back stuff is because of those movies since both of them featured those kinds of cars. If those movies featured 350 IROC's and 5.0's they'd be all over them at a mention too, like with the others. That's just how they are, but it wouldn't only be them, they just tend to take things to the extreme. They also believe that they're fast just because they are from the 60's and 70's.

 

There are some, but there are probably as many of them as there is how many muscle car guys respect imports.

Because they are the prosepctive buyers of this car.


If my aunt had bawls, she'd be my uncle.

I guess Im fighting a losing battle here.

 

Yes, you are, I wasn't talking about the 5th Gen, I was talking about why some of them might like the 60's/70's car more than the new stuff. And these people are not prospective buyers of the 5th. 90% of Import guys dislike domestic as much as we dislike thier cars.

 

I'm sure there are import owners that like the newer pony cars, but face it...the pony cars that get the most respect are the classics. Even the more discrimnative Porsche-heads respect the old school muscle more than the newer ones....and we know the newer stuff performance tons better.

I guess you could say half the reason is hype.

Anyways, to assume that the younger generation wouldn't like the 05 mustang due to the 60's (muscle era) cues because they don't like "old stuff" would be wrong. Like i've said, buyers don't see modern and retro, they see ugly and nice. A retro car can look attractive, much in the same way that a modern car can look ugly.

 

you will always have the ignorant and the informed..

and then you have your idiots.. for everything..

 

Correct. The other 90% will buy SUVs, trucks, and riceburners. Doesn't matter what the Mustang looks like or how it runs - those people will buy SUVs, trucks, and riceburners.

So what?

A base 350Z is how much? A base Mustang costs what?

Good comparison there Jr.

Cool. So? And? There's a point here?

It is quite likely that those same few enthusisats (sic) aren't concerned with what YOU like either. Count me as one of em.

I'll do better - I bet you can find an order of magnitude more that don't want it. Kindly see comment above about SUVs, trucks, and riceburners.

Newsflash - the Mustang fills a relatively small market.

Thank God and Ford for that. If it did, there's a great chance that REAL ENTHUSIASTS, the ones you dismiss so easily, likely wouldn't like something that appealed to the "import dominated mind set".

Pray that GM doesn't try to appeal to much to the "Fast and Furious" crowd either when they come out with the new Camaro (assuming it happens, of course).

Please. Joe ricer has no bias? Try telling that to someone that might believe you. If you're lucky, perhaps someone here will believe you. I doubt it, but hey, Egyptians built the Pyramids, so anything is possible.

ROFLOL. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. You likely have no clue how brilliantly you have made my point. That has got to be the funniest line in this entire thread.

I'd be willing to bet that you like the 350Z too. I mean after all, it looks fast, right? Doesn't matter if it is or not - typical ricer mindset.

Don't hold your breath.

That statement is a direct contradiction of itself. Try again, Jr.