What does the GTO teach us
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,139
From: Commerce, mi, USA
Re: What does the GTO teach us
4. DEALER MARK UPS AND PONTIAC MARKETING BLEW GTO'S SUCCESS.
Pontiac marketed the GTO as a lower priced BMW alternative, but not before getting the public to view Pontiac that way. As a result, The GTO sat in traditionally reasonably priced Pontiac showrooms with massive dealer markups, no rebates or incentives, and with dealers seemingly doing everything in their power to guarantee not selling any. Dealers get their cue from Pontiac. If Pontiac had told them to treat the car as a step above a Grand Prix and not a limited edition high value car and backed it up with incentives, it would have been a completly different story.
Pontiac marketed the GTO as a lower priced BMW alternative, but not before getting the public to view Pontiac that way. As a result, The GTO sat in traditionally reasonably priced Pontiac showrooms with massive dealer markups, no rebates or incentives, and with dealers seemingly doing everything in their power to guarantee not selling any. Dealers get their cue from Pontiac. If Pontiac had told them to treat the car as a step above a Grand Prix and not a limited edition high value car and backed it up with incentives, it would have been a completly different story.
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
Re: What does the GTO teach us
Originally Posted by Pentatonic
Since your status on this forum is quite high and most of your posts are greeted with a lot of "Amen!"s and "
"s, disagreeing with you is no small task. But I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that I think you are wrong.
I know many of you here would like to take the easy way out and discredit my opinion based merely on my age, but let's all realize one thing here: none of us here are arguing hard facts. We are merely taking selected facts, and only mentioning those that support our opinions.
Of course GTO advocates say that it is the dealers that killed the GTOs success. I will agree that they certainly did not help. However, I've read and heard countless opinions from older and *gasp* more mature people whose main problem with the GTO is the STYLING. Not that dealers marked up the prices. Not that the car was too expensive. Their issue was styling. Even my dad thought the car looked dull. I've heard these opinions over and over again, yet you like to sweep them under the rug.
Other people thought that the car has none of the heritage or cues from the original GTOs, and that was their problem with it. But I guess that is to be expected by calling the car GTO and not Monaro. That is GM's fault, not mine.
"s, disagreeing with you is no small task. But I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that I think you are wrong.I know many of you here would like to take the easy way out and discredit my opinion based merely on my age, but let's all realize one thing here: none of us here are arguing hard facts. We are merely taking selected facts, and only mentioning those that support our opinions.
Of course GTO advocates say that it is the dealers that killed the GTOs success. I will agree that they certainly did not help. However, I've read and heard countless opinions from older and *gasp* more mature people whose main problem with the GTO is the STYLING. Not that dealers marked up the prices. Not that the car was too expensive. Their issue was styling. Even my dad thought the car looked dull. I've heard these opinions over and over again, yet you like to sweep them under the rug.
Other people thought that the car has none of the heritage or cues from the original GTOs, and that was their problem with it. But I guess that is to be expected by calling the car GTO and not Monaro. That is GM's fault, not mine.
There are plenty of people who want a more striking car for the money, but even they say something to the effect of "If the car was under $30,000, I'd consider it".
But Pontiac intended to sell only 18,000 of them per year, roughly only 2/3 what Corvette sells or just around 1/4-1/3 of Cadillac CTS sales. Perfectly easy to do at a $32,000 list price for a car like the GTO. For GM to blow even that pretty minimal amount, someone had to screw up.... badly. Hell, even the ugly and slow selling Aztek sold 70,000 vehicles annually!
Sales started to climb to projected levels once incentives kicked in, and dealers actually let potential customers actually test drive the things.
Because sales of the GTO climbed to where it's supposed to be, despite everyone knowing the improved 2005 is just weeks away, despite most of the mid west & north east about to experience or already into the beginings of winter, and despite many early potential buyers like myself turned off by the whold Pontiac dealer "experience" over the GTO, the only thing that changed are incentives & dealers backing off somewhat in their demands on customers wanting to test drive the car.
For the record, I'm "over 40", so I'd consider myself in the "older, and more mature" catagory...... or at least, "older".
Last edited by guionM; Dec 9, 2004 at 10:20 PM.
Registered User
Joined: Jun 2000
Posts: 805
From: MI
Re: What does the GTO teach us
Originally Posted by guionM
But Pontiac intended to sell only 18,000 of them per year, roughly only 2/3 what Corvette sells or just around 1/4-1/3 of Cadillac CTS sales. Perfectly easy to do at a $32,000 list price for a car like the GTO. For GM to blow even that pretty minimal amount, someone had to screw up.... badly. Hell, even the ugly and slow selling Aztek sold 70,000 vehicles annually!
Sales started to climb to projected levels once incentives kicked in, and dealers actually let potential customers actually test drive the things.
Sales started to climb to projected levels once incentives kicked in, and dealers actually let potential customers actually test drive the things.
The Aztek sold 70,000 vehicles annually? Wow. Now I do not blame GM nearly as much for expecting GTOs to sell for significantly above the MSRP. I can now see where they thought that the market for the GTO would have been larger, considering they sold the Aztek at a rate of 70,000 vehicles annually. I would have thought the exact same thing. At only 18,000 per year, people will be lining up at the doors to buy the cars, right?
The fact that the GTO cannot sell a mere 18,000 units a year at a premium price is almost laughable. But I suppose they must have realized, at least in some capacity, that the GTO market would not be large.
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Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,954
Re: What does the GTO teach us
Originally Posted by guionM
Because sales of the GTO climbed to where it's supposed to be, despite everyone knowing the improved 2005 is just weeks away, despite most of the mid west & north east about to experience or already into the beginings of winter, and despite many early potential buyers like myself turned off by the whold Pontiac dealer "experience" over the GTO, the only thing that changed are incentives & dealers backing off somewhat in their demands on customers wanting to test drive the car.
The lesson learned from the 2004 GTO is that low standards are OK in the U.S. of A.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 2,139
From: Commerce, mi, USA
Re: What does the GTO teach us
The lesson learned from the 2004 GTO is that low standards are OK in the U.S. of A.
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 138
From: Your moms house
Re: What does the GTO teach us
Originally Posted by Chris 96 WS6
95% of people that say it looks boring ar 19 year old boy racers who'd never be able to afford the car. I love the Trans Am look too, but I can also appreciate clean, simple, purposeful lines. The people with the money to buy these cars don't necessarily want gaudy scoops and wings hung all over their cars.
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