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Study Ethanol from Switchgrass: $.55-$.62/gallon

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Old Mar 10, 2008 | 11:16 AM
  #76  
AdioSS's Avatar
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Originally Posted by falchulk
e100 is not possible in the us. It works fine for Brazil becuase of the temps down there.
By law, they have to add gasoline to make it undrinkable.
Old Mar 10, 2008 | 11:26 AM
  #77  
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Originally Posted by AdioSS
By law, they have to add gasoline to make it undrinkable.
"E100" already contains 4% gasoline, which is more than enough to make it undrinkable... but not enough to allow for cold starts in sub-freezing temps.
Old Mar 10, 2008 | 12:02 PM
  #78  
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Originally Posted by Eric Bryant
"E100" already contains 4% gasoline, which is more than enough to make it undrinkable... but not enough to allow for cold starts in sub-freezing temps.
Wouldn't that be E96 then?

What's the point of adding the gasoline?
Old Mar 10, 2008 | 01:02 PM
  #79  
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Originally Posted by JakeRobb
Wouldn't that be E96 then?

What's the point of adding the gasoline?
The gasoline "denatures" (makes toxic) the ethanol. The Feds force this upon the manufacturers - otherwise, the ethanol would technically be drinkable (although it'd probably taste horrible). So, "E100" isn't 100% ethanol, and "E85" is actually only 81.5% ethanol. That's OK, since the gasoline is also needed for cold starts.
Old Mar 10, 2008 | 01:17 PM
  #80  
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Originally Posted by Eric Bryant
The gasoline "denatures" (makes toxic) the ethanol. The Feds force this upon the manufacturers - otherwise, the ethanol would technically be drinkable (although it'd probably taste horrible). So, "E100" isn't 100% ethanol, and "E85" is actually only 81.5% ethanol.
Interesting. Why bother adding more gas to E85? Going from 15% gasoline to 18.5 doesn't make it any less drinkable.

Originally Posted by Eric Bryant
That's OK, since the gasoline is also needed for cold starts.
An engine can't start reliably using E85 below freezing temperatures (source, page 4). It needs a heat source. Given the range of climates most American cars are likely to see during the course of any given year, that heat source is going to be mandatory if you want your car to be reliable year-round. Even if you lived in Florida or Southern California, would you really want a car that you couldn't take on a trip up north during the winter months?

Since E85 cars pretty much require a heater, it seems to me that you could pretty much ignore the cold start issue.
Old Mar 10, 2008 | 01:24 PM
  #81  
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Originally Posted by JakeRobb
Interesting. Why bother adding more gas to E85? Going from 15% gasoline to 18.5 doesn't make it any less drinkable.
The E100 has to be shipped between the ethanol "refinery" and the gasoline refinery, and the Feds (as well as several state governments) aren't open to the idea of shipping pure ethanol. Blame post-Prohibition liquor laws.

As a side note, a friend of mine worked for ADM at an ethanol plant, and after hearing some stories, I definitely wouldn't be using motor-vehicle ethanol as an Everclear substitute even if it wasn't denatured

Since E85 cars pretty much require a heater, it seems to me that you could pretty much ignore the cold start issue.
As bad as E85 might be, E100 would be worse. In the wintertime, that 18.5% of "gasoline" can be blended to yield a rather high vapor pressure, and thus at least marginally improves cold starts.
Old Mar 10, 2008 | 01:42 PM
  #82  
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Originally Posted by Eric Bryant
The E100 has to be shipped between the ethanol "refinery" and the gasoline refinery, and the Feds (as well as several state governments) aren't open to the idea of shipping pure ethanol. Blame post-Prohibition liquor laws.

As a side note, a friend of mine worked for ADM at an ethanol plant, and after hearing some stories, I definitely wouldn't be using motor-vehicle ethanol as an Everclear substitute even if it wasn't denatured

As bad as E85 might be, E100 would be worse. In the wintertime, that 18.5% of "gasoline" can be blended to yield a rather high vapor pressure, and thus at least marginally improves cold starts.
I'm not totally sure, but I think you missed my point on both counts.
Old Mar 10, 2008 | 02:03 PM
  #83  
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Originally Posted by JakeRobb
I'm not totally sure, but I think you missed my point on both counts.
I'm not totally sure that I did miss your points, but regardless of whatever you're trying to say, I'm telling you that this is the way that industry blends fuel.
Old Mar 10, 2008 | 07:20 PM
  #84  
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Post

Originally Posted by Dragoneye
.....................

Did you read the topic in the lounge?

here put this in a Google this:

"E85 Emissions worse than gasoline"

Then get back to me on your comment.
And just to let you know many of the links Google comes up with are reputalbe reporting sources.
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