stars1010

Well Red Planet is gone, there seems to be nothing but pointless arguing over topics that have been beaten to death, and its sounding like the car we have been waiting for isn’t coming. Oh we are getting a RWD V8 Chevy, but its not going to be a Camaro.

I don’t blame Red. I defiantly see his point of view. It just plain sucks that he is not around.

All the GTO bashing, crying about GM not producing what we want, and Mustang GT envy isn’t getting this forum anywhere. I think it really boils down that GM has a big hole in their line up right now and there is nothing that can be done about it now.

We will have some sort of sports car from Chevy in 3 or 4 years. We wont know anything about it until its pretty much at the local dealer. It most likely wont have the Camaro formula. Oh it will have a V8 and RWD but sounds to me like we are getting a Chevelle like car in the end. I want a Camaro.

This is what I see.

During this 3 or 4 year wait Ford will be producing a car very similar to our late Camaro.

GM is forcing products down our throat. Ford Listens to their customers.

I’m sick of hearing about all these $50,000 sports cars. I wont be ready to make a purchase like that for another 20 years. I want something new and cool in 3 years after I’m out of college.

Simply put, if GM is going to ignore to build the car I want and they used to build then I wont buy from them anymore.

Until I see something to keep the faith for I’m jumping ship. Ford has my purchase in 2008 as of today.

What about you?

ced8

I honestly believe GM will make some sort of effort to pull through for us simply because I think that our beloved Camaro has some rather interesting friends in GM. I know that Zeta may not be the solution for a pony car but at the same time Torana may hold the key if GM can generate some money to build it. My suggestion would be that Holden get the chassis to produce in Oz. and just export the Camaro over here ala GTO. That would work if we export enough to Australia (covered with the export of Monaro) to please the unions and that way we don’t have to piggy back the Camaro to other divisions which would impact sales. (Same scenario we see with Kappa and platform sharing…)

I feel that with Lutz at the helm will move towards a respectable position in the next few years. The RWD cars are selling in good numbers (Stang/300) and I’m sure GM won’t be caught napping. I know how much Red has done for the Camaro effort because I’ve had the pleasure of meeting him and if he is there.. that’s all I need to keep faith because he is more of a car nut than I am and if it hurts me that there is no f-bod it will be killing him

No one knows what is going on within the walls of GM but remember that Cadillac with all their support and money behind them took 4 years to get what they wanted… I’m sure things take time but I’ve never given up on the # 1 car company and don’t plan to start now….. (I’m going to grab some Prozac though)

johnsocal

I already jumped shipped by buying an Ion Quadcoupe as my daily driver (and kid transporter) and a Mini Cooper as my fun car, but I have faith GM will bring something good out eventually.

My Quadcoupe cost me $17,000 and the Mini Cooper cost me $18,000 so both of them combined cost me $35,000 and I since I split my driving between both of those cars Iam able to keep their mileage low and I really enjoy driving both of them.

The only other cars I though seriously about was the GTO and G35 Coupe which both sell around $35,000 each and neither of those car had easy access rear seats (for my kids) like the quadcoupe has with its suicide doors and I dont care for sedans and I dont trust the reliability of Mazda's Rotary engine in the RX8.

WJH'sFormula

I chose keeping the faith simply because a home purchase preceeds any new car purchase over the next couple of years. If suddenly I were in the position to buy a new car tomorrow, I would have little problem running out and buying a brand spanking new Mustang.

I'd wager that Chevy will offer something (Camaro or otherwise) around 2008 as has been speculated, but unfortunately, I wont be surprised if they don't.

Bad AZz Z28

I'm keeping the faith that chevy will have a v8 rwd car within the next few years, I'm not keeping the faith that it will be anything that I want.

It pisses me off that my 1LE comes in at almost 3400lbs with nothing, and that my 98 camaro is probably going to be 3750 w/o me when its all said and done. That is rediculous. Now the thought of bringing GTO-like cars out, weighing that much before you even add the subframe connectors, 10 point cage,blower,intercooler w piping, and a switch to an iron block has made me decide that I'll only be buying newer trucks and restoring older cars. For the price of a 3900lb 'performance' car in a few years, i can build a tube frame street iroc with a gorgeous interior and twice the HP if I want to.

If a nice looking sub 3400lb high-po Camaro Z28 1LE T56 with ttops gets made, I'll want it. If it doesnt, I'll just fight the battle with my good old camaros made back when GM knew how to make a car and not an appliance

Tanker Don

The current situation? The current situation is based solely on conjecture and speculation. Conclusions therefore are born of emotion and not fact. When one considers whether or not to “Keep the Faith,” one must examine the object of such faith. In this case, there are none more reliable and upstanding in our community than Red Planet. If Red says, “Keep the Faith,” I for one, will. Giving up now is woefully premature.

HAZ-Matt

I have the luxury of keeping the faith because:

1. Not going to be replacing my car while I am in med school.

2. I never intended to buy a Camaro, ever. My interest in Camaro is limited to the fact that it shared platforms with the Firebird, and a new Camaro might increase the chances of a new Firebird from 0.00 to 13.47 percent.

3. GM is bringing exciting cars to market. They are bound to introduce a pony car eventually.

stars1010

Not to insult Red but he does not have the final say in what gets made nor will he ever tell us what is going on. So until the car is actually sitting on the dealer lot or the Car show all we will ever have is conjecture and speculation. We will never have anything more. just about every tid bit of info dropped here has changed or been proven wrong. I come here a few times a week, I used to come here almost everyday and I'm pretty much lost to what is going on when it comes down to Camaro. If Red says keep the faith that does not mean there is a Camaro in the works.

stars1010

And while we are discussing fact vs. speculation let me go on.

The only fact I see from GM as of lately is they cant come to the market with an affordable RWD V8 car.

Don’t say the GTO. I personally would love to have a GTO but I flat out wont be about to buy a $30,000 plus car for at least another 7 to 10 years.

The Cobalt SS will be cool. But I just don’t want a FWD 4-banger.

So if we go with the trend of what GM is producing by fact and if they continue to do this they just wont get my business for years. If ever.

Don’t get me wrong I’ll look at whatever they build towards the end of the decade, but I’m truly looking for a Pony Car. The current Mustang fits my bill perfect right now and I can only see that car getting better over the next few years.

jawzforlife

Well the wife's car is paid off in 2007. My next car will be bought between 2006 and 2007 (unless I come across a sweet deal). So I figure by them time I buy, there should be some info on a 5th gen. If I dont like the 5th gen, my options will be a used C5 (current plan) or something other than chevy, (Mustang, 350z, A4).

jg95z28

I'm in a similar boat: Our Tahoe will be paid off in April 2007. I'll be looking for something new between Fall 2006 and Fall 2007. By then my 95 Z28 will be 12 years old; I'll have sold the Mustang and one of my 67 Camaros; my oldest should be done with law school; my youngest will be finishing his sophomore year in college (hopefully on scholarship). That gives me plenty of time to convince my wife I need a new musclecar.

NikiVee

I'm a GM diehard. Always have been and always will be. Don't worry guys, lots of good stuff coming out in the next few years from GM. Be patient.

ProudPony

You know guys, it's not like you are hurling youself into space without a thrust pack on or something. There IS a way back...

We've posted threads like this before, and there's quite a bit of rhetoric and logic that applies.
You can show GM what you think by voting with your wallet - THAT they understand, even the most crude of beancounters get THAT message.

I hold out hope for a Camaro return myself. I fear that the Mustang will begin to lose sight of what made it special if there is no direct competition. Heck, as much as I love the shape and styling of the new car, I am also the first to admit that it is getting porky. I hope that it's current dimensions and weight are the limit. I also don't want to see tons of gadgetry and gizmos all over the car - but the 128-colored dash lights are already in... .

On the downside though, guionM, myself, and others have all posted and linked to stories that show GM is doing a realignment that puts Pontiac as the "performance" marque, and GM as the "common value" marque among other changes. So far, I think that's happening... who got the GTO, and who got the V8 dropped from their mid-size car? Who got the G6, and who got the Aveo? Who's got S/C'ed V6's and paddleshifters and who's still got A4's in an "SS"? I digress at this point.
With Corvette sitting in Chevy's showroom for perpetuity, I have a hard time seeing them put out another performance model - given their "new" genre. But it COULD happen - and I hope it does.

So as a parting salvo, remember this...
You can always sell your "enter any name but Chevy here" vehicle in a few years and go back - leaving doesn't mean you are banned forever.

Been there, done that.

Burmite

I'm jumping ship until I hear something happening again. I don't post that often here anymore more because I lost much of my faith in the Camaro's return. When I finish graduate school in a year and some change, I am sure that I will be looking to buy a GTO or a Mustang GT since I now have faith in the death of the Camaro.

Here's what I think of it:

For a while there was much talk about putting the Camaro on Sigma.
That never happened, we waited longer for a more suitable platform

Time passed some more and there was much hype about Kappa.
Kappa would cost too much to make a Camaro and the business case for Kappa had no intentions to include Camaro.

We waited again.

Zeta looked like the ultimate solution to the absence of Camaro. It would be on the short wheel base version of Zeta with the GTO, possibly the Monte Carlo, possibly the Grand Prix and other future RWD cars piggy backing together on the platform. It would be designed for V8 and RWD, perfect for the Camaro. However, we discovered that there truly were no intentions for a short wheel base version of Zeta, making an appropriate Camaro impossible. It would be too big and too heavy for a Camaro. We bowed our heads in dissatisfaction.

We waited again.

The Torana comes along as a hybrid Kappa-Zeta as "Beta" with potential to be Camaro sized with all the appropriate things that define Camaro. But the business case for Beta is far off in the future with an indefinite future due to the upper management of GM. Ford and Chrysler are smaller companies that can maneuver products to market as they need to. GM has proven time and time again to be a huge, clumsy ogre with no ability to change over time, preserving the status quo. GM historically follows, never leads, and puts cars onto market that are always outdated and subpar with a few recent exceptions such as the Corvette and Cadillac (which is playing catch up to BMW and Benz). Torana in this situation will take forever to come to market with this management. Beta as we know it is the only hope Camaro has, and at that it isn't much of a hope and more of a pipe dream.

So we wait again. I see this pattern and refuse to get drawn into hype any longer until I see solid proof of something. I used to be a fanatic, now I'm more apathetic.


We here are hungry for news that is not coming. Hell, Z284Ever, you're one of the most prominent members on this forum and you yourself got completely hyped up and hopeful for the "go" status of the Torana based on a random guy's comment he thinks he heard from someone Torana might possibly be a go supposedly. We're all desperate here, and I'm tired of it.



I will need a car in a year. So GM, show me proof by then or I will show you photos of a Ford emblem in my driveway that day. I've had enough until I see that sign of hope.

Chris 96 WS6

I'm settling in for a "no new Camaro" scenario. If there is one, I'll be plesantly suprised.

Just my best guess from everything I've read over the months, but I think the ship sailed on the Camaro name this summer and all the critical mass got in line behind other options within GM. Red's leaving may have been just as much frustration internally in GM as with us.

If nothing else, I've seen how the purists crapped all over the new GTO..I think GM has decided it may not be the best move to resurrect every sacred name they have.

My 99 blazer 4wd has 93,000 miles on it but looks and drives like a 50K mile car...I drive it every day. It is paid for. My wife has an '01 Maxima SE, a really great car, 51K miles and will be paid off this time next year. We plan to drive both of these vehicles into the ground before trading up.

My trans am has 74,000 miles, is on its second heads/cam set, is getting a t56 this winter, and I have no plans to ditch it. It is paid for too.

All three of these vehicles were bought used, for substantially less than their new-car sticker prices. New cars are a horrible investment, you are pissing away money on depreciation and you will never get that money back.

The ONLY car I'd consider buying new is a new Camaro, but short of that I doubt I'll ever buy a new car. I'd rather take that money saved in not paying for depreciation and put into parts for the Trans am or even more importantly my retirement and/or my home, etc. etc. I won't even buy a Corvette new if I ever am in the market. A Camaro would be different though.

I'm settling in to become the F-body equivalent of all the old Chevelle enthusiasts...the purists that stick with their cars for decades, not the boy racers who trade off to the next big thing and blow more money on depreciation every time a cool new model comes out. I'm only putting about 3000 miles a year on my car, so it's got plenty of life left in it. So I'll pull it out and drive to the cruise ins in the summers and when I'm 50 yrs old I'll be the old guy with the cool car in the garage.

I'm holding out for nostalgia that will come with having a cool car thats 20 years old. I'm holding out for the f-body scene becoming another dedicated group of people worshiping a dead car name and keeping it alive like the Chevelle has been kept alive.