Why is that?
I'll bet that is another "urban myth".

 

It was called the PROBE and was only partially successfull. It was replaced with the Cougar which was even less successful.


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Never trust anyone with lots of plants.

2001 Mustang Bullitt GT
2000 Jetta M5
1988 C1500 A3

 

No it isn't an urban legend...at least the part about them not making money on them is...that is from the horses mouth. I assumed they wouldn't wanna sell alot because, well what business wants to sell alot of cars they make money on.

The Probe and Mustang were bother buried BECAUSE of the Mustang. Ford dealers push the mustang above all other options...GM dealers make the F-body the lowest option.

 

Oh, I've heard that before too (maybe even from the same horses mouth that you have ).

It's just that I have a hard time understanding it. I know that St. Therese had some inefficencies but....

If you can't sell an old, low cost platform, with live rear axle and cast iron pushrod V6 with low rent trim materials for low $20K or so...and not make a profit, something is amiss.

Maybe that's one of the reasons for this whole hiatus thing.

 

4 main reasons:

1. v6 mustang is cheaper - check the base MSRP. $18,100 to $19,015, plus i've seen v6 stangs for allot less then the msrp.

2. v6 mustang is lighter - 3114lbs to 3323lbs, a difference of 209lbs between 5spd coupes. The v6 5sp camaro coupe is even heavier then a GT.

3. v6 mustang comes with more standard equipment - try finding power Windows, power locks, power drive seat, cruise control, rear defroster, Cassete player, remote keyless entry, and power mirrors standard on the base camaro coupe. You'd have to purchase the "Preferred equipment groups" option which costs extra to equal the base mustangs "standard" equipment.

4. v6 mustang is just better to live with to your average consumer (as some have said, sits higher, less blind spots, etc...)

It's basically cheaper over all and from my point of view, just the better value. I remember doing a price quote/comparo on both similarly equipped models a year back and the mustang v6 came out to be 1,500-2,000 dollars cheaper. That's a good chunk of cash. You can basically get a car that's just as fast and well equipped for much less. That alone is enough to sway most potential buyers. Even the base GT is better equipped then the base z28/formula. Both again would need "Preferred equipment groups" option/package to be similarly equipped as the base GT. Of course, the GT isn't anywhere near fast and that becomes it's drawback.


[This message has been edited by RiceEating5.0 (edited September 14, 2002).]

 

Yes...but say the average 18 year old V6 Mustang buying girl walks into a Ford dealer and they have a car like the Grand Am GT coupe...The girl knows nothing about FWD and doesn't care...All I am saying is that the Mustang's sales are artifically inflated by #1 Fleet sales, and #2 how thier dealers market them. You want a V6 coupe at a ford dealer, then he will almost certainly sell you a mustang. You want a V6 coupe at a Pontiac dealer, he would almost certainly be able to sell you a Grand Am GT or up to this year a Grand Prix GT or GTP before he sold that Firebird.

 

M*****gs are also alot more like regular cars than F-Bodies are. The F-Body tends to get buyers more serious about performance and enthusiasts.


[This message has been edited by IZ28 (edited September 14, 2002).]

 

I agree. Last time i went looking for a T/A a year ago, and came up short on $$$$, the sales guy tried so hard in trying to sell me a Grand Prix. He made it out to be just "fast", "sporty", and "fun". If i hadn't known any better, i'd have followed through with it. I simply told him that if i was in the market for something like the GTP, i'd get the new maximas. But like somebody else said, they are'nt only competing within their own brand, but outside it as well. Ford may market 3 coupes but how many are their competitors marketing? PLENTY. The mustang/ford doesn't work out for them, it's move on to GM's and imports. The field/market is wide open. They aren't just limited to mustangs. If they're smart they'll test drive a few other makes before going with one specific makes. I certaintly belive that those wanting a mustang end up in a mustang. That's what bought them to the Ford dealership in the 1st place right? They could have easily went over to the GM's or even imports for their sport coupes. Plus i don't think your typical car owner is as brand loyal as we are. Chevy, ford, dodge, import, it wouldn't matter to most of them as long as the car "appeals" to them.

But the majority of mustang goes to the customer. Even without fleet sales, they'd still sell 6 figures. Assuming all the rentals fall under fleet sales, etc... you'd be looking at $203,000 mustangs sold in 2000. No cobra or bullit either, just the plain ol GT and v6.

'00 BY COLOR:
Black (UA) - 39,791
Silver (YN) - 37,617
Laser Red (E9) - 33,804
Crystal White (ZR) - 32,606
Performance Red (ES) - 17,764
Amazon (Tropic) Green(SU) - 13,262
Atlantic Blue (K6) - 11,873
Electric Green (SW) - 5,206

Sunburst Gold (BP) - 5,171

Bright Atlantic Blue (K7) - 4,979
Zinc Yellow (B7)- 917 (all Spring Feature Cars)

All others
(special fleet orders, etc.)- 15,535

TOTAL: 218,525

 

But those serious about performance and enthusiasts are NOT buying the 6 cylinder cars.


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Never trust anyone with lots of plants.

2001 Mustang Bullitt GT
2000 Jetta M5
1988 C1500 A3

 

That's true...and how unfortunate!

Even though the base V6 versions of these cars are sold and marketed as loss leader/econo versions ( more successfully by Ford than by GM)..I consider this a lost opportunity.

It's too bad these V6 base models (the former F-body Y87 was a good start) couldn't be made into desirable models...that people wanted to buy rather than settle for.

 

Branden,
I kindof agree, but not entirely. I don't think salesmen are hell-bent on selling every person that comes on the lot wanting a V6 a Mustang. Just today, while out for lunch, I rolled into the tiny little Ford dealer in a small town near my home. He's not an SVT dealer, BTW. Along this line I was interested in what stock he had on hand...
8 Taurus', 9 Focus', 5 Crown Vics, 1 red V6 auto Mustang - that was all the cars! Everything else was trucks... like 12 Rangers, probably 2 dozen F-150s and several SuperDutys. Oh yeah, about 12 Windstars, about 14 or so Explorers, maybe 6 or 7 Expeditions, and 2 Excursions. (I live in the sticks - does that matter for truck sales? )

Now unless the two salesmen in there had sold all the Mustangs already this week, I don't see why the inventory leaned so heavily towards the Focus and Taurus. The Taurus ain't dead yet, and it is still selling like hotcakes, last I heard. I think the Tarus is where the salesman want to put the "unwitted V6 buyer". If the buyer is young(er) and the word "sporty" comes up in the conversation, sure... they are over to the Mustang.

Otherwise, I think the new Focus is the car getting all the sales hype right now. I see 10 Focus commercials for every Stang commercial, and the Focus is all over the Papers and Mags.

Likewise, I think GM is tooting the GP more heavily than anything (CAR-wise) right now. Next in popularity I think I see more ads and talk about the Cavalier.

So in conclusion, I think RiceEating5.0 hit the nail on the head (if I am reading him right) when he said "I certaintly belive that those wanting a mustang end up in a mustang." I too think that probably +80% of Mustang buyers don't even shop for "a car" or let a salesman "sell" them one... they knew what they wanted before they even left the house - they go find it or order it. Also, that's why we see such a variety of the cars with different colors/options... they are ordered to meet a customers desires - the purchase already made mentally before even going to the dealer.

Just .02 on Mustang's "retail" sales.

[This message has been edited by ProudPony (edited September 14, 2002).]

 

No the dealers assortment is roughly the proportions that they are likely to sell. I am willing to bet the sell 2-3 more Taurus's, Focus's (Foci), Rangers then they doV6 Mustangs...that is just how the sales work. My point was if you look at a buyer who is trying to buy a coupe and has thier mide set on it...The Ford dealer will go all out trying to get you in a Mustang over all other models...the Probe and Cougar to an extent. In a GM dealer it seems like a V6 F-body was teh last thing they wanted you to buy. An ex I had wanted a a Z28 once and the dealer talked her out of it because they are "bad in the snow" (she lived in PA at the time), and sold her a Cavalier Z24. I wanted to scream when I heard that since a Z28 almost certainly would have had traction control. Anyway...that is the kind of crap GM dealers pull in regards to F-body's. In order to buy one you have to know exactly what you want and enough to fight back when they try and talk you out of it. Kinda makes me wonder how much the average GM dealer makes off a V6 F-body compared to teh Ford Dealer makes off a V6 Stang.

 

You make some good points but a correction is in order.

Although in reality 18 year olds make up about <1% of the new car buying public, and about half of that is female, they tend to buy small 4 door FWD cars (ie: Hondas). They (or their dads) want a car that is the most dependable and as maintenence free as possible. Unfortunately that means small imports.

Also, even though I've said this often, Mustangs, including the V6 versions, are bought mostly by men. It runs about 58-60% on the V6, and about 70%+ on the GT.

Mission accomplished. Please continue.

 

It was an example ment to show the average person who wants a sports car but doesn't know or car about FWD or RWD...power, ect.

 

I see, and again you are making some good points.

But just to add, I think that a person who is about to become married to GMAC or their local bank for the next 5 years who want's a sports car will do a bit of homework & know what they are looking for in a car. I'll easily admit that a majority of buyers probally don't care if their car is FWD or AWD, or is under the conception that FWD is safer, but I feel they probally know which wheels are driving their car. But simply because they are looking for a sports car I think separates them from those who are using Consumer Reports magazine to decide for them.