Not to be the picky one here, The 500 has a 3 liter dohc v6. I test drove one the other day. It is a very nice car for the money, If I was to get one I would wait for the new nose treatment and the new 3.5 v6 version.

 

well your quote confirms that Ford once again didn't get it right the first time. They should have offered the bigger motor right now, instead of making you wait a year or two.

Many people don't have time to wait for the better model. They need a car now, not two years from now. Ford is going to lose a lot of sales.

Redzed...
I don't get how you call the Grand Prix dated looking. Its a love it or hate it style, but I think its fresh and looks like nothing else on the road. And it is one of the top peforming FWD cars with the 260hp 3.8 V6.

 

I thought that "crap 200hp v6" was a Duratec (Dohc) and not the pushrod 3.0 v6. It's underpowered by todays standards, and i hope they get the upcoming 3.5 in that thing real quick because it's pretty much outgunned by its v6 import peers as we stand.

But i see the 500 as a move in the right direction for them. After the horrid Taurus, just about any new mid-sized car would a major improvement to their car lineup.

AronZ28, the 3.5 duratec won't even come out till 06. But i too think that they should have held out for the new motor. Sucks for the 2005 buyers i guess.

 

RUMOR MILL ALERT!!!!!!!!!


There is word that the 500 will get Volvo's 4.4L V8.

 

300C competitor? If they can get a 315-320hp 4.4, AWD, and some other nice options for under or around 30k, it'd be a homerun for them. What's the AWD 300C cost? 35k?

As weird and somewhat doubtful (on my side) as this rumor is, i hope it's true.

 

That would be Yamaha's 4.4 V8...

Volvo making V8's...ahahahaha I almost wet myself.
Is that like Saabs V8 in the 9-7x?
With the Impala getting a V8, the 500 will soon be outclassed without one....its already behind the pack with the dated Duratec.

 

Looks like this new 4.4 has something in common with the 3.4L SHO v8.

http://www.caranddriver.com/article....rticle_id=8691

According to the C&D article, this new 4.4 is actually based off the old 3.4L SHO v8 which was designed by Ford and built by Yamaha some years back. Looks like they dusted that design off, reworked it, and now it's seeing use in Volvo's SUV.

The 500 will need a sub-250hp 3.5L Duratec "minimum", and that 4.4 v8 would make for a nice option.

Btw: When is the Imp due for a redesign? It's been on market for what now? 7 model years. Toyota/Nissan/Honda seem to limit their models to 4-5 years life cycles. Why do domestics drag their models to the brink of being seriously dated before updating them?

 

Yes, the new 4.4 is related to the 3.4 found in the later SHO's, and I belive that the 3.4 is designed from the 3.2 V6's Yamaha made for the SHO's in the first 2 gens. I belive that the engine was designed and built for Ford by Yamaha. I dont think Ford had much to do with design, but I could be wrong.
Impy will be shown at NAIAS this year.

as for why do domestics drag out there models for so long is because of many reasons. Im sure there is a post by Guy that can explain it, but it comes down to how big GM is compared to Toyota, and how much money GM has to devote to every single car line compared to smaller Toyota or Honda. Usualy when GM updates, its on a new chassis, while Toyota and Honda adapt the chassis, add a few new things, and new design and they are on there way. They save a lot of money by not desiging a new chassis, and they put that money back into the car. That inturn gives them more money per car compared to GM, to reinvest into the car to make it better....you see where I am going with this...
GM and Ford are finaly realizing the power of there European purchases (Volvo and Saab) and Pacific friends (Mazda and Holden) to making flexable chassis.

 

Its not so much domestics as it is just GM. Ford is in the same boat as Honda and Toyota, where they make a lot more money off every model than GM does. It costs GM significantly more to promote each car within the devision even if its on the same chassis...not to mention pentions, health care, blah blah yada. Just doesn't makes better business sense for GM to wait it out a few more years and go all out.

 

Did some prodding. Seems like the v6 was all Yamaha, with the v8 being a joint venture. I wonder how much this new 4.4 shares with the old 3.4 v8. If i recall correctly, the 3.4 was known to go through cams every 60,000 or so miles. Hopefully, the new 4.4 is more refined and reliable.

I noticed how they are taking full advantage of their import brands. Ford's new cars except the mustang and Ford GT are based off Volvo or Mazda architects. I also realize the size of companies like GM and Ford and the size of their car selection, but that's still no excuse imo because both brands use "badge engineering" quite liberally. So the numbers of different platforms and cars aren't as great as they might seem. Just look at the number of cars built off J, W, and N body platforms. Ford Fox platform is the same as well. And it's not just the platforms, it's the cars as well. Taurus, Grand Am, GP, Imp and prevous Lumina sedans, previous Malibu, Mustang (94-04, same interior), 93-02 f-bod, and the list for Ford/GM go on and on. They let these cars stay on the market longer than they should have, and i think this is what killed the domestic car image.

They're getting better now with their new models, but throughout the 80's, 90's and early 2k's, they kept them on the market too long without major changes. I think it's better to have gradual smaller changes and refreshings over a shorter period of time rather than one big change over a longer period of time.

 

The badge engineering was never a problem for GM. IMO, more a huge problem for Ford and Merc.
GM has always had 1 chassis with several different cars off it, and all the cars, more or less, looked much different.
Ford's Taurus/Sable and Crown Vic/Grand Mk are rebadges
500 and Montego are rebadges. And Fusion and Milan will be rebadges.
If Ford makes all this money, how come we cant get different sheetmetal?
Look at the Epsilon cars. Its a world-wide chassis. You have 9-3 4dr sedan, 9-3 2dr vert, 4 and 5dr hatchabc Malibu, 4 dr, 2dr coupe and 2dr hardtop G6, and 4 and 5dr hatchabck Opels and Vaux. If you lined them up next to eachother, there wouldnt be one single item that you could say "Oh, the 9-3 uses the malibu's headlights" or "the G6 and Signum use the same sheetmetal."
Even the W bodies are very different from eachother.
Remember when people didnt care about badge engineering? When all the Abodies used pretty much the same sheetmetal, and added a different rear and nose, slap a hood and divisions mega-motor, and you had a cheaply made muscle car.
There are still a lot of rebadges like the 360 SUV's and CSV's, but really who changes up there SUV's? Even Toyota's SUV's look the same inside and out from Lexus.
I think its just a bigger problem becaue GM has soooo many divisons. If Toyota had 5-6 divisions, there would be many Camry look-alikes.

 

Which is why i wish Ford would cut off Mercury, and GM would cut off Buick and Saturn. Too many redundant brands imo, especially Saturn and Mercury.

 

I agree that GM can do a WONDERFUL job of differentiating platform mates... ala Malibu/G6/9-3... or Impala / Monte Carlo / Grand Prix, et al.

They can also do a "decent" job of it... like TrailBlazer/Envoy/Ranier.

And then they can also do flat out badge engineering, such as Uplander/Relay/Terazza or Canyon/Colorado.

I was hoping the days of the Malibu/Cutlass look alikes were going away, but with Canyon/Colorado, the minvan triplets, and some others, I think it's here to stay. Torrent looks to be following that path as well, though I may put it in the "medium" range with TrailBlazer/Envoy/Ranier since it looks like it may actually have different headlights and such from the drawing.

 

Wonder what the 9-3 based Euro Cadillac will look like?

 

Ya, I was thinking about this a bit... if it doesn't follow the "Art & Science" theme... even if it is a non-N.A. car... it would really be the first confusing thing dropped into the new Cadillac lineup.

I would think it would look out of place to the European market as well... but, I guess it's a wait and see thing.