GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
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Joined: Jul 2002
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From: South Bend, Indiana
Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Originally Posted by Jason E
However, many people enjoy FWD for the inclement weather benefits. Put the same tires and same power in a FWD car and a RWD car, and the FWD car will, by nature, be better in snow every time. Now, I am all for RWD...but I can see some real, tangible benefits to FWD for many. As for the AWD argument, not EVERYONE wants to pay for AWD. And if that's what it takes to make a certain car line do well in snow, people up north and in snow climates may be unhappy with the increased cost, complexity and MPG deficit...
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Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Honda/Acura/Nissan also don't have 300+ lbs-ft of torque to handle. I hope it is a stop-gap until the top cars can go RWD or AWD. Knowing how quickly GM moves, it may be a while...
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From: Indianapolis, IN
Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Originally Posted by Beanboy
Honda/Acura/Nissan also don't have 300+ lbs-ft of torque to handle. I hope it is a stop-gap until the top cars can go RWD or AWD. Knowing how quickly GM moves, it may be a while...
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Would we rather have no GXP Grand Prix and have the same wait for whatever kick-*** cars come from Zeta? Or would we rather have the GXP available for now (with a more than adequate for a midsize/largish family sedan with a sporty flair 5.3L V8)?
Given that the Zeta will be coming in more or less a fixed amount of time, I vote for having some other cool FWD stuff in the meantime.
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From: Santa Clara, CA
Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Originally Posted by Gold_Rush
Honda/Acura went RWD with their NSX/S2000, and they went AWD with their 300hp 3.5L Acura RL. Honda/Acura specifically cited that they're already pretty much reached the limited of FWD in high hp, high performance applications. They do not have a sub-300hp FWD car. Nither does Nissan whose highest hp FWD car has an ouput south of 265hp and nowhere near the tq of the new v8 GXP.
Oh Btw, the biggest criticisim against the Maxima and Acura TL is that they're FWD. Infact, Acura has been flamed continuously, and their status as a Luxury marquee questioned, and even they will soon give the TL, etc.... AWD. Nissan's FWD 3.5 Altima and Maxima have been torched for their Tq steer. So no, they are NOT recieving praises for their FWD setup and niether will this new GXP.
Leave FWD to the underpowered 4 bangers and lower-output v6's and if you're going to give a car a serious motor, give it the matcing and right drive-wheel(s).
Oh Btw, the biggest criticisim against the Maxima and Acura TL is that they're FWD. Infact, Acura has been flamed continuously, and their status as a Luxury marquee questioned, and even they will soon give the TL, etc.... AWD. Nissan's FWD 3.5 Altima and Maxima have been torched for their Tq steer. So no, they are NOT recieving praises for their FWD setup and niether will this new GXP.
Leave FWD to the underpowered 4 bangers and lower-output v6's and if you're going to give a car a serious motor, give it the matcing and right drive-wheel(s).
I certainly wouldn't buy a FWD V8 GP, preferring instead to wait for a car with the proper drive wheels. But I've talked to people in Minnesota who would buy the FWD V8 car and are a little leery of a RWD car.
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Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Originally Posted by teal98
I certainly wouldn't buy a FWD V8 GP, preferring instead to wait for a car with the proper drive wheels. But I've talked to people in Minnesota who would buy the FWD V8 car and are a little leery of a RWD car.
Even IF the current Grand Prix was rear-wheel-drive, had GM's upcoming 6-speed automatic, and was priced competively (i.e. less than a 2006 Charger RT)....
....I still couldn't imagine buying such a badly packaged and dated-looking car.
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Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Originally Posted by teal98
Nissan is still selling quite a few of their 3.5 Maximas and Altimas, and Honda has sold a lot of their TLs. In all the tests I've seen they've complained most about torque steer in the manual transmission versions. C&D went as far as to say that they recommended the automatic in the TL, because there was much less torque steer. Since the FWD GP will be auto only, it should be okay, though not great.
And there's another problem, lack of manual tranny. That's what i hate about the Chrysler cars. You can't get a Hemi with a manual. A performance car has got to have a manual tranny option imo. Strike two
Originally Posted by teal98
I certainly wouldn't buy a FWD V8 GP, preferring instead to wait for a car with the proper drive wheels. But I've talked to people in Minnesota who would buy the FWD V8 car and are a little leery of a RWD car.
. But drop something like the 5.3L or 4.6 Northstar into a CTS, and i'd be all over it.
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Joined: Jul 2001
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From: Santa Clara, CA
Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Originally Posted by redzed
I wouldn't buy any Grand Prix, and the reason has more to do with the actual car than the drivetrain. The GP is a rotten sedan when you consider that it's way too cramped inside for its overly generous exterior dimensions. Worse yet, in the post-Chrysler 300C automotive landscape it looks positively ancient.
Even IF the current Grand Prix was rear-wheel-drive, had GM's upcoming 6-speed automatic, and was priced competively (i.e. less than a 2006 Charger RT)....
....I still couldn't imagine buying such a badly packaged and dated-looking car.
Even IF the current Grand Prix was rear-wheel-drive, had GM's upcoming 6-speed automatic, and was priced competively (i.e. less than a 2006 Charger RT)....
....I still couldn't imagine buying such a badly packaged and dated-looking car.
I would buy a RWD Malibu with a V8 or even a V6 (3.9 HV or 3.6 HF, it makes no difference to me). I like the looks and packaging of the Malibu. The Chrysler is a little too chopped for my tastes.
I would be more motivated to buy a GTO if it had four doors (I don't care what you call it). I think it's too bad that they only brought over the two door Holden.
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 3,376
From: Sarasota FL
Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Originally Posted by redzed
I wouldn't buy any Grand Prix, and the reason has more to do with the actual car than the drivetrain. The GP is a rotten sedan when you consider that it's way too cramped inside for its overly generous exterior dimensions. Worse yet, in the post-Chrysler 300C automotive landscape it looks positively ancient.
Even IF the current Grand Prix was rear-wheel-drive, had GM's upcoming 6-speed automatic, and was priced competively (i.e. less than a 2006 Charger RT)....
....I still couldn't imagine buying such a badly packaged and dated-looking car.
Even IF the current Grand Prix was rear-wheel-drive, had GM's upcoming 6-speed automatic, and was priced competively (i.e. less than a 2006 Charger RT)....
....I still couldn't imagine buying such a badly packaged and dated-looking car.
Still waiting on your critical analysis of your latest, superior automotive purchase, by the way...ever drive a GP? Or are we just spouting again?
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Joined: Mar 2001
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From: Sarasota FL
Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Also, I fail to see how the GP looks more "dated" than any other sedan. If you wanna call the back seat cramped then so be it...I know you probably learned that from Car and Driver some time ago 
But quite frankly, there is nothing "dated" about the styling of the car. You may love it or hate it (I frankly like the older style better), but there is nothing "dated" about it...
But quite frankly, there is nothing "dated" about the styling of the car. You may love it or hate it (I frankly like the older style better), but there is nothing "dated" about it...
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Joined: Nov 2001
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From: Payson, AZ USA
Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
As someone who has extensively test driven an automatic V6 Altima, all I can say is................ I sure hope GM can come up with some magic, or hocus pocus, because torque steer in that 240hp car was absolutally awful (I tested the first year of the Altima with the VQ engine).
If anyone ever drove one of the FWD diamond star turbo cars, they will understand what I mean. I actually thought the Altima was dangerous. When you got on it on an on ramp, it would almost jerk the steering wheel out of your hands (and I always use 2 hands when driving). At the same time, the steering felt so light, it almost felt as if you momentarily lost control of the front tires.
All in all, very scary.
I am not a fan of high hp FWD cars at all. That experience really drummed it into me. A good AWD system is not very expensive, and it does not come with much of a mpg cost. Just look at the Ford 500. The AWD version only suffers a loss of 1 mpg over the FWD version. Also, you can have an AWD version for about $25K. That is not expensive. If I was looking at a 300hp FWD car for about $30K, I would certainly be willing to pay an additional $1000-1500 more for AWD.
If anyone ever drove one of the FWD diamond star turbo cars, they will understand what I mean. I actually thought the Altima was dangerous. When you got on it on an on ramp, it would almost jerk the steering wheel out of your hands (and I always use 2 hands when driving). At the same time, the steering felt so light, it almost felt as if you momentarily lost control of the front tires.
All in all, very scary.
I am not a fan of high hp FWD cars at all. That experience really drummed it into me. A good AWD system is not very expensive, and it does not come with much of a mpg cost. Just look at the Ford 500. The AWD version only suffers a loss of 1 mpg over the FWD version. Also, you can have an AWD version for about $25K. That is not expensive. If I was looking at a 300hp FWD car for about $30K, I would certainly be willing to pay an additional $1000-1500 more for AWD.
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 574
From: Richmond, TX
Re: GM high-power FWD cars--Why?
Originally Posted by 94LightningGal
Snipped....
I am not a fan of high hp FWD cars at all. That experience really drummed it into me. A good AWD system is not very expensive, and it does not come with much of a mpg cost. Just look at the Ford 500. The AWD version only suffers a loss of 1 mpg over the FWD version. Also, you can have an AWD version for about $25K. That is not expensive. If I was looking at a 300hp FWD car for about $30K, I would certainly be willing to pay an additional $1000-1500 more for AWD.
I am not a fan of high hp FWD cars at all. That experience really drummed it into me. A good AWD system is not very expensive, and it does not come with much of a mpg cost. Just look at the Ford 500. The AWD version only suffers a loss of 1 mpg over the FWD version. Also, you can have an AWD version for about $25K. That is not expensive. If I was looking at a 300hp FWD car for about $30K, I would certainly be willing to pay an additional $1000-1500 more for AWD.
So that's where they put the money they saved on that crap 200hp pushrod V6. Sorry, but the 500 is about to become Ford's worst mistake of the 21st century.