Threxx

My point was that your definition of 'issue' sounds like you expect absolute perfection out of a vehicle, and that by your standards cars that most people are satisfied with would instead be a total POS.

I would tell most people my Aura has been a pretty good car so far, yet by your standards it's junk.

If you think this is a silly thread tangent, well, you're the guy who brought up quibbling issues with the Taco that this thread has nothing to do with.

E-**** +1.5"!

I am persistent but at least if I'm tired of talking about an issue or otherwise no longer feel I have a point I don't resort to pointlessly flaming the other person. I just quit replying. So yeah, try walking away next time.

LT1 PWRD

Typical import lover reply.

When faced with problems, it's easier to talk about the domestic cars having issues and downplaying the issues Toyota are having.

I mean, come on Kyle, the man owned or drove the damn truck and didn't like the way it behaved. Simple as that. Why bring your Saturn into this?

Everything is controlled electronically in today's cars. A cruise control that responds badly to a mild incline or a surging rpm at a stoplight when the compressor kicks in can all be dealt with to some degree.

I find that some Japanese vehicles tend to hunt for gears when under cruise control probably due to the lack of torque and the way they're calibrated.

95 Z/28 LT1

One thing that I've learned working for a large manufacturing company is that the supplier's problems are YOUR problems. It's BS to blame suppliers for problems when you have supplier development engineers, process control engineers, (or whatever Toyota calls them) in place to make sure things stay the way they are supposed to.

They're the ones that review part submission warrants, communicate with the PPAP coordinator and review PPAP documenation, and ensure that the supplier has the appropriate controls in place to keep the process stable. As soon as problems with parts start popping up, those people should be at the supplier, working with the supplier's engineers to understand the problem and ensuring it doesn't continue to happen. Just my opinion, but ultimately it's Toyota's fault, as they contract the parts from their suppliers and are responsible for the quality (or lack there of) they produce.

Threxx

Yep, that's why I just bought a Saturn. I loooooove imports.

I just don't automatically jump on Toyota's back like most of the rest of this forum. The last few days here have been such a 'kick toyota while they're down' orgy that some people have lost perspective on reality.

To show how trivial his complaints were... how I could be just as picky about my Saturn and make it sound like a POS, even though in my eyes it's still a fine car despite those things that I notice aren't completely ideal.


Guess that's why I love my saturn, because it acts like those imports that I love so much.

transam8

I can feel the love . Anyways getting back to the topic at hand, I'm interested in seeing this recall now. Many current generation Tacoma owners (I had an 06) have been complaining since the model's introduction about strange driveline vibrations. I know that mine was subject to it, as well as a friend's 07. It would mainly happen at highway speeds and felt as if the drive shaft were misbalanced. It was a somewhat unnerving feeling.There hadn't been a "fix" that I was aware of when I sold the truck. Overall I liked the truck, but it did have its share of "minor" annoyances.


-Mike

muckz

I find the Japanese seats in my Mazda3 rather uncomfortable. I try adjusting it a dozen different ways, but bottom line, it's just not for me. Poor lumbar support, and seats feel like they're built with cardboard.

muckz

Every supplier will go where the money is. As long as they get paid and continue to get used, they'll bear all sorts of crap. It's pretty competitive out there.

muckz

He bought a saturn and you call him an import lover? I don't see him dissing the saturn every day. Anyway.


There's a difference between not liking how something is, and whether that something is broken.

See, this stereotypical statement shows how out of touch you are. This is not 1990s anymore, and Japanese cars, from 4-cylinder engines to 6 and 8 have plenty of torque. Japanese started to outclass domestic carmakers with their 6 cylinder engines quite a number of years ago, in both horsepower AND torque. It's only now we're playing catch-up.

LT1 PWRD

Thanks for dissecting my post.

I believe I said that "some" japanese cars have these tendencies because of lower torque AND calibration. In the case of a Civic with the smaller 1.7l engine or a Toyota Matrix/Pontiac Vibe, I have found that the cruise controls could work "better". This is from my own personal experience from working 21+ years in the car industry and having owned or driven both of these cars. So I am not being out of touch or stereotyping.

I only shared my personal experience just the way Silverado C-10 did about the Tacoma but Kyle had to try and attack his credibility. There must be some history between those two.

The Saturn Aura is a great car and every car has its issues if we want to be picky. I also believe that without so much German/Swedish engineering GM's newer cars wouldn't be as good or respected as they have been recently and that Kyle would not have even considered buying one if it didn't have these European traits. And that is not a bad thing, I would have done the exact same thing.

I should not have called anybody an "import lover" but I have been on so many car forums recently with Toyota cheerleaders blaming anyone and everyone but Toyota for their troubles and will often downplay or dismiss the issues and then start pointing out the issues with domestic cars often bringing up recalls or quality issues from 20 years ago to re-enforce their argument and I'm quite frankly sick of it. Kyle's posts were almost starting to resemble that.

Threxx

I wasn't trying to attack his credibility (if anything I think the opposite happened with that one-liner reply of his a while back). I was addressing the validity of his complaints. As was mentioned there's a difference between something being broken on a car and something not being to your liking or designed and built to perfection.

I have a habit of only saying what's not being said that I think needs to be said. I've witnessed the fan boy behavior you're talking about on clublexus.com's carchat forum (a forum with a discussion scope similar to this one but obviously with a very different bias). A lot of the stuff I read about here I repeat over there and plenty of feathers get ruffled over as they like to believe that Toyota (and interestingly enough, Japan as a whole) is more or less perfect and only tainted by coming across imperfect US suppliers and labor.

LT1 PWRD

Alright, I agree with you wholeheartedly.

I've got an uncle that only buys Toyota because of Consumer's Reports and even though his Tacoma's frame was badly rusted with less than 6 years on the road and a rear-end that sounded like it was about to explode at every transmission shift, he keeps on buying Toyota because he assumes NA cars are all junk.

His last new domestic car was a 1983 Pontiac 6000LE so he has no idea just how good some domestic vehicles are now. He'll just keep finding excuses to give Toyota his money and downplay the many problems he has had with his Lexus, Tacoma, Avalon and his new Matrix.

Meanwhile GM's name has been dragged through the mud for the past 20 years, some of it justified and a lot of it not.

I think most Toyota bashers are obviously just fighting back because of that public's embrace of anything Japanese and the constant ridiculing of the D3 and the unfair and protectionist trade practices of Korean and Japanese manufacturers. It's hard to blame anyone that depends on the NA auto industry from being pissed off.

I call it as I see it and give credit where credit is due.

Ken S

Finally, I've read some dirt about the Tacoma's! lol It's strange the Colorado gets pounded in most reviews, but like this reviewer, Toyota gets almost a free pass on a choppy uncomfortable ride and higher price.

Threxx

What do they say is bad about the Colorado? I know reliability on them has been pretty poor on average and the interior is pretty cheap but reliability is rarely considered in new car reviews and the interior doesn't seem to matter as much when trucks get reviewed (though it does and should matter some).

I didn't realize the Taco had bad ride quality. I did read the Tundra's ride quality was worse than any of the big 3.

Our 4runner is actually pretty smooth... though you can still tell it's a truck. It shares its platform with the Taco but the 4runner uses a fully boxed frame from front to back... Taco doesn't. Our 4R also has the optional x-reas suspension made by yamaha which adjusts shock pressure using fluid transfer. Might be other differences underneath as well.

onebadponcho

I didn't realize that about the Tacoma either. Since my old man had bought a new Tacoma in 2005, I had quite a bit of seat time in that truck and was shopping them just after he bought his. Then I test drove a 2006 Tundra and it drove light-years better than his Tacoma or any full size truck I've driven or been in, so I ended up buying the Tundra. Therefore, I'm assuming when you're talking about the Tundra's ride quality, you're talking about the 2007-2010s, right?