$1MM of Mustangs Burned in Railcar Accident
05-03-2004, 07:48 AM
#46
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Originally posted by PacerX
Oh dear god...
I've got to be politically correct towards cars now...
Aren't there more important things in life to get all worked up about???
Oh dear god...
I've got to be politically correct towards cars now...
Aren't there more important things in life to get all worked up about???
It's a free world... enjoy it.
05-03-2004, 07:50 AM
#47
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Originally posted by ProudPony
You don't have to do anything.
It's a free world... enjoy it.
You don't have to do anything.
It's a free world... enjoy it.
...given the rate they do so, I may need more.
05-03-2004, 08:25 AM
#48
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Originally posted by Darth Xed
Proud,
Over the time you've been here, I've agreed with you, I've disagreed with you, and I've respected you... but you are going waaaaaay overboard here.
It's not like anyone here is walking up to the owner(s) of the car(s) and pointing his finger in his face and laughing at him.
I'm sure the car(s) were insured, so the monetary loss will be minimal. Yes, the cars are probably gone, but you know what? That happens everyday, everywhere... maybe not in such a publicized, or dramatic fashion, but it happens.
I am 31 years old, and I respect the cars. My father-in-law has a car collection that consists of over 10 Corvettes (Many Bloomington Gold winners), 4 Camaros, a Chevelle, a Firebird, a Mustang, and a Challenger. I rarely talk about them, because 1) they are not mine, though I am very proud of them, and 2) I don't want to sound arrogant or anything to that fact, even though, again, they are not mine. I think one of the few times I even mentioned them was when one of the Bloomingotn Gold winning cars he restored was put on eBay by a 3rd party.
Now, I do NOT think it'd be funny if something happened to even ONE of the cars in the collection. Heck, I go out and look at the cars for no reason, and I've seen them a million times... my wife laughs at me.
About 2 weekends ago, we were cutting down 3 VERY VERY LARGE oaks trees, whose bases had started to rot to the point of it being a hazard and could fall on the building that all the cars are stored in. My wife's uncle came over with the chain saws, and he and my father-in-law began to cut down the HUGE trees (I'm talking EASILY 100+ ft high trees). They were on the edge of the tree line, and very close to the building where the cars are (within 15 feet).
After the 1st one was down, the second one didn't fall exactly where it was supposed to (and my wife's uncle has cut down hundreds of trees, so he knows what he is doing), now, that second tree actually hit the building, destroyed the gutter, and tore up some shingles on the roof... it could have been catastrophic if the tree had fallen just 1 foot more to the right... the roof would have likely caved in, smashing most, if not all of the cars, not to mention his shop with the lift and all his other equipment.
After it fell, and we were all VERY stunned and stared at each other in silence for a good 10 seconds, but then we all had a good LAUGH about it... took down the 3rd tree, and moved on.
So, I don't think anyone here is 'disrespecting' the car(s) or their owner(s), because of making tongue-in-cheek Mustang or Ford jokes... take a look at my first post (which happens to be the FIRST reponse in this thread... what was the first thing I said? "Glad no one was hurt"... because that is what REALLY matters...)
Proud,
Over the time you've been here, I've agreed with you, I've disagreed with you, and I've respected you... but you are going waaaaaay overboard here.
It's not like anyone here is walking up to the owner(s) of the car(s) and pointing his finger in his face and laughing at him.
I'm sure the car(s) were insured, so the monetary loss will be minimal. Yes, the cars are probably gone, but you know what? That happens everyday, everywhere... maybe not in such a publicized, or dramatic fashion, but it happens.
I am 31 years old, and I respect the cars. My father-in-law has a car collection that consists of over 10 Corvettes (Many Bloomington Gold winners), 4 Camaros, a Chevelle, a Firebird, a Mustang, and a Challenger. I rarely talk about them, because 1) they are not mine, though I am very proud of them, and 2) I don't want to sound arrogant or anything to that fact, even though, again, they are not mine. I think one of the few times I even mentioned them was when one of the Bloomingotn Gold winning cars he restored was put on eBay by a 3rd party.
Now, I do NOT think it'd be funny if something happened to even ONE of the cars in the collection. Heck, I go out and look at the cars for no reason, and I've seen them a million times... my wife laughs at me.
About 2 weekends ago, we were cutting down 3 VERY VERY LARGE oaks trees, whose bases had started to rot to the point of it being a hazard and could fall on the building that all the cars are stored in. My wife's uncle came over with the chain saws, and he and my father-in-law began to cut down the HUGE trees (I'm talking EASILY 100+ ft high trees). They were on the edge of the tree line, and very close to the building where the cars are (within 15 feet).
After the 1st one was down, the second one didn't fall exactly where it was supposed to (and my wife's uncle has cut down hundreds of trees, so he knows what he is doing), now, that second tree actually hit the building, destroyed the gutter, and tore up some shingles on the roof... it could have been catastrophic if the tree had fallen just 1 foot more to the right... the roof would have likely caved in, smashing most, if not all of the cars, not to mention his shop with the lift and all his other equipment.
After it fell, and we were all VERY stunned and stared at each other in silence for a good 10 seconds, but then we all had a good LAUGH about it... took down the 3rd tree, and moved on.
So, I don't think anyone here is 'disrespecting' the car(s) or their owner(s), because of making tongue-in-cheek Mustang or Ford jokes... take a look at my first post (which happens to be the FIRST reponse in this thread... what was the first thing I said? "Glad no one was hurt"... because that is what REALLY matters...)
I too enjoy your perspective on things, and it is obvious you are in-the-know about cars.
Your knowledge of things-Mustang, as well as all cars has impressed me quite often on this board, and I understand that you have true interest in ponycars and muscle cars - it shows.
But I go back to the comment I made about Trent Lott...
Knowing when to be humorous and in what ways is often more important than the humor itself.
I recall your input into "cleaning up" the Camaro's redneck stigma, improving the reputation Camaro owners have (internet or otherwise). This kind of "humor" at the expense of some car collectors (not unlike your Father-in-law) doesn't help the cause. Abstinence... not always a bad thing.
Go back and look at the regulars here who DIDN'T post during all the pot-shots...
And yes, I'm sure they were reading it too, they just chose not to participate.
YOU ARE CORRECT - nobody got hurt and that comes first.
Maybe the cars were insured - maybe not. Even if they were, they will never be "replaced". A mint, low-miles unrestored 1968 Shelby GT500KR simply cannot be found on E-bay every day - and once it's burned, it's gone. No resto, regardless of the detail put into it, will replace "unrestored" examples, ever.
Look Darth, if this was in the lounge, I'd feel WAY out of place with posts like my last few. In fact, I'd expect the pot-shots from trolls, brand loyals, and thoughtless people who know nothing about ponycars and the like. But in HERE, where we are all "car guys" who are deep and passionate about these ponycars and such - well, I just expected better than what got posted. My bad for holding high expectations for those who come in here regularly...
'Nuf said - I am withdrawing from this little debate on ethics.
I am not personally offended - they weren't my cars.
But they were somebody's cars, and I feel for whomever lost them that way.
Game over, all done.
All I wanted to know was what's in the boxcar - that's why I posted in here, hoping maybe guionM or someone on the west coast could find something out or heard it in the news there. I found a link to a News4 live broadcast from the scene that morning - I watched the mpeg of the coverage too - but they were there right after the fire was put out about 8AM, and didn't have any images or a list of cars to publish. I still haven't found out what all was lost.
05-03-2004, 08:29 AM
#49
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Originally posted by PacerX
Good. I've got some pretty good cracks stored up for the next time a bunch of Fords burst into flames...
...given the rate they do so, I may need more.
Good. I've got some pretty good cracks stored up for the next time a bunch of Fords burst into flames...
...given the rate they do so, I may need more.
Knock yourself out... it's your keyboard!
05-03-2004, 09:49 AM
#50
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Originally posted by ProudPony
All I wanted to know was what's in the boxcar - that's why I posted in here, hoping maybe guionM or someone on the west coast could find something out or heard it in the news there. I found a link to a News4 live broadcast from the scene that morning - I watched the mpeg of the coverage too - but they were there right after the fire was put out about 8AM, and didn't have any images or a list of cars to publish. I still haven't found out what all was lost.
All I wanted to know was what's in the boxcar - that's why I posted in here, hoping maybe guionM or someone on the west coast could find something out or heard it in the news there. I found a link to a News4 live broadcast from the scene that morning - I watched the mpeg of the coverage too - but they were there right after the fire was put out about 8AM, and didn't have any images or a list of cars to publish. I still haven't found out what all was lost.
Not sure if I believe it, since production hasn't started yet.http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/Stor...110119,00.html
05-03-2004, 11:38 AM
#51
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Originally posted by Z284ever
This story says that they were actually 15 '05 Mustangs on their way to dealers.
Not sure if I believe it, since production hasn't started yet.http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/Stor...110119,00.html
This story says that they were actually 15 '05 Mustangs on their way to dealers.
Not sure if I believe it, since production hasn't started yet.http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/Stor...110119,00.html
I have been trying to find a "follow-up" type story that might have some pics of the cars or something, but no luck yet.
Here's a link to NBC affiliate in LA that sent a reporter to the scene as it was burning. They have an .mpeg of the report that has file footage, but I can't make anything out because it was dark and the boxcar is semi-enclosed.
I am a little confused as to why the fire inspector (Osorio) quoted "He said the cars were probably heading to an auto dealer in Los Angeles, but did not know for sure."
-- Old classics headed to an auto dealer?
-- Even if it was a classic dealer, who buys 15-20 at a time, and ships them all on rail?
Something fishy about that... I am guessing the fire guy just wanted a quote in the paper, and has NO IDEA what he is talking about there.
Still, it would be nice to know what they were.
05-03-2004, 02:30 PM
#52
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Originally posted by ProudPony
I too enjoy your perspective on things, and it is obvious you are in-the-know about cars.
Your knowledge of things-Mustang, as well as all cars has impressed me quite often on this board, and I understand that you have true interest in ponycars and muscle cars - it shows.
But I go back to the comment I made about Trent Lott...
Knowing when to be humorous and in what ways is often more important than the humor itself.
I recall your input into "cleaning up" the Camaro's redneck stigma, improving the reputation Camaro owners have (internet or otherwise). This kind of "humor" at the expense of some car collectors (not unlike your Father-in-law) doesn't help the cause. Abstinence... not always a bad thing.
Go back and look at the regulars here who DIDN'T post during all the pot-shots...
And yes, I'm sure they were reading it too, they just chose not to participate.
YOU ARE CORRECT - nobody got hurt and that comes first.
Maybe the cars were insured - maybe not. Even if they were, they will never be "replaced". A mint, low-miles unrestored 1968 Shelby GT500KR simply cannot be found on E-bay every day - and once it's burned, it's gone. No resto, regardless of the detail put into it, will replace "unrestored" examples, ever.
Look Darth, if this was in the lounge, I'd feel WAY out of place with posts like my last few. In fact, I'd expect the pot-shots from trolls, brand loyals, and thoughtless people who know nothing about ponycars and the like. But in HERE, where we are all "car guys" who are deep and passionate about these ponycars and such - well, I just expected better than what got posted. My bad for holding high expectations for those who come in here regularly...
'Nuf said - I am withdrawing from this little debate on ethics.
I am not personally offended - they weren't my cars.
But they were somebody's cars, and I feel for whomever lost them that way.
Game over, all done.
All I wanted to know was what's in the boxcar - that's why I posted in here, hoping maybe guionM or someone on the west coast could find something out or heard it in the news there. I found a link to a News4 live broadcast from the scene that morning - I watched the mpeg of the coverage too - but they were there right after the fire was put out about 8AM, and didn't have any images or a list of cars to publish. I still haven't found out what all was lost.
I too enjoy your perspective on things, and it is obvious you are in-the-know about cars.
Your knowledge of things-Mustang, as well as all cars has impressed me quite often on this board, and I understand that you have true interest in ponycars and muscle cars - it shows.
But I go back to the comment I made about Trent Lott...
Knowing when to be humorous and in what ways is often more important than the humor itself.
I recall your input into "cleaning up" the Camaro's redneck stigma, improving the reputation Camaro owners have (internet or otherwise). This kind of "humor" at the expense of some car collectors (not unlike your Father-in-law) doesn't help the cause. Abstinence... not always a bad thing.
Go back and look at the regulars here who DIDN'T post during all the pot-shots...
And yes, I'm sure they were reading it too, they just chose not to participate.
YOU ARE CORRECT - nobody got hurt and that comes first.
Maybe the cars were insured - maybe not. Even if they were, they will never be "replaced". A mint, low-miles unrestored 1968 Shelby GT500KR simply cannot be found on E-bay every day - and once it's burned, it's gone. No resto, regardless of the detail put into it, will replace "unrestored" examples, ever.
Look Darth, if this was in the lounge, I'd feel WAY out of place with posts like my last few. In fact, I'd expect the pot-shots from trolls, brand loyals, and thoughtless people who know nothing about ponycars and the like. But in HERE, where we are all "car guys" who are deep and passionate about these ponycars and such - well, I just expected better than what got posted. My bad for holding high expectations for those who come in here regularly...
'Nuf said - I am withdrawing from this little debate on ethics.
I am not personally offended - they weren't my cars.
But they were somebody's cars, and I feel for whomever lost them that way.
Game over, all done.
All I wanted to know was what's in the boxcar - that's why I posted in here, hoping maybe guionM or someone on the west coast could find something out or heard it in the news there. I found a link to a News4 live broadcast from the scene that morning - I watched the mpeg of the coverage too - but they were there right after the fire was put out about 8AM, and didn't have any images or a list of cars to publish. I still haven't found out what all was lost.
I have no problem with your view on it, my only problem was the sweeping statement that those who are able to find a small bit of humor in it (and by "it" I don't even mean the cars getting destroyed, I mean the set of ironic circumstances that occurred) are sweepingly labeled "not true car guys" or "bad" for that reason alone, which you did, and then Z284ever follow-up with.
If they were GM cars in there, I'd probably turn my Pinto remark into a Fiero remark... gets the same joke across.
To me saying there was a bumper sticker on the boxcar that said "Pinto on Board" is no different than people joking that a fire extinguisher was sold with every Pinto, or that Aztek's look like angry refigerators.
No making fun of anyone's personal misfortune, or the fact that cars may have been destroyed, juts a playful jab at the Ford guys, which is why *I* brought your name into it... I figured you'd have a witty reply for me....
05-03-2004, 08:46 PM
#53
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Originally posted by PacerX
Good. I've got some pretty good cracks stored up for the next time a bunch of Fords burst into flames...
...given the rate they do so, I may need more.
Good. I've got some pretty good cracks stored up for the next time a bunch of Fords burst into flames...
...given the rate they do so, I may need more.
05-03-2004, 11:00 PM
#54
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Location: Chicagoland IL
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Originally posted by Darth Xed
Fair enough.
I have no problem with your view on it, my only problem was the sweeping statement that those who are able to find a small bit of humor in it (and by "it" I don't even mean the cars getting destroyed, I mean the set of ironic circumstances that occurred) are sweepingly labeled "not true car guys" or "bad" for that reason alone, which you did, and then Z284ever follow-up with.
Fair enough.
I have no problem with your view on it, my only problem was the sweeping statement that those who are able to find a small bit of humor in it (and by "it" I don't even mean the cars getting destroyed, I mean the set of ironic circumstances that occurred) are sweepingly labeled "not true car guys" or "bad" for that reason alone, which you did, and then Z284ever follow-up with.
In addition to being a gearhead...I'm also an aviation buff. When one of the few remaining flying Warbirds are lost , through accidents or fire, it's an irreplaceable loss.
Afew years ago a Boeing B-29 was found intact, buried in the glacier ice....where it had been for 50 years. Because...at the time...there were only one or two of these historical aircraft still flying, a volunteer team was dispatched to save it. They spent one year on site, digging it out and repairing it to flyable condition. As they were preparing for take-off, an engine caught fire...and the B-29 burned to the ground. An irreplaceable loss.
An aviation enthusiast would not say..."GOOD, let's burn the other B-29 left in the world, I'm a Lockheed fan, not a Boeing fan".
05-04-2004, 12:12 AM
#55
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Posts: 1,313
Originally posted by Darth Xed
Someone place a call with Dr. Phil... I think we have a few overly sesnsative members that need some councilling.
Someone place a call with Dr. Phil... I think we have a few overly sesnsative members that need some councilling.
. Lol, dude’s hardcore, hehe. Example of taking the chevy vs Ford rivalry a bit too seriously
. And this happens on both sides of the fence so it isn’t limited to the rabid bowtie fans. So does this Dr. Phil council rabid and overzealous (and to an extent brand-****) members as well??
Kill two birds with one stone.
05-04-2004, 07:25 AM
#56
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One side note on the 'irreplacable' part of this topic, where if the car is, let's say, a 1969 Dodge Super Bee "M" code as an example.
If that car happened to be on the train, and destroyed, but simply the VIN plate were saved, you could actually transfer that VIN plate to a non "M" Super Bee, put the right parts on it, and have a 'legitimate' Super Bee 440 Six Pack.
It's been done... probably more than people think... and these cars are accepted as original, and, if done properly, no one would ever know.
Is it the same as an all original car? No, not in my book, but if it has been done well, even experts on the particular car wouldn't be able to tell... so, that 'irreplacable' car was just replaced.
If that car happened to be on the train, and destroyed, but simply the VIN plate were saved, you could actually transfer that VIN plate to a non "M" Super Bee, put the right parts on it, and have a 'legitimate' Super Bee 440 Six Pack.
It's been done... probably more than people think... and these cars are accepted as original, and, if done properly, no one would ever know.
Is it the same as an all original car? No, not in my book, but if it has been done well, even experts on the particular car wouldn't be able to tell... so, that 'irreplacable' car was just replaced.
05-04-2004, 09:13 AM
#57
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Originally posted by Darth Xed
One side note on the 'irreplacable' part of this topic, where if the car is, let's say, a 1969 Dodge Super Bee "M" code as an example.
If that car happened to be on the train, and destroyed, but simply the VIN plate were saved, you could actually transfer that VIN plate to a non "M" Super Bee, put the right parts on it, and have a 'legitimate' Super Bee 440 Six Pack.
It's been done... probably more than people think... and these cars are accepted as original, and, if done properly, no one would ever know.
Is it the same as an all original car? No, not in my book, but if it has been done well, even experts on the particular car wouldn't be able to tell... so, that 'irreplacable' car was just replaced.
One side note on the 'irreplacable' part of this topic, where if the car is, let's say, a 1969 Dodge Super Bee "M" code as an example.
If that car happened to be on the train, and destroyed, but simply the VIN plate were saved, you could actually transfer that VIN plate to a non "M" Super Bee, put the right parts on it, and have a 'legitimate' Super Bee 440 Six Pack.
It's been done... probably more than people think... and these cars are accepted as original, and, if done properly, no one would ever know.
Is it the same as an all original car? No, not in my book, but if it has been done well, even experts on the particular car wouldn't be able to tell... so, that 'irreplacable' car was just replaced.
You'll NEVER pull that off with a Mustang though.
Several reasons....
1) The VIN number is stamped all over the car - its on the inner fenders, shock towers, inside the trunk area, and elsewhere, depending on the year/model and the plant it was assembled in, but it's all over them regardless. You'd have to do some serious cut/weld patchwork to replace them all.
2) The more rare units typically have registries - have had for some time. There are Shelby Registries, Boss 429 Registries, Boss 302 Registries, 428CJ Registry, High Country Special registry, California Special Registry, etc. etc. These groups are tightly knit, and they monitor what goes on pretty close. If a car is lost - it WILL be noted so. This stems from people cloning Shelbys back in the '80's and passing them off as real ones for huge profits.
3) The VIN is also stamped on the block and transmission of every Ford Mustang (every car/truck period FTM) using a special font to avoid counterfeiters. If you know where to look, you can see the numbers without too much trouble.
4) Even all the body panels (front fenders included) are date-stamped and should coincide with the build date of the car by within a day or two (allowance for weekend downtimes). For example, you might see 7C19 stamped on the bottom of the door. It breaks down as follows...
1st digit - the last year of the decade (7 could be 1957, 1967, 1977, 1987, etc),
2nd digit - C is the 3rd letter of the alphabet, and corresponds to the 3rd monthof the year - March
3rd and 4th digits - represent the day of that month
So 7C19 means the 19th of March, 19x7. This should coincide with the same date code stamped on the VIN and Door Data Plate for the car... if they don't, something's bad wrong.
5) 1987 and later Ford vehicles have a tamperproof sticker on EVERY body panel that has the VIN legibly visible. You can tell at a glance if a hood, door, fender, or any other body part has been replaced.
I understand what you are saying, and you are right to a point.
But for a high-dollar collectible - something you might see at Barrett-Jackson or Kruse Auctions - it MUST be correct.
I'll tell you for certain... give me a small flashlite, a Q-tip, and 3 minutes, and I'll tell you if the Mustang in front of me is all vintage original, or a hodge-podge of peices reassembled as one unit, and my monetary offer for the car will reflect my findings.
Doesn't matter if it's an '04 Mach or a 1965 Coupe.
My buddy GoatCrazy has enlightened me that old vintage Pontiacs don't offer the same level of traceability, and I assume many GM brands are similar. I understand that some aspects can be traced, but not down to the individual body and chassis stampings. I still have much to learn regarding GM's marking techniques, and I know even less about Mopars.
05-04-2004, 09:28 AM
#59
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Originally posted by ProudPony
In your example, that may be VERY true.
You'll NEVER pull that off with a Mustang though.
Several reasons....
1) The VIN number is stamped all over the car - its on the inner fenders, shock towers, inside the trunk area, and elsewhere, depending on the year/model and the plant it was assembled in, but it's all over them regardless. You'd have to do some serious cut/weld patchwork to replace them all.
2) The more rare units typically have registries - have had for some time. There are Shelby Registries, Boss 429 Registries, Boss 302 Registries, 428CJ Registry, High Country Special registry, California Special Registry, etc. etc. These groups are tightly knit, and they monitor what goes on pretty close. If a car is lost - it WILL be noted so. This stems from people cloning Shelbys back in the '80's and passing them off as real ones for huge profits.
3) The VIN is also stamped on the block and transmission of every Ford Mustang (every car/truck period FTM) using a special font to avoid counterfeiters. If you know where to look, you can see the numbers without too much trouble.
4) Even all the body panels (front fenders included) are date-stamped and should coincide with the build date of the car by within a day or two (allowance for weekend downtimes). For example, you might see 7C19 stamped on the bottom of the door. It breaks down as follows...
1st digit - the last year of the decade (7 could be 1957, 1967, 1977, 1987, etc),
2nd digit - C is the 3rd letter of the alphabet, and corresponds to the 3rd monthof the year - March
3rd and 4th digits - represent the day of that month
So 7C19 means the 19th of March, 19x7. This should coincide with the same date code stamped on the VIN and Door Data Plate for the car... if they don't, something's bad wrong.
5) 1987 and later Ford vehicles have a tamperproof sticker on EVERY body panel that has the VIN legibly visible. You can tell at a glance if a hood, door, fender, or any other body part has been replaced.
I understand what you are saying, and you are right to a point.
But for a high-dollar collectible - something you might see at Barrett-Jackson or Kruse Auctions - it MUST be correct.
I'll tell you for certain... give me a small flashlite, a Q-tip, and 3 minutes, and I'll tell you if the Mustang in front of me is all vintage original, or a hodge-podge of peices reassembled as one unit, and my monetary offer for the car will reflect my findings.
Doesn't matter if it's an '04 Mach or a 1965 Coupe.
My buddy GoatCrazy has enlightened me that old vintage Pontiacs don't offer the same level of traceability, and I assume many GM brands are similar. I understand that some aspects can be traced, but not down to the individual body and chassis stampings. I still have much to learn regarding GM's marking techniques, and I know even less about Mopars.
In your example, that may be VERY true.
You'll NEVER pull that off with a Mustang though.
Several reasons....
1) The VIN number is stamped all over the car - its on the inner fenders, shock towers, inside the trunk area, and elsewhere, depending on the year/model and the plant it was assembled in, but it's all over them regardless. You'd have to do some serious cut/weld patchwork to replace them all.
2) The more rare units typically have registries - have had for some time. There are Shelby Registries, Boss 429 Registries, Boss 302 Registries, 428CJ Registry, High Country Special registry, California Special Registry, etc. etc. These groups are tightly knit, and they monitor what goes on pretty close. If a car is lost - it WILL be noted so. This stems from people cloning Shelbys back in the '80's and passing them off as real ones for huge profits.
3) The VIN is also stamped on the block and transmission of every Ford Mustang (every car/truck period FTM) using a special font to avoid counterfeiters. If you know where to look, you can see the numbers without too much trouble.
4) Even all the body panels (front fenders included) are date-stamped and should coincide with the build date of the car by within a day or two (allowance for weekend downtimes). For example, you might see 7C19 stamped on the bottom of the door. It breaks down as follows...
1st digit - the last year of the decade (7 could be 1957, 1967, 1977, 1987, etc),
2nd digit - C is the 3rd letter of the alphabet, and corresponds to the 3rd monthof the year - March
3rd and 4th digits - represent the day of that month
So 7C19 means the 19th of March, 19x7. This should coincide with the same date code stamped on the VIN and Door Data Plate for the car... if they don't, something's bad wrong.
5) 1987 and later Ford vehicles have a tamperproof sticker on EVERY body panel that has the VIN legibly visible. You can tell at a glance if a hood, door, fender, or any other body part has been replaced.
I understand what you are saying, and you are right to a point.
But for a high-dollar collectible - something you might see at Barrett-Jackson or Kruse Auctions - it MUST be correct.
I'll tell you for certain... give me a small flashlite, a Q-tip, and 3 minutes, and I'll tell you if the Mustang in front of me is all vintage original, or a hodge-podge of peices reassembled as one unit, and my monetary offer for the car will reflect my findings.
Doesn't matter if it's an '04 Mach or a 1965 Coupe.
My buddy GoatCrazy has enlightened me that old vintage Pontiacs don't offer the same level of traceability, and I assume many GM brands are similar. I understand that some aspects can be traced, but not down to the individual body and chassis stampings. I still have much to learn regarding GM's marking techniques, and I know even less about Mopars.
It would definately depend on the type of car and level of 'tracability'.
Obviously, you know your stuff when it comes to Mustangs.
We went and looked at a 69 Super Bee 440 Six Pack a few weeks ago (reason I used it as an example... was fresh in my head) It was supposed to be "all together, except the engine was pulled."
When we got there, we got to see the pulled engine.... along with the fenders, wrong transmission, rusted flywheel, "some" of the brake parts... and misc other junk.... the rest of the car was 40 miles away in another building.
After looking at the 'original' 440 block, the date codes were an eyebrow raiser. Seemed to be too early, but might have been close enough... was real borderline though.
When we went to see the body, the trim tag said it was a Hemi Orange colored car... which was a mid-year addition to the color pallette, therefore making the engine block, without a doubt, too early...
The VIN tag WAS a legit "M" car (very rare), but it was just so far gone, you'd be so far upside down in the restoration, it wouldn't be worth it.
Almost everything we look at (and by "we" I mean mostly my father-in-law, lol) is GM though, so we were kind of winging it on the Super Bee...
Anyway... I think I've really gone off topic.