And another point, I'd prefer an 89 with an LT1 over an LS1 F-body. The LS1 has no ***** down low, sounds terrible and the car itself is too buldgy.

Clearly I am for thirdgens. But I like my car too. I might buy a thirdgen just to do this swap one day.

I grew up with 3rd gens. Knight Rider is what got me into cars... that and my brothers first car was an 89 firebird and it eventually became my first car... and the first one I ever drove.

 

Looks are subjective but I have a feeling you are in the minority on that one. The LS1 WS6 look is very popular. I'm not sure how the TTA "handles" because I never drove one. But it's probably not "WAY" better. And even if it is that's what aftermarket suspension is for anyway. That and better traction at the track.

I gotta see proof on this one. Bolt on LS1 record is in the 10's and the world record is in the 6's. Show me some links that prove the TTA can beat that and then I will believe it has better modding potential then the LS1.

Only because you are predudice against the LS1, hence your username and general attitude towards any ls1 fbody.

Actually that's incorrect. The A4 can be quicker (ET wise) but not faster (trap speed) due to the fact that the manuals have less drivetrain HP loss then the automatics.

It's your LS1 bias that is speaking here. The LS1 sounds nothing like a V6. V6's sound like crap but a LS1 sounds very good especially with LT's and a nice cam.

Here is me making a pass last weekend. This sounds like a V6? Yes that is a retorical question.

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/1...The_187519.htm

LTWHAT <--- Just as bad

Again, your bias is speaking here. The LS1 makes great power and torque down low. It just peaks higher then the LT1 making it "seem" like the LT1 is quicker. But in reality it isn't. A stock LS1 can hang with a stock LT1 off the line, beat it in the 1/8 mile and obviously do a number on it in the 1/4 mile. With equal gears, trannies and drivers of course.

Listen to my car again.

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/1...The_187519.htm

That deep choppy rumble is a thing of beauty

I grew up with smokey and the bandit. That was a hot looking car! But unfortunately the motors sucked. I like the LS1 TA better. But someday I would love to do a LSx swap into a black 76 TA. That would be cool

 

I don't care how popular a car I buy is. Matter of fact, I'd rather drive the unpopular.

Third gens pulled more Gs on the skidpad stock than the 4th gens. Why argue non stock vs stock? Sounds like an excuse for losing.

Not the record:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kwqJO...eature=related
Can't find a bolt on record for the motor.

Me not caring about a resale value of a car I buy has nothing to do with LS1s. That is the most ludicrous thing I have ever heard. My world does not revolve around Ls1s. Your's seems to. That was the most inept thing I've seen posted in a LONG time.

Oh god. Ok an A4 will out drag an M6. Sorry I didn't get your lingo right.

Rhetorical or not, yes the motor sounded V6ish at the line. It sounded good for an LS1 otherwise, but still didn't sound great.

Perhaps if I heard your car again, I'd fall in love with it and then I'd care about resale of my car and bike. Oh MY GOD!! YOU POSTED IT TWICE!! I got to hear it again in the same post! I'm a changed man! You are so right, your ls1 is god's gift to me now! I need to sell my car/bike and buy something with better resale! I have just the car in mind! Hint: It was made from 98-02!

Seriously, you aren't making good points here. You are trying to change my opinion and failing.

What LS1 owners fail to realize is that just because your car is the most incredible thing on the planet TO YOU, doesn't mean others have to view it as so as well. Your chosen platform is FAR from the end all be all. I had the opportunity to buy an LS1 car and I chose to get mine for my personal taste. You can't dissuade me. I don't like your car, and I hate the general attitude from the owners.

Your motor is better, sure. But that doesn't mean I like it or want it or need it.

 

Oh and I missed that last one.

You think your motor is better than a big block? Funny.

 

Definately not. But I like it better then a V6.

 

Good Vid. But not evidence that a TTA takes to mods better then an LS1.

Actually, my world revolves around my wife and kids. The car is just a toy. A fun toy.

No biggie.

My car sounds nothing like a V6. Nothing. But I already knew you wouldn't like it because it's a LS1. A lot of people compliment the way my car sounds. To each his own.

Lets keep this a little more civil. LSWHO is not going to like LS1's. I get that. I think everyone gets that.

Again, lets keep this civil. I have had and like both cars. I just prefer the LS1. Does that really make me so bad?

Absolutely.

 

All of that was civil.

And the video I showed was the same motor if not the regular GN motor going just as fast as the "fastest LS1 ever." I'd say that pretty much took care of your LS1 "world record is in the 6's" statement in regards to the motors potential. The TTA was a more capable car than the GN too.

 

We'll have to agree to disagree on that. Two of the paragraghs seemed kind of high schoolish for lack of a better term.

The video you showed was awesome. But the worlds record is 6.86 @ 205 so your vid did nothing to prove to me that the 89 TTA has more modding potential. And again, I would love to see how an 89 TTA could compete in bolt on compition where the LS1 record is 10.8 @ 122.

Well this has been fun but I'm heading off to the track now. Weather is in the low 50's right now so if the track can hook I might get a new best ET and trap tonight.

I'll check for your reply either late tonight or first thing in the morning. In the meantime, have a great evening.

Wish me luck tonight! Yeah, I know. It was a joke

 

I've driven both. One thing I missed in all of this is intial buy. You can pick up a lt1 car for 2500-4500 in strong shape. Same condition Ls1 will go for 6000-7000. So do I get to use those dollars I saved to compare my car to your car?
I figure if i have 6 in my pocket spend 25, that leavesme with 3500 to play with. No apples to apples for comparisons sake but it is realworld.Mines up for sale. Best time for me is a 7.71.(all motor) Total cash put into my car and upgrades is just under 2300.00, beat me dollar for dollar. I sitll get mid 20's on the highway with windows down and t tops out. Now that i've stated what i have...what i want is m6 ls1. simple. They are rowdy fast. But.....I need 6 G's to get a good one.

 

Well? How'd you do?

 

Good and bad. I was an hour late getting there because I decided to pull the front sway bar off (new era offered to pull if for me for free so thank you John and Mike as that was most generous). First pass was about 7:15 PM and I had no idea if the track would hook or not so I went 2000 rpm brake stall and floored it. Tires spun for about the first 10 feet and then grabbed. Ended up being a 1.68 60' and 11.800 @ 114.

This actually got me excited. I was less then half a tenth away from a new PB and that was on a bad launch. Second time up I went with a 2000 brake stall but went with 3/4 throttle. I still spun and had a 11.9 @ 115.

I was just about to pull into the burnout box for my third attempt when the track officials signaled for me and the guy next to me to shut down. Ten minutes later they announced that due to cold and dangerous track conditions they are switching to 1/8 mile. The air temp was well into the 40's by then and some of the single digit cars were having problems on the top end.

DOH!

That was it for me. I had no desire to run the eigth mile when the car wasn't hooking well off the line anyway so I called it a night. Oh well. There is still next Friday and two more Sunday Afternoons before the track closes. I got three more shots at a new best in fall weather.

 

I disagree and have proven your "theory" wrong at the track on many occasions. I usually run at an 1/8th mile track and that's where LT1s shine and LS1s haven't gathered enough steam. I've driven a rock stock auto 3.23 LT1 Z28 to back-to-back 8.90s where the Ls1s were struggling to get out of the 9s. The low end torque gives the LT1 more grunt(stock for stock), but the LS1 tends to make more mph, hence more rwhp. In the quarter, the LS1 is usually the victor, but not "doing a number" on the LT1. I've seen rock stock LT1s run 13.5s and rock stock LS1s run 13.1s, but neither are typical. Yes, I'm an LT1 fan, but I respect the LS1s. But I don't like the cocky attitude that occomplanies many LS1 owners. To each his own, but don't look at every LT1 or it's owner as slow. I've owned 9 LT1 camaros and could have easily bought an LS1. I chose the LT1, even though it is slower(stock for stock), but becasue I came to like the body style better and learned more tricks as years went on. That's what i like, but I don't hate on the LS1s or think they are slow even though I can beat them stock for stock in the 1/8th.

 

i agree , its not the LS1 I dislike, infact HUGE fan. Its that cocky attitude. The one that comes with a comment like. You have a LT1? Sorry...Ha ha ha. You're right 1/8 mile my lt1 shines. I'd run 1/4 but the nearest one is to far away. I hold my own very well against the LS's around here. From a roll, from a dead stop and highway blitz's. Not impressed? Wait til I switch teams... Then what will the new excuse be?

 

I have proven my "theory" correct many times myself. When I first bought my car it was 100% bone stock with 3.23 gears. A friend of mine had a 95 LT1 Z28 A4 with 3.23 gears. His car had only a flowmaster catback. We lined them up many times. Sometimes I would spin, sometimes he would spin but whenever we left together the result was always the same.

We are even from a dig to 40, I pull 1/2 to 3/4 car by 80 and then I was walking away after that.

Here are a few people commenting on thier stock LS1 1/8 mile times:

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showth...ight=stock+1/8

http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showth...ight=stock+1/8

Here are a few for stock LT1's

https://www.camaroz28.com/forums/sho...ht=stock+1%2F8

https://www.camaroz28.com/forums/sho...ht=stock+1%2F8

https://www.camaroz28.com/forums/sho...ht=stock+1%2F8

The above threads for the most part show stock LS1's running 8.6-8.9 with a few running in the 9's. LT1's above are mostly running 9.0-9.4's with a few running in the 8's. Which is pretty much in line with explaining my personal experiences.

R/T and 60' can allow slower cars to take a win. I used to do it all the time. And occasionally you'll get a slower stock LS1 against a faster stock LT1. But many times, as in my experience, the LS1 is a few tenths quicker in the eigth and about half a second in the quarter mile.

 

I believe we all have made our cases and kept civil in our arguements. Thanks for that guys.
I am going to close this one down now as I think no more can come from this except deterioration.

Great debate