same amount of money on civic and LT1, which one is faster
04-16-2003, 06:36 PM
#46
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Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Posts: 21
There is no substitution for cubic inches!
Kenneth
Kenneth
04-16-2003, 06:41 PM
#47
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Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: In a house by the bay
Posts: 2,985
Originally posted by Sunray
There is no substitution for cubic inches!
Kenneth
There is no substitution for cubic inches!
Kenneth
-Mindgame
04-17-2003, 10:20 AM
#48
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Roanoke, VA
Posts: 393
hmm, many comments, few with actually thinking involved.
In my town of Roanoke VA, a guy named nathan kidd sold his 98 cobra (pretty respectable cobra to) for a 96 civic hatchback. he upgraded his cam, added a turbo, nitrous shot, and some other internal engine parts. He told me he spent less then $6k but he did most of the work himself (and he wasn't that smart when it came to imports, just did the right research). Now take my car, I run 9.1s & 9.2s (1/8th mile times) consistantly. He didn't have the nitrous bottle in his car but we ran from a dead stop. I pulled him by like 1-1/2 cars and I was starting to laugh. By the time I thought I was winning, he went by me like he had a running start. I'd honestly say he could run about 3-4 cars faster then me in the 1/8th mile.
I saw a 99 civic SI around town for a great price. It was red, full greddy exhaust, lowered, 20k miles, and mint paint job (factory that is, perfect). They guy wanted 13,500. Since I get good deals on all types of parts for Fbodies and other applications, I almost sold the Z to him and got the Si.
just my response to a few points already made...
"honda engines aren't built for turbo's or nitrous" You are somewhat correct, but the guy wants to spend $10k on a car. Do you think he gives a flying **** how long it will last stock? He is building an engine for speed, not any other reason.
Displacement is a huge part of faster ETs. But weight is a huge factor also. Take a vehicle that weighs 3000 lbs w/300 HP vs a 2000 lb car w/200 HP. If you look it by #'s, its the same car.
Personally, I think a V8 is better with chargers whereas most imports use nitrous b/c its the best means of HP (per $$$). Most of you slam imports for using it but hello stupid, you pay less for nitrous then anything else. BOTTOM LINE, NITROUS MAKES HP even if YOU DON'T like it. Isn't the WHOLE name of the name to make HP and be the 1st one across the line? Then why knock someone using nitrous?
hahaha I think I might get the Si and spend about $3000 and stomp some of ya V8 owners. Last I checked, NHRA has a 4 cyl class to.
In my town of Roanoke VA, a guy named nathan kidd sold his 98 cobra (pretty respectable cobra to) for a 96 civic hatchback. he upgraded his cam, added a turbo, nitrous shot, and some other internal engine parts. He told me he spent less then $6k but he did most of the work himself (and he wasn't that smart when it came to imports, just did the right research). Now take my car, I run 9.1s & 9.2s (1/8th mile times) consistantly. He didn't have the nitrous bottle in his car but we ran from a dead stop. I pulled him by like 1-1/2 cars and I was starting to laugh. By the time I thought I was winning, he went by me like he had a running start. I'd honestly say he could run about 3-4 cars faster then me in the 1/8th mile.
I saw a 99 civic SI around town for a great price. It was red, full greddy exhaust, lowered, 20k miles, and mint paint job (factory that is, perfect). They guy wanted 13,500. Since I get good deals on all types of parts for Fbodies and other applications, I almost sold the Z to him and got the Si.
just my response to a few points already made...
"honda engines aren't built for turbo's or nitrous" You are somewhat correct, but the guy wants to spend $10k on a car. Do you think he gives a flying **** how long it will last stock? He is building an engine for speed, not any other reason.
Displacement is a huge part of faster ETs. But weight is a huge factor also. Take a vehicle that weighs 3000 lbs w/300 HP vs a 2000 lb car w/200 HP. If you look it by #'s, its the same car.
Personally, I think a V8 is better with chargers whereas most imports use nitrous b/c its the best means of HP (per $$$). Most of you slam imports for using it but hello stupid, you pay less for nitrous then anything else. BOTTOM LINE, NITROUS MAKES HP even if YOU DON'T like it. Isn't the WHOLE name of the name to make HP and be the 1st one across the line? Then why knock someone using nitrous?
hahaha I think I might get the Si and spend about $3000 and stomp some of ya V8 owners. Last I checked, NHRA has a 4 cyl class to.
04-17-2003, 10:41 AM
#49
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Madison, AL
Posts: 101
White Z 4 Show, the whole point of this is upgrades, you say he spend $6K on his car to beat your stock but the CAI Z, you spend $6K on your engine and you can beat his aZZ again by 2-3 cars, same money the LT1 will be faster hands down.
If I had it, I would offer up the money to see the 2 cars both with $10000 and see who wins, my money would be safe betting on the LT1.
Not hating here but the only Upgrade in your sig is a CAI, and you count the Altezza as an upgrade, do us a favor and sell your Z get you a civic and let the inner ricer come out of the closet.
The only way a civic gets a better 1/4 time is when you drop it off a cliff.
If I had it, I would offer up the money to see the 2 cars both with $10000 and see who wins, my money would be safe betting on the LT1.
Not hating here but the only Upgrade in your sig is a CAI, and you count the Altezza as an upgrade, do us a favor and sell your Z get you a civic and let the inner ricer come out of the closet.
The only way a civic gets a better 1/4 time is when you drop it off a cliff.
04-17-2003, 11:18 AM
#50
Banned
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: looking for a flow bench so Brook and I can race
Posts: 3,505
Lets compare
Building platforms
Camaro
RWD
4.5x the displacement
cheaper parts
Easy to do gear swaps
Posi with solid rear axel
Basically designed for the strip
Civic
FWD
1.3L
More expensive parts
Almost impossible to do gear swaps
Almost impossible to get locking front diff
Basically disigned AGAINST strait line performance
on top of it, the camaro is already starting out with a FULL 3 SECOND HEADSTART, not to mention it is INCREDIBLY choked up and will respond to mods 5x better than that car
Not to mention 95% of speed shops out there are VERY familiar with a small block chevy. How many know anything about V-tec? Or care for that matter. Everything has been done over and over again. The few ricer shops there are are mostly stickers, guages, wings and GFX.
What the hell kind of stupid *** question is this? The only advantage the civic has is wieght, and honestly, weight isn't that big of a deal int he 1320.
Building platforms
Camaro
RWD
4.5x the displacement
cheaper parts
Easy to do gear swaps
Posi with solid rear axel
Basically designed for the strip
Civic
FWD
1.3L
More expensive parts
Almost impossible to do gear swaps
Almost impossible to get locking front diff
Basically disigned AGAINST strait line performance
on top of it, the camaro is already starting out with a FULL 3 SECOND HEADSTART, not to mention it is INCREDIBLY choked up and will respond to mods 5x better than that car
Not to mention 95% of speed shops out there are VERY familiar with a small block chevy. How many know anything about V-tec? Or care for that matter. Everything has been done over and over again. The few ricer shops there are are mostly stickers, guages, wings and GFX.
What the hell kind of stupid *** question is this? The only advantage the civic has is wieght, and honestly, weight isn't that big of a deal int he 1320.
04-17-2003, 11:27 AM
#51
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Crystal Lake, IL
Posts: 1,286
Originally posted by BackInBlackZ28
When i read this post i was disgusted. Anyone who has been to a real track and seen the ricers come out of the woodwork knows that this is a joke. I could beat a civic with my trans stuck in first and my parking brake on. adding about 7 g's to the civic MIGHT make it as fast *** my car now. What i would do is essentially spend 9500 on my car for fun, run low 11's or high 10's against the civic. Then, with the 500 left over, i would by an old Blazer K5, and run over the civic so that it can never be "raced" again. Just a few angry thoughts....
When i read this post i was disgusted. Anyone who has been to a real track and seen the ricers come out of the woodwork knows that this is a joke. I could beat a civic with my trans stuck in first and my parking brake on. adding about 7 g's to the civic MIGHT make it as fast *** my car now. What i would do is essentially spend 9500 on my car for fun, run low 11's or high 10's against the civic. Then, with the 500 left over, i would by an old Blazer K5, and run over the civic so that it can never be "raced" again. Just a few angry thoughts....
04-17-2003, 11:29 AM
#52
Banned
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: looking for a flow bench so Brook and I can race
Posts: 3,505
Originally posted by White Z 4 Show
hmm, many comments, few with actually thinking involved.
In my town of Roanoke VA, a guy named nathan kidd sold his 98 cobra (pretty respectable cobra to) for a 96 civic hatchback. he upgraded his cam, added a turbo, nitrous shot, and some other internal engine parts. He told me he spent less then $6k but he did most of the work himself (and he wasn't that smart when it came to imports, just did the right research). Now take my car, I run 9.1s & 9.2s (1/8th mile times) consistantly. He didn't have the nitrous bottle in his car but we ran from a dead stop. I pulled him by like 1-1/2 cars and I was starting to laugh. By the time I thought I was winning, he went by me like he had a running start. I'd honestly say he could run about 3-4 cars faster then me in the 1/8th mile.
I saw a 99 civic SI around town for a great price. It was red, full greddy exhaust, lowered, 20k miles, and mint paint job (factory that is, perfect). They guy wanted 13,500. Since I get good deals on all types of parts for Fbodies and other applications, I almost sold the Z to him and got the Si.
just my response to a few points already made...
"honda engines aren't built for turbo's or nitrous" You are somewhat correct, but the guy wants to spend $10k on a car. Do you think he gives a flying **** how long it will last stock? He is building an engine for speed, not any other reason.
Displacement is a huge part of faster ETs. But weight is a huge factor also. Take a vehicle that weighs 3000 lbs w/300 HP vs a 2000 lb car w/200 HP. If you look it by #'s, its the same car.
Personally, I think a V8 is better with chargers whereas most imports use nitrous b/c its the best means of HP (per $$$). Most of you slam imports for using it but hello stupid, you pay less for nitrous then anything else. BOTTOM LINE, NITROUS MAKES HP even if YOU DON'T like it. Isn't the WHOLE name of the name to make HP and be the 1st one across the line? Then why knock someone using nitrous?
hahaha I think I might get the Si and spend about $3000 and stomp some of ya V8 owners. Last I checked, NHRA has a 4 cyl class to.
hmm, many comments, few with actually thinking involved.
In my town of Roanoke VA, a guy named nathan kidd sold his 98 cobra (pretty respectable cobra to) for a 96 civic hatchback. he upgraded his cam, added a turbo, nitrous shot, and some other internal engine parts. He told me he spent less then $6k but he did most of the work himself (and he wasn't that smart when it came to imports, just did the right research). Now take my car, I run 9.1s & 9.2s (1/8th mile times) consistantly. He didn't have the nitrous bottle in his car but we ran from a dead stop. I pulled him by like 1-1/2 cars and I was starting to laugh. By the time I thought I was winning, he went by me like he had a running start. I'd honestly say he could run about 3-4 cars faster then me in the 1/8th mile.
I saw a 99 civic SI around town for a great price. It was red, full greddy exhaust, lowered, 20k miles, and mint paint job (factory that is, perfect). They guy wanted 13,500. Since I get good deals on all types of parts for Fbodies and other applications, I almost sold the Z to him and got the Si.
just my response to a few points already made...
"honda engines aren't built for turbo's or nitrous" You are somewhat correct, but the guy wants to spend $10k on a car. Do you think he gives a flying **** how long it will last stock? He is building an engine for speed, not any other reason.
Displacement is a huge part of faster ETs. But weight is a huge factor also. Take a vehicle that weighs 3000 lbs w/300 HP vs a 2000 lb car w/200 HP. If you look it by #'s, its the same car.
Personally, I think a V8 is better with chargers whereas most imports use nitrous b/c its the best means of HP (per $$$). Most of you slam imports for using it but hello stupid, you pay less for nitrous then anything else. BOTTOM LINE, NITROUS MAKES HP even if YOU DON'T like it. Isn't the WHOLE name of the name to make HP and be the 1st one across the line? Then why knock someone using nitrous?
hahaha I think I might get the Si and spend about $3000 and stomp some of ya V8 owners. Last I checked, NHRA has a 4 cyl class to.
Displacement produces torque, something 4 bangers dont have.
And incase you missed reality- it just passed over your head. Your acceleration is defined by your torque curve, not your peak hp. to say a 3000lb V8 car is = to 200hp V8 car is beyond dumb. Why is that the Civic SI gets ROMPED by an LT1 then stock for stock?
275hp and 3600lbs
200hp and whatever it weighs.
Rich Krause has a 4000 lb car that i'm sure would not follow your rule.
You are also missing traction issues.
FWD CAN NOT HOOK. Pick up an import mag. 9.77 @ 164mph. They make supras look like AWD vehicles.
I have under $16,000 worth of parts and labor installed in my car RIGHT NOW INCLUDING audio, appearance and maininance (brakes, rotors gasket leaks), taxes, shipping, wrong parts, machine work, AND THE COST OF THE CAR ITSELF etc. STock heads, never even been on a dyno.
Go buy you $13,000 SI, pay the tax, get your Nitrous and come down to the street or strip with me. Bring your title.
Why in God's name you would sell a fast car designed to go fast to buy a slower car that barely even responds to mods that was not designed to go fast is beyond me.
04-17-2003, 11:46 AM
#53
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 2,148
This is a joke right?
Chezfrog is the fastest Civic I've seen, he was making about 540HP, and the car was probably stripped. Besides the fact that he just blew up his engine, keep in mind a front wheel drive car with power wont hook worth a damn until you get off the gas, or are at speed already. Bad choice for a drag platform.
Stick with something that has cubes, thats how you go fast. This is the same reason that alot of 240Z guys go with a V8, it takes some work to make a turbo car as powerfull, the powerband wont be the same, and there is always more headroom with a V8 - turbo a V8 and you have much more potential than a 1.6L engine.
If you are willing to do some work, and want to save dough, you could throw a V8 in a 240 (2200 pounds about) and be fast right off the bat. Cage strongly advised, its a unibody. 240Z with a stock LS1/T56 just ran a 12.07@118 recently, these guys get 10s easily, low 10s. There is at least one person running 9s on a stock R200 rear.
Chezfrog is the fastest Civic I've seen, he was making about 540HP, and the car was probably stripped. Besides the fact that he just blew up his engine, keep in mind a front wheel drive car with power wont hook worth a damn until you get off the gas, or are at speed already. Bad choice for a drag platform.
Stick with something that has cubes, thats how you go fast. This is the same reason that alot of 240Z guys go with a V8, it takes some work to make a turbo car as powerfull, the powerband wont be the same, and there is always more headroom with a V8 - turbo a V8 and you have much more potential than a 1.6L engine.
If you are willing to do some work, and want to save dough, you could throw a V8 in a 240 (2200 pounds about) and be fast right off the bat. Cage strongly advised, its a unibody. 240Z with a stock LS1/T56 just ran a 12.07@118 recently, these guys get 10s easily, low 10s. There is at least one person running 9s on a stock R200 rear.
Last edited by Dr.Mudge; 04-17-2003 at 11:48 AM.
04-17-2003, 11:51 AM
#54
Banned
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: looking for a flow bench so Brook and I can race
Posts: 3,505
Originally posted by Dr.Mudge
This is a joke right?
Chezfrog is the fastest Civic I've seen, he was making about 540HP, and the car was probably stripped. Besides the fact that he just blew up his engine, keep in mind a front wheel drive car with power wont hook worth a damn until you get off the gas, or are at speed already. Bad choice for a drag platform.
Stick with something that has cubes, thats how you go fast. This is the same reason that alot of 240Z guys go with a V8, it takes some work to make a turbo car as powerfull, the powerband wont be the same, and there is always more headroom with a V8 - turbo a V8 and you have much more potential than a 1.6L engine.
If you are willing to do some work, and want to save dough, you could throw a V8 in a 240 (2200 pounds about) and be fast right off the bat. Cage strongly advised, its a unibody. 240Z with a stock LS1/T56 just ran a 12.07@118 recently, these guys get 10s easily, low 10s. There is at least one person running 9s on a stock R200 rear.
This is a joke right?
Chezfrog is the fastest Civic I've seen, he was making about 540HP, and the car was probably stripped. Besides the fact that he just blew up his engine, keep in mind a front wheel drive car with power wont hook worth a damn until you get off the gas, or are at speed already. Bad choice for a drag platform.
Stick with something that has cubes, thats how you go fast. This is the same reason that alot of 240Z guys go with a V8, it takes some work to make a turbo car as powerfull, the powerband wont be the same, and there is always more headroom with a V8 - turbo a V8 and you have much more potential than a 1.6L engine.
If you are willing to do some work, and want to save dough, you could throw a V8 in a 240 (2200 pounds about) and be fast right off the bat. Cage strongly advised, its a unibody. 240Z with a stock LS1/T56 just ran a 12.07@118 recently, these guys get 10s easily, low 10s. There is at least one person running 9s on a stock R200 rear.
or u can get a TT v10 and own everyone
04-17-2003, 11:55 AM
#55
Registered User
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Saskatchewan, Canada
Posts: 1,025
Sure you can make a civic faster than a LT1 but you can make a LT1 wayyy faster & more reliable than a civic. Look at it this way.
Civic + exhast + shifter + NAAWWS + Turbo kit = low 12's high 11's and the motor won't last long. How much do you have left? $2500 give or take a few. Put that into a rebuild that won't break and you have a low 12 high 11 1/4 mile car.
Now take the LT1, pull the motor, build a fully forged 383 with low compression. Add a D1 or vortec T-trim and run 10's on street tires. The choice is utimately up to you but why not go faster, more reliable AND have a better sounding car. I dunno, but the choice is easy in my mind.
Civic + exhast + shifter + NAAWWS + Turbo kit = low 12's high 11's and the motor won't last long. How much do you have left? $2500 give or take a few. Put that into a rebuild that won't break and you have a low 12 high 11 1/4 mile car.
Now take the LT1, pull the motor, build a fully forged 383 with low compression. Add a D1 or vortec T-trim and run 10's on street tires. The choice is utimately up to you but why not go faster, more reliable AND have a better sounding car. I dunno, but the choice is easy in my mind.
04-17-2003, 12:02 PM
#56
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Bay Area, CA
Posts: 2,148
Originally posted by treyZ28
or u can get a TT v10 and own everyone
or u can get a TT v10 and own everyone
BBC, throw a solid axle in there, maybe toss some nitrous on there, run 9s easily. Now you can go get your NHRA license. I'd rather stick SBC though, LT1 would give you the FI "advantage" and be cheap to throw in, make about 500HP off it and run some deep 10s with hookup, dont have to swap the rear for that. Or if you want dirt cheap, pickup a 5.0 or L98, not my flavor of choice but the L98s run easy high 12s. My own car with the stock 82 Turbo engine is worth a high 13/low 14, AC and PS has of course been removed, and my car is much lighter than the car it came off of. 2.8L and 7psi boost off a T3, 29MPG. It wont be stock for long, but I plan to make power in increments of 50# or so, it'll be awhile before I see over 400 HP or TQ.
240Z with some mods $1500
82 Turbo car 70k miles $150 (rear main looks new)
Engine hoist $24/day, 1 day to swap
Last edited by Dr.Mudge; 04-17-2003 at 12:05 PM.
04-17-2003, 01:09 PM
#57
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Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Baton Rouge, La
Posts: 136
Originally posted by hsyr
Sure you can make a civic faster than a LT1 but you can make a LT1 wayyy faster & more reliable than a civic. Look at it this way.
Civic + exhast + shifter + NAAWWS + Turbo kit = low 12's high 11's and the motor won't last long. How much do you have left? $2500 give or take a few. Put that into a rebuild that won't break and you have a low 12 high 11 1/4 mile car.
Sure you can make a civic faster than a LT1 but you can make a LT1 wayyy faster & more reliable than a civic. Look at it this way.
Civic + exhast + shifter + NAAWWS + Turbo kit = low 12's high 11's and the motor won't last long. How much do you have left? $2500 give or take a few. Put that into a rebuild that won't break and you have a low 12 high 11 1/4 mile car.
White anything can happen on the street when cough bad driving cough is involved.
04-17-2003, 01:47 PM
#58
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Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Crystal Lake, IL
Posts: 1,286
LT1>Civic Si, Simple as that
04-17-2003, 01:48 PM
#59
Registered User
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: AACO, MD
Posts: 2,168
13.9 @ 100 MPH stock '97 Formula
However, I think that $10,000 into a Foxbody Mustang will beat both an LT1 F-body and a Civic
However, I think that $10,000 into a Foxbody Mustang will beat both an LT1 F-body and a Civic
04-17-2003, 02:14 PM
#60
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: sarasota, fl
Posts: 2,456
Originally posted by 93Z286Speed
LT1>Civic Si, Simple as that
LT1>Civic Si, Simple as that
$10g on an LT1 gives you reliable, daily driven, full interior pump gas 10sec car.
not gonna happen on a ricemobile.