LT1 Based Engine Tech 1993-1997 LT1/LT4 Engine Related

Looking for some quieter rockers???

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Old May 27, 2009 | 08:47 PM
  #106  
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From: Jackstandican
Originally Posted by wrd1972
I think its safe to assume that chromeoly steel is stronger than aluminum. Based on that, if I had those engine specs, I would prefer the chromeoly.

FWIW my engine builder had a Crane gold break on the engine dyno a few weeks ago. But that was also a BBC. He then put Pro-comps on it.
There is a reason why aluminum rockers have the mass they do. Sure one metal is going to be stronger than another one due to their natural properties, but a quality aluminum rocker will perform just good in most any engine application. Your testimony doesn't really have enough info. to judge whether or not the rocker was at fault.
Old May 27, 2009 | 08:58 PM
  #107  
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From: Kantuckee Yo'
I was not aware that I was trying to make a judgement. I only said that a Crane broke on the dyno which was replaced by pro-comps. It was determined it was broke because it was in two pieces.
Old May 27, 2009 | 10:38 PM
  #108  
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From: Ft. Worth, TX
Originally Posted by JAKEJR
Are you absolutely sure it's the rockers and not something else?

My thinking is valve train noise is most likely being caused by parts hitting each other. It could be something is minute as the rocker bearings tapping against the races or sloppy clearance between the roller tip or trunnion to the rocker arm body itself.

Can either be wiggled; any side to side or up and down movement?

Is there any feeling of roughness when you spin them with your fingers?

Are your valve cover drip tabs still in place?

Jake

West Point ROCKS!
It's in the valve train, all of them are just as noisey as the one next to them using a stephoscope. The noise could be anywhere in the valve train and propogate to the rocker studs which is where I'm placing the stephoscope when listening.
Remeber I've changed the rockers to to no avail....the comp pro mags and Crane Gold aluminums, all feel fine, I looked for something loose or not quite right with all of them.
Valve covers are the LT4 composites, never modified, the LT4s had 1.6 aluminum RRs stock.
Old May 27, 2009 | 10:40 PM
  #109  
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Originally Posted by wrd1972
Have you tried running the motor without the covers and using a mechanics stethoscope to try to isolate the sound? I have done this and have determined that a couple of my rockers are just naturally a bit nosier that the others but in no way do I consider it a problem.
Yep, see post above.
Old May 27, 2009 | 11:41 PM
  #110  
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From: Jackstandican
Originally Posted by wrd1972
I was not aware that I was trying to make a judgement. I only said that a Crane broke on the dyno which was replaced by pro-comps. It was determined it was broke because it was in two pieces.
Excellent observation, but completely useless info.
Old May 28, 2009 | 08:38 AM
  #111  
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From: Kantuckee Yo'
Obviously you have nothing better to do than stir up another **** sling. You are not the authority on what is useful and what is useless.

I merely made some comments relevant to the topic at hand and I defamed nobody or no product.

Please do not trash Rob's post.
Old May 28, 2009 | 10:36 AM
  #112  
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From: Jackstandican
Originally Posted by wrd1972
Obviously you have nothing better to do than stir up another **** sling. You are not the authority on what is useful and what is useless.

I merely made some comments relevant to the topic at hand and I defamed nobody or no product.

Please do not trash Rob's post.
No trashing going on. Just merely letting you know that using a blanket statement about aluminum rockers not being as strong as a steal rocker is nothing more than a wives tale. No reason to take it personal.
Old May 28, 2009 | 10:59 AM
  #113  
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From: Kantuckee Yo'
Originally Posted by SS RRR
No trashing going on. Just merely letting you know that using a blanket statement about aluminum rockers not being as strong as a steal rocker is nothing more than a wives tale. No reason to take it personal.
Not falling for it.

This is what I said:
I think its safe to assume that chromeoly steel is stronger than aluminum. Look again at the post, I made no specific reference between any two rockers. There was no blanket statement made.

However now that you bring it up, IMHO, I believe the chromeoly steel pro-mags are much stronger than the Crane aluminum rockers based what I have read on these boards from folks who have used both. I have read where guys have busted a Crane Gold, I have NEVER read where anyone busted a pro-mag.
Old May 28, 2009 | 11:14 AM
  #114  
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From: Kantuckee Yo'
Rob,
I dont know what else to tell you to try.

My pro-mags on a stock cam, they made a very faint ticking. On the bigger cam, it was much more noticable but not bad enough for me to fret over. I put LT1 composite valve cover on (after cutting out the drip tabs) and they made very little impact to reducing the sound.

I once started to Line-x a set of stock metal covers. I still think that would do maybe a little bit of good.

Just a week ago, I fired the motor up after it had been sitting a good month, and it had loud ticking. After pulling it out into the street, the loud ticking was gone so i blamed it on a stuck lifter. Funny thing is the lifters are rather new with less than 10K IIRC.

Post a video if you can.
Old May 28, 2009 | 11:23 AM
  #115  
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From: Jackstandican
Originally Posted by wrd1972
However now that you bring it up, IMHO, I believe the chromeoly steel pro-mags are much stronger than the Crane aluminum rockers based what I have read on these boards from folks who have used both. I have read where guys have busted a Crane Gold, I have NEVER read where anyone busted a pro-mag.
Much better, but just know there is a flip side to what you've read on the boards. I am not nervous in the slightest that my aluminum rockers are going to fatigue and fail and my setup is a bit more extreme than the normal heads/cam setups. Not trying to be egotistical, just matter of fact. My car is street driven and taken to 7000 plus rpm most every time it is driven. To me, that is enough testimonial that stating an aluminum rocker is not as strong as a steal rocker is not necessarily accurate.
Whatever the case may be the moral of the story is a one cannot go wrong with a quality aluminum or steal rocker. My two suggestions are the Crane Gold Race rockers or the Comp Cams HiTech rockers.

Last edited by SS RRR; May 28, 2009 at 11:26 AM.
Old May 28, 2009 | 09:24 PM
  #116  
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Originally Posted by wrd1972
Rob,
I dont know what else to tell you to try.

My pro-mags on a stock cam, they made a very faint ticking. On the bigger cam, it was much more noticable but not bad enough for me to fret over. I put LT1 composite valve cover on (after cutting out the drip tabs) and they made very little impact to reducing the sound.

I once started to Line-x a set of stock metal covers. I still think that would do maybe a little bit of good.

Just a week ago, I fired the motor up after it had been sitting a good month, and it had loud ticking. After pulling it out into the street, the loud ticking was gone so i blamed it on a stuck lifter. Funny thing is the lifters are rather new with less than 10K IIRC.

Post a video if you can.
Is this normal for Pro-Mags? http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?j2un3jddtzj That file plays in Quicktime but not Winamp for me for whatever reason.
I have the 875-16 Pro Mag "R" lifters and the Pro Mag rockers you mention. Thing is it sounds like only one tapping away... I posted all the details on the main page (checked everything + lashed while running + wear pattern is centered) but you should be able to tell from this audio file.. couild it be the 5w 40 Rotella Synthetic?

Last edited by dookie454; May 28, 2009 at 09:58 PM.
Old May 28, 2009 | 10:12 PM
  #117  
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From: Engineerland
Loud ticking and such can be things like injectors and headers. Some injectors make an incredible amount of mechanical noise especially if they have alot of miles on them. The injectors will make noise at the same sort of frequency that rocker arms and valvetrain will.

As for the talk of broken rockers I have a collection of those. Harland sharp, jessel, crane, comp, t&d you name it I probably have it on the shelf broken. I dont even want to start down the crank and rods or block section.

Despite popular belief rockers and injectors are also wear items on an engine and should be replaced or serviced at regular intervals. Same goes for ignition coils.
Old May 28, 2009 | 10:23 PM
  #118  
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Originally Posted by WS6T3RROR
Loud ticking and such can be things like injectors and headers. Some injectors make an incredible amount of mechanical noise especially if they have alot of miles on them. The injectors will make noise at the same sort of frequency that rocker arms and valvetrain will.

As for the talk of broken rockers I have a collection of those. Harland sharp, jessel, crane, comp, t&d you name it I probably have it on the shelf broken. I dont even want to start down the crank and rods or block section.

Despite popular belief rockers and injectors are also wear items on an engine and should be replaced or serviced at regular intervals. Same goes for ignition coils.

Injectors and exhaust leaks go away when the Key is shut off or the PCM is in Decel FUel mode.. valvetrain noises are constant based on RPM and nothing else.

My tick is linked to RPM alone as I've shut off the key from 2000rpm a few times and the tick keeps on ticking on down to 0rpm.

I have heard one exhaust leak on a buddy's car that I bet was a lifter.. it was just a loose header bolt! Unbelieveable!

Last edited by dookie454; May 28, 2009 at 10:27 PM.
Old May 28, 2009 | 10:30 PM
  #119  
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From: Engineerland
That post was for the op and anyone else looking in, I didnt even read your post or watch your video dookie.
Old Jun 10, 2009 | 03:53 PM
  #120  
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Haven't had the time to mess with this much until today....driving home it developed a loud tick and started running horrible. Popped the valve cover off and now its even more confusing......
The rocker stud snapped in half, what's odd is the location in which it snapped, just above the rocker truion almost even with the bottom of the polylock.
In all of the changes over the past few months, I forgot it probably was not a good idea to run the heavy dual springs with 3/8 studs, but if that was the cause, sure is in an odd spot.
I'll be measuring the longer PR at 7.50" while I'm at it, and switching back to the beehives and almunim rockers..along with some slightly longer and new studs in case the others are stressed from the bigger springs.
(Went to the 3/8 studs when I went to the SA rockers...SA only comes in 3/8...)
Here's the pics of the breakage
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Last edited by 2QUIK6; Jun 10, 2009 at 03:55 PM.



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