SMOKNZ, do you every actually read these posts???

"dyno today at 7psi and saw 409hp and 447tq
This was running very rich mid band."

The 112 trap speeds were without a BOV and at 5 psi, I repeat 5 psi and I believe no methanol injection, but Luke can clear that one up. What, are you upset that its making close to the hp of your built motor twin intercooled car for only like 3k dollars? The 500hp you were reffering to was on an LS1 with this turbo setup. Every one has an opinion, but please get your sh*% straight before you voice it.

 

No I don't EVERY actually read these posts

Am i missing something, 409 Hp is pretty close to 542 Hp, huh Thats great that it was running fat mid-band, cuz thats not where peak Hp is made, so leaning it out in that area will probably do little for the peak numbers, but would boost the mid-range.

Oh I forgot no BOV is going to make a huge difference in trap speeds.

3K is a little less than half I spent on my crap *** Turbo Tech kit, and no I'm not upset that someone made 400 Hp on a 3K turbo kit. You can strap on a used ATI kit for for less than that and make the same power.

To each their own, I just don't like the kit and I've explained why in previous threads (or maybe this one), If you choose to ignore what i said then thats your problem. I am putting close to $4K in my Twin kit I'm building myself (over half done) and I garantee it will make a pile more Hp at 7 psi and well beyond. Now are you Jealous? Didn't think so

I need to get my $hit straight? this coming from a guy who has what experience with a turbo on a 4th gen? I see you have a throttlebody bypass as a mod... Do something with your car and then come talk to me about my $hit.

 

A used ATI kit, lets not compare used to new please. I have never seen where you actually explained why you dont like it with some intelligence, please post that so I can read why.

I bet your new setup cannot be bought out right as a kit and installed in hours! You also do not have a bone STOCK motor with your setup. Wonder what it would do on a stock motor at 7 psi, shatter the rings in a few thousand miles?

However, we probably shouldnt be comparing your setup and the STS kit, they are completely different. Yours is home built I am assuming and not on a stock motor. What turbo kits can be bought for 3 grand or less and run safely on a COMPLETELY STOCK LT1 and what power do they make. Dyno sheets only please and the car has to be completely stock. I am curious to see.

"I need to get my $hit straight? this coming from a guy who has what experience with a turbo on a 4th gen? I see you have a throttlebody bypass as a mod... Do something with your car and then come talk to me about my $hit."

HAHA, I was talking about your attitude not your car. I just bought this car 3 months ago and I am in college and poor. I used to own a 12sec 350 powered 85' Monte SS. Just cause I dont own a turbo F-body doesnt mean I dont know about them and how they work. I am a mechanical engineer major and the idea of the STS kit is ingenious. When I am out of school and have the money I will probably have one.

Please answer my above questions with facts and then we will have something to discuss. And dont forget your intelligent reasons for not liking the kit.


Oh, I almost forgot about this. .30 over, 8.7:1 psitons, almost EXACTLY like your setup and almost EXACTLY the same numbers! But I forgot its a terrible kit and yours is superior.

http://www.ststurbo.com/turbo_camaro_dynojet

 

Look on page 3 of this thread, the 4th post on the page. Posted by me.

Your a mechanical enginering student and you couldn't have figured this stuff out yourself? Is the kit different, yes. Does it work, yes. Is it efficient, hell no. It needs a larger compressor, PERIOD. do some calculations mr. engineer and maybe you'd see the light

So you go ahead and run your way out of it's efficiency range turbo and I'll run my twins right thru the peak efficiency range all day long. I'll make more power pound for pound, stock motor for stock motor (if thats what you wanna bitch about)

Right now your a wanna-be engineer and you are the one buying the kit, while I'm "engineering" my own.

P.S. My poor *** is going thru college full time as well (manufacturing engineering), and working full time. I won't be waiting for someone to make me something. Get innovative and design something yourself, afterall thats what your going to be doing for a living.

 

The kit my numbers came form (Turbo Tech) sucked a$$. I'd even go out on a limb and say that the STS is probably better. It doesn't (obviously) expereince the extreme backpressure issues of the turbotech kit which severly limit power.

 

"So you go ahead and run your way out of it's efficiency range turbo and I'll run my twins right thru the peak efficiency range all day long. I'll make more power pound for pound, stock motor for stock motor (if thats what you wanna bitch about)

Right now your a wanna-be engineer and you are the one buying the kit, while I'm "engineering" my own.

P.S. My poor *** is going thru college full time as well (manufacturing engineering), and working full time. I won't be waiting for someone to make me something. Get innovative and design something yourself, afterall thats what your going to be doing for a living."

Last time I checked Manufacturing Engineering was the wanna-be engineering major. Its like Industrial Engineering right, or "Imaginary Engineering" as us ME's like to call it. I'll probably be your boss one day, Mechanical Engineering major (at a top 15 Engineering college in the US) soon to have a MBA. Do you go to a tech college? I hate to stoop to your level, but its just so darn hard not to.

Innovation takes time and money, which I have neither. Your extremely difficult major must be the same right!?! Like I said, sorry I couldnt be the bigger man here, but I'm only 20 so cut me some slack. I'll do better next time.

 

No I don't go to a tech college, that's something I have already completed years ago. I offered you the reason why I don't like this kit with the supporting calculations, but all you can muster up is crap about your school. Whoopty doo your suposedly in college, but who really knows for sure, we are sitting in front of a computer, you could be anyone. For all I care your some 20 year old kid living with mommy and daddy smoking a pipe dreaming about having a turbo car. Your not even arguing about your own car.

IF your done with your pissing match and want to discuss something against my ideas why I stated why I don't care for this kit then lets do so, otherwise shoot me an email and we can discuss who's imaginary college is better than who's. Be my boss??? I don't think so pal

 

My imaginary college is Clemson University. I actually agree with you that ideally it needs a larger compressor, I looked at the map. However, it is still a very good kit for the price and every kit can always be made better. You can talk to STS and order the kit with whatever turbo you would like!

I enjoyed the pissing contest

 

Jeez, I can't beleive this debate is still going on. I'm going to sum up the 5,000,000 posts for everybody out there.

1. STS makes a turbo kit.

2. It is the Powerdyne of turbo kits

3. It makes power, but I've seen '76 Pintos make power too...ge the drift? It's like having a set of K-Mart shoes on. Are you're feet covered? Yes, but is it the right way? Only the people that don't know better would think so.

4. The people standing up for the STS kit actually know very little about turbocharging and all its quirks.

5. Boost is boost, if you pound 5psi into an LT1, it'll make power, whether that boost if from a poorly, cheaply desinged turbo, a leaf blower, or a very, VERY good prostitute. Boost is power.

In closing, the STS kit makes power. Not as much power as a PROPERLY designed turbo, but it makes power. IF ANYBODY running an STS kit wants to put up 10,000 to test it psi vs psi on a BONE STOCK LT1/LS1 etc, same dyno, same day with an STS kit vs. a kit I'll make in my garage over the weekend, bring it on.

If you want to say the STS cars are quick, fine they are. Say they make power, they do. The install is easy, it is. BUT, challenge a standard mount single turbo to a horsepower pull off and you are going to lose your dignitly and your money.

p.s. Anybody else notice that the people defending the STS kit seem to be the most under-informed when it comes to air flow, turbos, Boyles gas law, thermodynaics etc?

 

Maybe PTK should offer its challenge to STS along with Vortech and ATI.

 

I'm really not here to add to the arguing, but you don't seem to know much either. Leaf blowers don't make boost! You also say that 5 psi boost is boost, well doesn't that go against what your arguing. The dyno numbers they are posting are pretty darn good. Is it the best out there--Probably not, but for the price its darn good. Some of the people are not the most under-informed, they admit its flaws, just as the standard turbo setup has its flaws. The powerdyne is not a bad charger, but it is more limited than this kit, not to mention a completely different setup. I hate hearing people compare the two, comparisons could be made with an eaton charger also, but its not the same, so don't aste your breath. I'm not completely sold on the STS kit as of yet, but if it proves itself at the track and runs the same times as other kits, than why should I argue which kit is best. Its like the guys arguing about which cam is best, some people run high 11's with hotcam, others high 12s same thing with other cams, so which is best depends on what you want.

 

Years ago when I first got into FI systems I had a friend who thought the same thing. He argued that 8 psi is the same coming from a supercharger or a turbo. At the time I knew it wasn't but lacked the information to support my claim, so I kept my mouth shut. "sometimes it's better to keep your mouth closed and be thought of as stupid, than to open your mouth and remove all doubt!"
I have learned alot since then, and have started looking into various compressor maps, and the fact remains that 8 psi is not the same coming from different compressors. As the efficiencies change do does the density of the charges which equates to varying power. Higher efficiencies require less intercooling, and if a large cooler is used to get temps back close to ambient, more power can be made than an inefficient compressor which will not get the temps back down that low.

I don't hate STS, I just wouldn't run it on my car. If it was bone stock and I wanted 100Hp or so I might think about it. But with my experiences of addictive boost, you always want more, and why start with a platform that has limited capabilities (even though thats what I did) If I had to do it again, it would be done a different way. Hell I can rememember on this very board when there were flames about someone claiming to have a 700 Hp car. It wasn't possible with the LT1 they said. Now look whats around!

Bill

 

" Anybody else notice that the people defending the STS kit seem to be the most under-informed when it comes to air flow, turbos, Boyles gas law, thermodynaics etc?"

I didnt know that because I am defending it and I know a LOT about thermodynamics, heat transfer, fluid mechanics, etc.

I wouldnt call it the Powerdyne of turbos, but I agree that it is limited. However, if your goal is to safely make 400hp and you have a completly stock car, you can make that power quickly and safely. You can maintain complete driveability and idle, gas mileage, etc, etc. It looks like even a complete novice could install the kit, so for $3k you can have a 400rwhp car that will beat most of the cars on the street. We all know that it takes a big cam, ported heads, headers, etc, etc to make 400rwhp NA.

If your pockets are deep and your goal it to make upwards of 600 or 700hp then this is probably not the kit for you. They did make 520hp with a basic engine rebuild for a turbo setup, still had the stock cam and those number were through an auto I believe. So it has potential for around 600hp with a custom grind cam, a manual tranny, and some good tunning.

What makes this the wrong way? Just because everyone else doesnt do it this way?

People are so afraid of change these days its down right frightening. Thinking outside the box is what gets you places in life.