Speaking of marketing hype, good ol' Jimbo, wanna know what the biggest piece of pure marketing spin/crap/boldfaced lie ever was?

"Over 90% of the Camrys built since 1987 are still on the road." This was from a recent TV ad they ran in the Northeast.

BULLSH**. ABSOLUTE BULLSH**. I can't even REMEMBER the last time I saw an '97-'91 style Camry on the road. In New England they've all long since rotted away!!! And yet, 10 years ago they were a somewhat common sight. So how the HELL does Toyota have the ***** to say something so blasphemous and obviously untrue? I don't think 90% of the '98+ models are still on the road!! Why? Accidents alone have claimed at least 10%, guaranteed...

And yet, Toyota gets away with lies like that because they're Toyota. It GM did that the Toyota faithful would be pilliging GM dealerships and raping the salespeople. And as a GM salesperson, let me tell you...I wouldn't like that...

 

I don't know about the rest of the country, but around here in my neck of the woods, most of the cars on the road are 2000s or newer, so that little fact wouldn't apply up here for Camry's, or just about any car.

 

Do you seriously believe that pure crap you just spewed? Cars falling apart on the lot? Say what? I'd like to invite you down to Fedor Pontiac here in Easthampton MA, and sit in any new car you like...I've got several for you to choose from. Show me ONE CAR WITH ANY PROBLEM IN IT, and I'll give it to you for free. Worth the trip out here for a free car? Oh wait...you won't find one. Maybe its not worth the trip after all.

GM has had to "give" the cars away, as you put it, because too many retards really believe the quality is not the same. It is. Get over it. Hopefully enough of the June sales were conquest sales that the message will soon get around.

Your flaming bias is unbelievable to some, but entirely believable to me. 15 years ago, that argument was fine. Today it doesn't hold water. Game over...now get over it. You could have had a supercharged Cobalt SS for barely 2k more than your rev-the-****-out-of-it-to-make-it-move XRS. And you could have supported your own country. What a waste...

Oh and by the way, how do you like your noisy as **** "quality" VVTLi engine? I love the fact the loudest, crappiest sounding engines on my Pontiac lot are TOYOTA ENGINES Vibes sound like ripped apart lawnmowers, if you don't mind me knocking my own product. And have you been to a Celica forum lately? Seen how many people have already blown those **** motors? Because hey, they're such "quality"...right? Sure, people rag the **** out of them and blow them. People rag the **** out of LS1s too...how many of those do you see blown? A guy even wrote in to C&D about a year ago to tell them to knock off their Toyota bias...he just sold his '00 Celica GTS with 65k that went through THREE ENGINES. His claim? "You can't drive this car the way Toyota says you can. One I blew because I was an idiot. The other two? Toyota sucks."

 

Dude I put instructions in my post and you can't even follow them?

Click here and look where Scion is.

 

Yeah the instructions weren't the problem, it's the broken link. And do you think you could make that chart bigger? *squint* All I know is that Lexus has the #1 spot!

 

Link wasn't broken. I followed my own instructions and got to the chart. Let me spell it out for you Scion was 33 out of 37 and had 158 problems per 100 vehicles. Lexus was #1(87), Caddy #2(93), Buick #4(100), Toyota #8(104), Chevy #15(119).

Why is Scion reliable, again?

 

I think those numbers are also releative to other factors. Lexus and Cadillac owners don't complain much, because they're probably so old they're almost dead. That goes with Buick and some Toyota owners, too.
As for Scion people take them in for little rattles here and there. It's a good car, but it's still 12 thousand dollars, whadya expect? If you've ever been in business you realize the people who spend the least expect the most. It's their first new car so they will bitch about them. Although for the price they're unrivaled.

 

That, however, is just speculation. I don't think you are grasping the point of how important it can be to your arguement to use factual data, and not gut feelings.

 

I don't understand the JD power evaluation...if the Scion gets 5/5 in overall quality on everything but mechanical, why is it at the bottom of the list?

 

Because interior plastics and trim panel gaps seem unimportant when the wheel falls off or the car catches on fire.

 

That kind of logic doesn't really hold the line, though, when you see Lincoln is below the industry average.

Also, Hyundai, Chevy, Dodge, Pontiac, Ford, Jeep, Mini, Saturn and Kia... none of which would I call "old people brands" all finsihed higher than Scion... among other brands.

 

How does it go...? You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink it! Something like that!

 

Vibe is built at the NUMMI plant in California; Matrix is built in the Cambridge plant. They are not built "side by side", unless you consider being 2500 miles apart "side by side".

 

NUMMI was building the two side-by-side, not sure when or why that changed. The Vibe is still built there alongside the related Corolla and unrelated Tacoma.

http://www.nummi.com/vehicles.html

 

Matrix has been built exclusively at Cambridge since its introduction. Even the link you posted doesn't mention Matrix being built at NUMMI. Perhaps you're thinking of the Voltz.