Started a thread on another board, may be of some interest...
12-08-2002, 08:12 PM
#16
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Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 1,954
Originally posted by tls2000
I have given the reasons as to why I am unable to get a camaro or a Trans Am on the other thread. I am NOT happy with the performance of the Grand Am. It has a lot of get go, I'll give it that. But I also see other cars in it's class, or in a lower class, outperforming it. GM has been using the same engine in this car ever since they put the 2.8l v6 in it. It has had mild updates and has had it's displacement increased, but it is the same engine, only slightly modified to keep up. But it's still beaten on the road by the Altima, Camry, and Accord, which are what your average ricer drives nowadays (Altima excepted), which means that this car does not equal the others. And after throwing a lot of money ($7000) into these cars, you're lucky to increase your quarter mile times by 1.0sec. It's very expensive to modify an n-body.
The other big problem that a lot of the whiners had was with build quality. I've had my car in the shop for warranty work over 20 times. 10 of those times were related to the brakes!
I have given the reasons as to why I am unable to get a camaro or a Trans Am on the other thread. I am NOT happy with the performance of the Grand Am. It has a lot of get go, I'll give it that. But I also see other cars in it's class, or in a lower class, outperforming it. GM has been using the same engine in this car ever since they put the 2.8l v6 in it. It has had mild updates and has had it's displacement increased, but it is the same engine, only slightly modified to keep up. But it's still beaten on the road by the Altima, Camry, and Accord, which are what your average ricer drives nowadays (Altima excepted), which means that this car does not equal the others. And after throwing a lot of money ($7000) into these cars, you're lucky to increase your quarter mile times by 1.0sec. It's very expensive to modify an n-body.
The other big problem that a lot of the whiners had was with build quality. I've had my car in the shop for warranty work over 20 times. 10 of those times were related to the brakes!
Putting that aside, GM's intermediate cars have a history of brake problems - I blame the cheap calipers and potato-chip rotors. I also know a very careful driver who's had the same problem in every new Cadillac he's purchased in the last 5 years. By and large, the problem is more of an annoyance than a serious safety issue.
12-08-2002, 11:15 PM
#17
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Sarasota FL
Posts: 3,375
Originally posted by tls2000
I was maybe continuing the trouble that was started. But I did not start it.
Do remember that when you post something, perhaps let people know the tone of your sentences.
"Why didn't you buy a friggen F body????" can be viewed as inflamitory.
THIS was inflamatory. You say that you're asking in a non-condescending way after implying that people are stupid for not buying an f-body, for their purposes. So don't go and get all pissed off at me because I took offense to your statements, and called you out on them.
I was maybe continuing the trouble that was started. But I did not start it.
Do remember that when you post something, perhaps let people know the tone of your sentences.
"Why didn't you buy a friggen F body????" can be viewed as inflamitory.
THIS was inflamatory. You say that you're asking in a non-condescending way after implying that people are stupid for not buying an f-body, for their purposes. So don't go and get all pissed off at me because I took offense to your statements, and called you out on them.
redzed hit the nail on the head, too...show me a loaded V6 Camry you can get for an MSRP of $22,500 with almost everything but leather...and then get a nice fat rebate to make it even cheaper. I'll deal with 20 sets of brakes for that
I don't mean to come off like a PITA here, but if one more person tells me what I "supposedly" said...seriously...
12-09-2002, 08:11 AM
#18
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,979
There are a couple of insurance tricks that can help when buying an F-car or Corvette.
First, have a beater. My 1988 Dodge Aries is the primary vehicle for insurance. Insurance on a 1988 Dodge Aries is dirt cheap. Then, the F-car is insured as the second/pleasure vehicle. Saves a ton.
Second, bump the deductibles up on the second car and take the minimum insurance necessary, that which is required by your financing company.
Now, on to mods...
Throwing money at a Grand Am really isn't a terrific idea in my mind. The money would be better spent paying down your principle or saving for a different car. Possibly one that will carry some value later in life. I'm usually stunned when I see a couple of thousand dollars thrown at wheels and tires on an N-body.
Matter of fact, I crused one that had nitrous early this summer in the SS. What was he thinking???
An example of a better investment than wheels and tires would be Corvette ZR1's. They are pretty inexpensive now, not much more than a Grand Am, and will actually have some value in 10 years. I expect them to start climbing in value pretty steeply soon.
Grand Nationals are another example of a car that will be a decent investment.
First, have a beater. My 1988 Dodge Aries is the primary vehicle for insurance. Insurance on a 1988 Dodge Aries is dirt cheap. Then, the F-car is insured as the second/pleasure vehicle. Saves a ton.
Second, bump the deductibles up on the second car and take the minimum insurance necessary, that which is required by your financing company.
Now, on to mods...
Throwing money at a Grand Am really isn't a terrific idea in my mind. The money would be better spent paying down your principle or saving for a different car. Possibly one that will carry some value later in life. I'm usually stunned when I see a couple of thousand dollars thrown at wheels and tires on an N-body.
Matter of fact, I crused one that had nitrous early this summer in the SS. What was he thinking???
An example of a better investment than wheels and tires would be Corvette ZR1's. They are pretty inexpensive now, not much more than a Grand Am, and will actually have some value in 10 years. I expect them to start climbing in value pretty steeply soon.
Grand Nationals are another example of a car that will be a decent investment.
12-09-2002, 03:02 PM
#19
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Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Calgary, AB, Canada
Posts: 169
Originally posted by Jason E
I said "why didn't you buy a friggen F body," again, as a comment to those WHINING because their N body didn't do what they wanted it to...where did I say they were stupid? Please, tell me. I am sick and tired of people putting goddamned words in my mouth over this post. If it isn't written, I didn't say it...capiche??
redzed hit the nail on the head, too...show me a loaded V6 Camry you can get for an MSRP of $22,500 with almost everything but leather...and then get a nice fat rebate to make it even cheaper. I'll deal with 20 sets of brakes for that
I don't mean to come off like a PITA here, but if one more person tells me what I "supposedly" said...seriously...
I said "why didn't you buy a friggen F body," again, as a comment to those WHINING because their N body didn't do what they wanted it to...where did I say they were stupid? Please, tell me. I am sick and tired of people putting goddamned words in my mouth over this post. If it isn't written, I didn't say it...capiche??
redzed hit the nail on the head, too...show me a loaded V6 Camry you can get for an MSRP of $22,500 with almost everything but leather...and then get a nice fat rebate to make it even cheaper. I'll deal with 20 sets of brakes for that
I don't mean to come off like a PITA here, but if one more person tells me what I "supposedly" said...seriously...
It's obvious that I misinterpreted what you said, so I'm going to go all out and apolgise to you publicly.
I'm sorry for flaming you.
I hope that you find the answers that you're looking for, and I am interested in the responses myself.
Once again, sorry.
12-09-2002, 03:52 PM
#20
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Join Date: May 1998
Location: Maumee, OH
Posts: 317
Originally posted by redzed
Pardon me, but V6 Accords, Camrys and Altimas are alot more expensive than a Grand Am GT.
Pardon me, but V6 Accords, Camrys and Altimas are alot more expensive than a Grand Am GT.
This thread interests me because I've always liked the Grand AM's. If only GM would give them some get-up and go. Of course, they'll never do that, because then you'd be into Grand Prix territory.
Anyway, to me, there are no current GM cars I would buy right now. I really do hope that changes, but as it is, there's someone doing it better/faster for about the same price, if not cheaper. This can be found along nearly all car styles/types.
12-11-2002, 11:41 PM
#21
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Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Branford, CT
Posts: 1
Ok I've read through "most" of this thread and now I am gonna put in my .02.
I have owned Camaro's my whole life last one being a 91 RS that was built up pretty good. Now I for one am 23 and being able to afford the Firebird vs the GA wasn't a problem. I personally have always been one to be different than mainstream and I didn't want to just have another car like everyone else out there. So I opted for the GA over the 'bird for that reason as well as a few others. The others are Interior room, drivability in the snow (Live in the NE), and family (My daughter was about 9 months old at the time). I am 6'3" Pretty large build (Not fat so hold the remarks ) and I found the Firebird to be very uncomfortable, plus there was no way anyone was sitting behind me. The seat didn't slide back far enough allow me to get comfortable. Snow thats a given. And putting a kid in the back ain't exactly the easiest thing to do in a 2dr.
Now I liked the GAGT and being the first year of the new body style I thought to myself there are gonna be alot of these cars but doubt there will be a huge following in the "Car Club World" for lack of better words. I thought I would buy this car and make it something you don't see everyday. I knew it would be a while to wait for true performance aftermarket parts but I figured it'sd be worth it. So I bought the hood when it came out then the intake manifolds, etc etc. Topping it off with the S/C. I will admit for the money that was spent I would have expected better gains but man was it nice to go to car shows and be one of 2 or 3 other GA's or drive down the strip with a bunch of ricers and be the only domestic. Plus I didn't drive by a mirror image of my car on a daily basis.
It has now gotten to the point where the car itself can't handle the mods (ie Pat's tranny issues just to name one) and I have decided I don't want to dump anymore $$$ into the car. I love it but I outgrew the urge to mod it, and for minimal gains.
So with that being said my intention was to have a domestic 4dr sedan that stood out from the crowd. It has and it still will with the new owner but like anything else there comes a time to move on.
I will however not be buying an F Body for anytime soon, the next performance car will be the Vette.
Cheers
JD
I have owned Camaro's my whole life last one being a 91 RS that was built up pretty good. Now I for one am 23 and being able to afford the Firebird vs the GA wasn't a problem. I personally have always been one to be different than mainstream and I didn't want to just have another car like everyone else out there. So I opted for the GA over the 'bird for that reason as well as a few others. The others are Interior room, drivability in the snow (Live in the NE), and family (My daughter was about 9 months old at the time). I am 6'3" Pretty large build (Not fat so hold the remarks ) and I found the Firebird to be very uncomfortable, plus there was no way anyone was sitting behind me. The seat didn't slide back far enough allow me to get comfortable. Snow thats a given. And putting a kid in the back ain't exactly the easiest thing to do in a 2dr.
Now I liked the GAGT and being the first year of the new body style I thought to myself there are gonna be alot of these cars but doubt there will be a huge following in the "Car Club World" for lack of better words. I thought I would buy this car and make it something you don't see everyday. I knew it would be a while to wait for true performance aftermarket parts but I figured it'sd be worth it. So I bought the hood when it came out then the intake manifolds, etc etc. Topping it off with the S/C. I will admit for the money that was spent I would have expected better gains but man was it nice to go to car shows and be one of 2 or 3 other GA's or drive down the strip with a bunch of ricers and be the only domestic. Plus I didn't drive by a mirror image of my car on a daily basis.
It has now gotten to the point where the car itself can't handle the mods (ie Pat's tranny issues just to name one) and I have decided I don't want to dump anymore $$$ into the car. I love it but I outgrew the urge to mod it, and for minimal gains.
So with that being said my intention was to have a domestic 4dr sedan that stood out from the crowd. It has and it still will with the new owner but like anything else there comes a time to move on.
I will however not be buying an F Body for anytime soon, the next performance car will be the Vette.
Cheers
JD
12-12-2002, 12:18 AM
#22
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 479
lots of people ive met never even considered these cars. they "think" a ga is fast, or could be fast with an exhaust and whatnot. one guy even thought my camaro was part of the intrepid/concorde family
WTF? the younger generation just has no clue really. (im 24, not an old man, but im basically talking about my gen and younger). they dont know what they want, so they just go after what others tell them is good, or fast , or reliable ,etc. this one chinese (actually Lautian) guy i work with, for example. we started working together about 1 year ago. at the time the z was in storage for the winter. he wanted to get either a civic, integra, or woulda loved a lude. anyway, to make a long story short, once he saw the z, heard the z, took a ride in it, crapped his pants at how well the car actually f**king moves, he was sold. hes been saving up to buy one since then this coming summer. its a lot of misconceptions, stereotypes, listening to "others" too much, etc. when i had my other z, which was a 95 as well but auto, bone stock, and 2.73's, this one kid at work was going on about his friend in his 91 stripped, integra engined, blah blah civic wreaking havoc on all stangs and whatnot. so i tell him ill beat him. hes like no f**king way man. my friends gonna kill you , this that whatever. he calls his friends and hooks up a race. theyre like six of them, i see them checking out the z and laughing cause its auto and saying im gonna get smoked. whoevers reading this knows the outcome, right? i smoked the f**k 3 friggin times. second race i gave him a 2 car handicap, 3rd race i gave him like 5 car lenghts. boy was he pissed. the guy i worked with was amazed. WTF again? what are you , stupid? oh well. its just a whole lotta s**t piled into the same basket. gas are ok for what they are, but i wouldnt spend 20k on one. they werent meant to be fast, nor made to be fast. to each theyre own i suppose. my post is kinda dumb, but anyway. night people.
WTF? the younger generation just has no clue really. (im 24, not an old man, but im basically talking about my gen and younger). they dont know what they want, so they just go after what others tell them is good, or fast , or reliable ,etc. this one chinese (actually Lautian) guy i work with, for example. we started working together about 1 year ago. at the time the z was in storage for the winter. he wanted to get either a civic, integra, or woulda loved a lude. anyway, to make a long story short, once he saw the z, heard the z, took a ride in it, crapped his pants at how well the car actually f**king moves, he was sold. hes been saving up to buy one since then this coming summer. its a lot of misconceptions, stereotypes, listening to "others" too much, etc. when i had my other z, which was a 95 as well but auto, bone stock, and 2.73's, this one kid at work was going on about his friend in his 91 stripped, integra engined, blah blah civic wreaking havoc on all stangs and whatnot. so i tell him ill beat him. hes like no f**king way man. my friends gonna kill you , this that whatever. he calls his friends and hooks up a race. theyre like six of them, i see them checking out the z and laughing cause its auto and saying im gonna get smoked. whoevers reading this knows the outcome, right? i smoked the f**k 3 friggin times. second race i gave him a 2 car handicap, 3rd race i gave him like 5 car lenghts. boy was he pissed. the guy i worked with was amazed. WTF again? what are you , stupid? oh well. its just a whole lotta s**t piled into the same basket. gas are ok for what they are, but i wouldnt spend 20k on one. they werent meant to be fast, nor made to be fast. to each theyre own i suppose. my post is kinda dumb, but anyway. night people.
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