More like Pontiac is a weak seller and Buick is almost dead. Both those brands are in free-fall.

Here's 2008 sales:
Buick 137,197
Pontiac 267,348
GMC 376,996
Total BPG 781,541

Meanwhile, Chevrolet sold 1,801,131 vehicles -- over twice the number, with substantially the same product line as BPG. Three bad brands does not equal one good one ... GM needs to figure this out.

 

My take...

GM-NA should concentrate on Cadillac, Chevrolet, Buick, and GMC.

Pontiac should be the entire HOLDEN line.

Saturn should be the entire OPEL line.

IMO

 

I think Buick should be Opel with Saturn on the chopping block.

 

I don't dispute any of your points.

There are 2 issues I want to establish:

1. Between Buick and Pontiac, Pontiac needs the less work of the 2, and already has the potential to expand their volume and solidify their image.

2. Losing volume by reducing Pontiac to a niche label selling the G8 sedan and Solstice will bring that 267K down to roughly 40-50K best case.

To pay back what they currently owe (not to mention what's being borrowed via taxpayers) I don't see how it can possible be done lopping off over 200,000 in sales from a division that has the potential of substantially increasing that number by focusing the brand and a strong halo vehicle.

 

are you talking just here or globally?

 

but some of those opels overlap some chevys (insignia/malibu)

 

Doesn't anyone here think that Byuck, PONTIAC, and GMC offer the owner of such a dealership the opportunity to have desirable, non-reskinned Chevy's?

Counter to popular opinion, pickups, X-Overs, and SUV's are not dead.

Give more focused products in the car line, and X-Overs and full frame trucks to sell.

In my own personal opinion, non-Chevy dealers demanded whatever Chevy had that was moving. There was a time when every non-Pontiac GM store was begging for cladding as Pontiac was moving product with cladding.

Earnestly, you folks see no wisdom in consolidating points of purchase?

Buick is not as wounded as many here presume. It sells in parts of the world where selling is in it's fundamental formative stages. There is NO GOOD REASON to off Buick.

I believe Pontiac to have a part in a very bright future over time. I just don't see it as a standalone store.

 

True, I guess I was thinking long term that could possibly be something to work towards...

 

hey i'd love some more opels here so i kinda agree with you.

the corsa and more astra models would do wonders for GM-NA right now.

 

That's one thing that's always bothered me about GM... we can't have cars that you guys drive, you can't have cars that the Europeans drive... but the Euros and Japanese export nearly all their cars globally.

Opel should have been given an opportunity to sell its cars in the US... and I'm not referring to 'Americanized' cars like the Cobalt! It's a total waste of dollars to convert the Astra to a Cobalt IMO. And why the need to convert the Vectra to an Aura, Insignia to a Buick etc...?

 

Opel is a strong seller in Europe, yet it isn't here. Holden only recently lost it's #1 standing in Australia to Toyota, and is the only GM division that makes a sizable part of it's living via exports. Simply because Buick is big in China doesn't make it a solid case for here.


I agree with you that suvs and especially crossovers are by no means dead, or even on life support. But I submit a few observations/opinions.

First, it's tough to make a case of success for a car divisions that is outsold by a G6, simply because it's big in China. Buick's success here in the US is limited to the northeast. Pull Michigan, Pennsylvania, & Ohio out of the equasion, and Buick doesn't look very viable at all.

Second, Pontiac outsells Buick 2 to 1. Pontiac has a relatively full line of cars and IMHO would take realtively little of scarce GM capita to improve. It already has something of a performance/excitement image. If there is any GM line that can turn into a label as popular in California as it is in the Northeast, it's Pontiac.


I see the wisdom in consolidating the point of purchase. Pontiac, Buick, and GMC under a combined roof is certainly far better than separate. But Buick is selling 2, and soon to be 3 cars and 1 SUV, and outside the Enclave, very small sales volume. If anything might seem to be a niche nameplate, it's Buick next to Pontiac instead of the other way around.

I don't advocate killing off Buick. I know I've indicated I would, but as long as Buick has large market in China, new Buicks will essentially be free... just like the G8 ST and sportswagon were.

What I do advocate is utilizing any opportunity to fill production line capacity. Using Buick's China operations to supply Buicks here is an efficient use of resources, and therfore there is no reasons to kill Buick. But so was expanding the G8 line, which was killed in the 11th hour although they are already in production and being sold elsewhere.

I also advocate Buick's & Pontiac's lineup complementing each other as they basically do already.. just fine tune it. Sending the Lacrosse upmarket, away from the G6 is a step in that direction.

 

Sure, it's possible that Pontiac might still have a future. I personally believe that to do that will require just one very polished, youth oriented, product --- with the legs to make a splash --- and I don't mean with 12 guys on the internet still waiting for the Firebird or GTO.
I hate to overuse the Mini analogy, but that's the sort of niche/cult energy I'm referring to. Just one car. Get it right, market it right.

 

Opels were sold in the US through Buick dealers in the 1960's. I know because I was alive then... Goodness me, they used to have Buick/Opel dealerships. The Opel GT sold pretty well and had a run from 1968- 1973, if memory serves me well. There were also Opel Kadetts and Mantas sold here.

The Opel GT had styling much like the '68 Corvette...

Buick and Opel had quite a relationship at one time, and might well again. Wait a minute... isn't the Chinese market car called the Buick Regal based on the Opel Insignia?

 

Well said Charlie. Maybe something with some Teutonic heritage and flair?

 

Well I'm old enough to know the Opel Catera was once sold as a Cadillac...

But my point is this... All this talk about managing the GM brands is a waste of time. Imagine how much time GM must spend to distinguish its models from its other models. It creates an 'Us vs Them' mentality within the organisation... and that's probably where most of the bureaucracy lies? It might have worked in the past but these days the world is a very different place.

Back to my main point... if the Astra was deemed a suitable vehicle for North America, then it would be very easy for GM to sell it as a Chev if (for example) Chev, Cadillac and GMC were the only brands within GM.