Do yourself a favor, and read what C&D and R&T had to say about the G6. Then go out, drive a Passat GL, a Nissan Altima SE V6, or perhaps even an Infiniti G35 in base trim. Try a Camry/Accord even. If you can't find a better car by the time you hit the Poncho dealer...

 

I can't remember, in all this confusion, redzed: Have you driven the G6 yet? Or did you just "read what C&D and R&T had to say"? Of course, what I've seen in C&D and R&T were brief drives, not full road/track tests...

A G35?! Yeah, good luck getting one of those for a G6 price... kefkafloyd, after you drive the G35, go check out the LS430 too...

I'm pretty sure the G6 competes with the Accord/Camry/Altima/Mazda 6, not the G35/3 Series/C-Class/A4. :blah:

 

[QUOTE=Jason E]I believe you should run for office...a bunch of claims with no substantiated facts...

I'll bet that the 328i spent alot more for what he got than the "hopped-up" GTP kid. Them Beemers got resale value.

Yup, there probably more Nascar fans among the ranks of the Pontiac faithful. I agree, so what are we talking about?

1. The GTO doesn't have as much character as the Ram-Air "Batmobile" T/As.

2. The Catera was just about as good to drive as the GTO - drivetrain aside the Opel-build Caddy had a great chassis.

3. Like the Catera, the GTO is something of a sales "underacheiver." Do you really think that the styling was the only reason for both cars failing to move units?

4. Just how many GTOs have you sold?


Thanks ever so much.

Good point, although plaid seats were really popular in Mercedes Taxi cabs a few years back. Has Jason E ever worked a taxi-driver in Berlin?


Yup, and I barely touched on the topic of plaid seats.

 

The plaid seat Mercedes comment has me slightly confused...but then again, I really don't much care anyways. And how in the world did we go from talking about Pontiacs having a "Nascar," redneck appeal (as you seem to feel) to discussing BMW resale value? I think you know what the Nascar reference was to, seeing as how you brought it up! You tried implying Pontiac enthusiasts were somehow a lower-grade, Nascar-watching bunch who wouldn't know a good car if it ran them over. Your comment that I don't get too many BMW's on my lot implied they, as well as their owners, are a cut above. So redzed...I don't know, what are YOU talking about????

We were only allocated 3 GTOs all year, and all 3 are long gone...2 of which sold BEFORE the wonderful $3,500 rebates. Exactly why do you ask? Its a great car. Go find someone else who drove one who thinks they are not. I've driven a Catera. Saying a GTO is like a Catera is like saying a Contour drives like a Jaguar X-Type, or a Malibu drives like a 9-3 Aero. It might be based off the same basic underpinnings, but the experience is entirely different.

At this point, I am having trouble figuring out why you're still arguing, quite frankly. I like the Cobalt and the G6...a lot. I have driven a G6 and walked away with a great opinion of a well-done car. I am not swayed because Car and Driver said the foreign competition was more "fun to drive" because they dial in more oversteer. Even THEY admit the normal drivers for these cars will never experience the difference. Car and Driver walked away with a lot of nice things to say about the car. Their "numb" steering comment will not apply to the GTP, as it will have hydraulic steering. I also sincerely doubt the normal G6 buyer will have ANY idea whatsoever that their "inferior" OHV engine doesn't sound as smooth over 5000 RPMs. What they WILL notice is the superior gas mileage the engine offers, however.

96Camaro, no, he has not bothered to drive one, but is making a feeble attempt at being an armchair quarterback here, doing little more than reciting magazine articles. I think his "following the herd" comment really applies more to him...

 

Lol, for a while I was a gm follower, and one thing I learned is quite the number of GM loyalists are the same as Bush backers....

they cant see through the Bs.

Yes, the G6 looks great, and it is a huge step above the grand am..... but most the g6's i see sticker above 25k, are they fuggin nuts? quite a bit of them are even in the 27k range. This is Acura TSX, Nissan Maxima, Loaded Passat territory.

Car salesmen will sell anything to anyone, but if you are spending $27,000 hard earned dollars, why teh fug in the right mind would you spend it on a grand am replacement? at least spend it on a grand prix, or do yourself a favor and go across the street to any import brand. Until the rebates kick in on it, lol, forget about it.

 

So I guess if Pontiac makes a car equal to the TSX, Passat, etc...they cant charge the same? Is there a law against that? Has Pontiac dropped to such a level people cannot understand why Pontiac would price a car in such a range?

Wow...thought Id never see the day.

 

1) I'm a GM follower, but hate George Bush with a passion...what does that make me? Someone who only sees through certain BS?? Gimme a break...

2) Have you driven a G6 yet? Hell, did you even read the damn post? A $27,000 G6 is with EVERYTHING...6 disc, chrome wheels, leather, a FIFTEEN HUNDRED DOLLAR SUNROOF (something the GP doesn't offer...does it???), On-Star, etc. Big Al just made the point...and I'll leave it at that. Sure, it is possible to price a G6 over a more basic GP...when was that NOT possible with ANY more basic Grand Am variant??? Have you checked the price on a GP lately, or ANY new car in its class for that matter? Did you know the smaller Mazda 6s with fewer options tops $26k itself when you add an automatic to it?

3) Nice comment about car salesmen Which also proves my point there is no way you bothered to read the post, because for me its a side job on Saturdays...an extension of my car hobby, if you will. I may be a lot of things, but one thing I am not is biased towards GM. I am biased towards American products because I'm American, and I believe people have a duty to help support their own. If you anyone here thinks I'm wrong, I really and truly don't care...

GM has its flaws, but what car company does not? The never-ending line of crap about how wonderful imports are and how crappy American cars are will end someday...I just know it. Go drive a G6, and THEN tell me how "superior" the imports are. C&D gave the car a very good review overall.

You can wait for the rebates, but something tells me you weren't interested in one anyways!

 

Thank you.

 

You do realize you can take a "base" 3-series, which starts around, what? $29k, and optionit out to be in the low $40's, right? And that's not even getting into the M3.

I really don't understand this issue.

For as long as I can remember, you coudl load up a model "under" another in any given lineup and have it price out higher than the base price of the next model up...

What's the issue with that?

 

With G6's going pretty fast, or so reports say, I dont think we will see much in rebates. Much like the Nox, the G6 will sell with little to no cash on the hood. I belive that the Altima has 2k on the hood.
I think that the G6 is a deffinate turn around and all thoes who are usualy going to pick up a grand am, will be very VERY surprised by this car. And for the same price, they get a much better car with much better interior fit and finish, as well as much better styling with NO body cladding! Higher hp engine then the GA, and a much neater package all together. A deffinate improvement.

 

I actually saw a G6 on the road today for the first time. If Pontiac can get people into the dealerships, this car isnt gonna have problems selling if it is priced with the competition. The pictures do not do this car justice. The thing has the shape and stance of an Acura TSX. Very sporty looking sedan. And it was conveniently located two cars behind a silver Grand Am. It looks like the cars were built by two different manufacturers.

 

The uncomfortable fact of the matter is that there is pricing overlap between lots of dull, mainstream products and some very exciting near-luxury cars. Who's smarter, the guy who shells out nearly $28K for a loaded up, entry level mid-sized G6 or the dude who lays out the same amount of money for a base 325i? When it comes time to trade in a couple of years, Poncho man is going to have the rude awakening.

 

Or you could look at it from the side of the 3-4 years that the guy owns the G6, he gets the enjoyment and benefits of all the equipment he GETS with the G6, that he does NOT with the 325i.

So, in the long run, ya, the BMW is most likely gonna have a higher resale value... but you pay for that in equipemt you do not get that you do in the G6...

Resale value isn't everything... and even if the difference in resale is $2k, that still doesn't even put it CLOSE to what it would cost to get comperable equipment on the 325i.

Also, back to earth reality, hardly anyone buys a stripped 325i. So your little threory and rant kind of blows up on you.

Heck, unless you pay a PREMIUM for PAINT, you can choose from Black, White, or Red... that's it.

 

The lowest price BMW is the 325i that sells for $29,995 with NO options. It has stupid "leatherette" seats even. I bet you can't find one with no options at your BMW dealer. Although I bet you could get a good deal on a 2004 325i they are trying to get rid of. But you'll have to talk them down from a sticker of 33 or 34K, so I bet you still couldn't touch the $27,000 for the Pontiac. Also, the Pontiac has 240 hp vs the Beemer's 184. Another thing is BMW makes a fortune off of their options because things like leather seats, power seats, upgraded audio, auto trannies, sunroofs, sport packages, etc. are all extra cost options. It seems kind of stupid that you would have to pay extra for leather seats and color choice in a luxury car.

And redzed you fail to mention that the 3 series is a much smaller car than the G6. The back seat and trunk in the G6 are significantly larger than the Beemer.

 

I love the fact I can sit back and watch everyone else rip him a new one while all the points I made went unchallenged Save your breath guys...no matter how many points you own him on, he'll ignore them and bring up some other crap...