4th Gen died because Chevy wanted it too...plain and simple.

Also to be honest now many people under thirty would know a 1st gen Camaro if they saw it? A lot of non car junkies would assume that it is a Mustang or Chevelle because it looks so different from what every one thinks is an F-body in that I mean the low slung look.

Also something to note...

RP was telling me about a marketing study GM did where they pulling people from all walks of life, showed them pictures of the Camaro from all 35 model years and asked them which they most thought personified what a Camaro was.


The winner that the group selected turned out to be the 1985 IROC-Z which I can agree with.

The IROC IMO was probaly the the most beautiful Camaro ever

 

Metallic Blue, with the chromed 5 spokes.

 

guionM, I think you hit the nail on the head, here... The volume and demand for "low slug" GT cars is not the same today as what is was in years past.

Unlike the consumer of years past, the modern consumer is not willing to accept the design "evils" of the past..The influx of imports, with previously unheard of quality levels, performance, and innovative design has dramatically changed the playing field. Poor interior ergonomics, now are not something that is "typical" for the "sports" car market. It is not accepted that build quality & reliability is a function of vehicle sticker price. With the influx of FWD, winter driveability is much more of a concern now, than in 1978/79 when F-body sales were at it's peak....

I think that the mid-size, 3-box design, with good ergonimics, room for 4 (ADULTS) and excellent quality is what will sell...And the notion that the GTO fills "That segment" is invalid when the GTO is only meant to be a low-volume "halo" car and is not one designed for the masses....

If Pontiac/Chevrolet came in with a vehicle priced around $21,500 with V-6 and maybe 26,0000 with a V-8 traction control, ABS, standard, they would have a winner.....

 

I have something to get off of my chest.


THE CAMARO SHOULD NOT BE MERELY A CHEAPER, LESS POWERFUL GTO!!!!!



Thank you.

 

What should it be? Be consise and tell how GM will do it..

 

The GTO always was and is a mid-sized 2 door sedan/coupe. If the next Camaro and next GTO share the VE platform...that's one thing, but the Camaro should never be a mid-sized two door sedan.

GM should spend the extra bucks to keep the Camaro a Camaro. It should be abit lower and more agressive than GTO....and certainly, models like Z/28, should not be considered lower performance than GTO.

Ford did so many things right with the Mustang and GM did so many things wrong with the 4th gen F-car...that it is just incredulous to me that GM product planners are stuck, seemingly only, on this "upright" thing for Camaro. As if that was the only difference in the handling of these two products.

I submit that Mustang did better than the F-car for a variety of reasons.....namely Ford corporate commitment to the Mustang.

How about if GM copies that...and let's get off of this "let's turn the Camaro into a two door sedan" kick.

 

Alright I've got a little more time now.

A Camaro is anything but a cheaper, base model GTO. I think Tempest is the car that qualifies for that.

So is Camaro supposed to be a 21st century Tempest now? What's next? Will it come as a four door too? How about a wagon?

The fact of the matter is that Camaros are sporty. Camaros are not 2 door sedans. Camaros are not Tempests. People who are interested in buying Camaros accept this. These same people also want a modern car with beautiful styling and high quality. Maybe GM ought to consider that! Maybe if we had that...GM's focus groups wouldn't tell them that they need to comfortably wear a top hat while driving a future Camaro.

Performance Camaros do not play second fiddle to GTO's....never have and never should. Ever hear of any GTO putting the hurt on a Z/28....NOT IN THIS UNIVERSE!

Will the next Temp....er....Camaro be only bought by people who can't afford a GTO, or will it have it's own identity and look?


To GM:


DON'T SCREW THIS UP.
DON'T SCREW THIS UP.
DON'T SCREW THIS UP.

 

I see what you're getting at, and I wholeheartedly agree. The Camaro, if it shares a platform with GTO, should NOT be the car you look at as "well I'd rather have the more prestigous, more expensive big brother GTO but I had to settle for the Camaro."

If Camaro shares the VE platform with GTO, it shouldn't be obvious. And, it sure as heck shouldn't be seen as the poor-man's GTO.

 

I think people are making some unecessary assumptions here.

Who said GM designers are intent and focused on making Camaro an "upright" 2 door sedan??? Somebody here threw out that comment and it seems like everyone's taking it as gospel.....there's no proof that is what is happening.

Also, I think it was GuionM that threw out the comment on Camaro having less power than GTO. That was also under his "guesses" section of his post. I too disagree that this should be the case, but after reading some of these posts you'd think that GM is damned and determined to "shove this down the throats of enthusiasts". Again, there's nothing to support this....so don't go all crazy with paranoia yet.

In other words...take a chill pill....

 

.....and what will this new Camaro look like? Will it look like a stripped GTO with a chrome spear in the grill?

Camaro needs it's own identity. If you must........share "black metal" with the GTO......BUT CAMARO MUST LOOK NOTHING LIKE GTO!

 

Why?

 

Take a chill pill huh?

Let's put this together.

1)

-Danno sees a concept believed to represent a Camaro.

- He says that it's taller than his current Camaro and larger than the Mustang which was there. It is even compared to an Accord coupe.

-Industry sources have suggested that Camaro and GTO will become platform mates. The Camaro will be sold at higher volume and lower cost than GTO.

-Their have been reports for quite sometime now that GM want to make a next gen Camaro more sedan like.

-There have been repeated whispers that GM might want to fold the Monte Carlo demographic into the next Camaro.


.....all of this makes me think 2 door, upright sedan.

2)

The LS1 that goes into GTO goes thru revisions to produce more power and torque. Camaro's power levels are deemed inadequate for GTO.

GTO get's the T56 out of the Z06. Camaro's T56 is good enough for F-car, but not for GTO.

Bob Lutz says GTO will get LS6. LS6 is way too good for F-car.

Rumored 430hp LS2 for GTO.


.....all of this makes me think Camaro will not have power levels of GTO.

What other conclusions can be reached?

 

I agree that maybe many need a chill pill, but
a Camaro(Z28) has to be the right way

More power that the GT (mustang)
Faster that the GTO
Cheaper that the GTO
I think that the size of the Camaro should be like a 03 Accord or maybe a bit smaller, but it needs to be a bit shorter than what it is now (many people think that is too big)


and one of the most important thing is GM needs a Camaro soon!

 

OK - what company in their right mind will sell a faster, better handling and better looking coupe for less money than one of their other models ???

 

Why? I'll tell you why.

The Camaro is a true American GT. It has an aura and personality that no other car quite manages to capture.

The Monaro translates very well into a GTO IMHO....but Monaro/GTO is not a Camaro.

Camaro has a distinct personality. It is low and agressive. It is not a car designed for the lowest common denominator. It is not a car for everyone.....yet, even those who wouldn't buy it, know what it is.

It is the grand and raucous American GT.........and it is not a 2 door sedan.