Hahaha

It's hilarious how many people destroy everything this guy says. And he just sits there and takes it. He doesn't even try to defend himself. He only repeats what he has already tried to say and goes into his hole.

 

Yeah Buickman sucks.

He doesen't answer questions directed at him.

Has never given us any credentials but his glossy sales record... in Flint... well duh.

The irony is he has part of the attitude that he criticizes management for having. Short sighted as hell. That cars and perception aren't part of the problem, if dealerships were better everything would be ok, if promotions were better GM would be ok....

You can only sell an inferior or at least thought to be inferior product to so many people so many times at any price. This promotion will put people in the cars many of whom would not have even considered them before. Sure its a short term loss but has the potential to be a very good long term gain. One, its temporary, two, I don't think anyone EXPECTED to make money off of it. It's purely a PR move, and it was desperately needed.

 

Granted in MI the GMS works, Dealers get high percentage loyalty and have made adjustments. The problem is the rest of the country where dealers ARE upset, and rightly so. I believe I've addressed every question asked. If you feel otherwise, ask away and you'll get your answer.
GM was already losing money. We can't afford the price cut. Dealers from CA to PA are screaming mad, as are the salespeople I talk to. Sure, here in MI it's business as usual. As I said, I'm selling cars but the difference is I see how this continued distress marketing hurts the brands.
Imagine you're on the playground as a kid. The cutest girl is standing next to you thinking you're just it. She stares at you in amazement and wonderment. You don't pay her much attention. You are more concerned with the other girls. It's human nature to want that which is not yet yours. Pushing the product through agressive discounting is the wrong approach. No one buys a new car because they need one. In that case, they buy used. New cars are a matter of desire. When the vehilce is force fed, there is no desire. If the "deal" isn't too good to be true, no sale. This upsurge is temporary and will not last. In the long run, it will prove itself detrimental.

 

You've said this a few times already, and it's not so much that you are not answering questions. It's more that someone will quote you and debate everything you said, counter all the points you brought up, and point out the BS in your post's. Then as we all wait for you to defend your position, or come back with something that could validate your side of the argument, you let us all down and sidestep the issue all together. Often when someone brings up facts that contradict what you just claimed, you post something totally different like you didn't even see the post that was directed towards your comments. That, BM, is why you have NO credibility here and no one takes you seriously.

 

I hope you have a 3 car day Jason... Nothing would make me happier. I no longer sell out there on the pavement where it is very tough...but I'm hoping that every salesman passes the 9 per month norm and even can manage to hit the bonus points.

Good people get great cars, hard working folks get a nice paycheck... sounds like capitalism to me.

 

Yeah, doesn't sound too much like Communism as Buickman puts it, now does it???

I've had a few 3 car days, all awhile back. This is my Saturday-only gig now, but it gets the old blood flowing again to sell some decent cars to nice people. Its the kind of thing I don't get at a bank working Monday - Friday!!!!

My sales manager (part owner of the dealership) and I have talked a lot since I left my full-time spot in August 2003...I want to come back, but feel like my MBA and bank experience would be put to waste in no time Management at a dealership, sure...but while the sales floor is where the action is, I want to do more. I've been lucky enough during my 5 years here to sell, buy cars at auctions, run the advertising for new and used, do all my own F&I, order cars, hell...I've done pretty much everything. Some dealer out there must want someone like me and not force me out on the floor for 2-3 years to prove myself!!!

BTW, I've sold 4 new cars for this month, and that's only working 3 Saturdays I know I can sell one more in the next 2 Saturdays based on the hype surrounding the GMS pricing, so that means I can get half the 9 car average working 4 total days

 

I've lurked here for a while (I'm a mod at C&G) but felt the need to chime in on this thread.

Buickman, why would salespeople be mad that they are selling more cars? Sales at my local dealership are up 50% and they're loving it. Sure, they have to work more because they are busier, but I'm sure they're much happier to be making money selling lots of cars than sitting around and sometimes not selling anything in a few days!

The only thing some dealers are mad about is that they don't get to fight for more profit. Instead of fighting a customer for an extra $250-500 here and there, they have to give the vehicle to the customer at a fixed price. None of them are complaining that the program isn't bringing new people into GM showrooms or increasing showroom traffic.

To quote detnews.com:
And to say that GM is losing more money by doing the employee pricing for everyone is 100% incorrect. Maybe on some vehicles they are losing more money, but it also removes the ability of the customer to haggle and get the car at close to invoice anyways. If the GM employee discount is on average $2000 below invoice but the customer is not able to haggle any more money off the cost of the car, GM sells it at $2k under invoice. However, before a customer may have been able to haggle the deal down to ~$250 over invoice before incentives (we did this on our Maxx and TB) and then get an extra $4k back, meaning the actually transaction price is $3750 under invoice, a $1750 gain for GM over the prior deals. This may not be the case in FLINT because many buyers probably don't haggle much, but this is the case in the majority of the country.

 

The price the customer pays has nothing to do with GM. Previously the dealer sold the car to the dealer at invoice and reimbursed 3% holdback, call it net. Now they reinvoice for the same amount, don't pay the 3%, but pay 5% memo amount. This is a net loss of 2%. Plus under this program if you sell it as a true GMS with authorization code, the salesman gets $75 and the manager gets $25. Each emp sale costs $100 extra. Believe me GM goes backwards huge under this program. We were already losing money.
Dealers are upset, except those who did not properly manage their inventory. Salespeople are making a lot less per car. The weak sisters who couldn't sell their way out of a paper bag are happy to be able to claim themselves as salespeople, when in fact they are simply in the right place at the right time. Big Wow!

 

I've read this entire thread.

This is what I got out of it:

1. Temporarily losing an assembly plant is the same as giving plant workers a paid vacation. Instead of doing this, GM choses to keep the plants rolling by coming up with a way to keep sales going. Making something of value is better than simply giving money away, since the money is going to be spent one way or the other.

2. GM's Employee discount scheme is doing just that by providing a massive increase in sales.

3. Since GM jumped up to 30% so far this month from the 25% it's been running, that means GM is pulling people who would likely have avoided GM dealers entirely.

4. GM dealers have the OPTION of participating in this. Most every one does because it would be almost suicidal not to. Ciustomers would simply drive down the street to a dealer who does.

5. Dealers and sales people ARE happy with the program because it's tremendously increased traffic & sales, and they are still getting good money from GM from moving the metal.

6. Only Buickman seems unhappy with this program because:
a) There isn't the ability to wheel & deal for that extra $500 or more, a process that makes buyers feel had when they sit down and do the numbers later.
b) It isn't part of his idea, and it actually seems to be working.
c) It's a legal way for GM to reign in dealers from raping customers on markups.

7. GM is running a very real risk of doing just as much damage to their bottom line as they were doing with rebates.

8. GM may not do their bottom line much damage because the MSRP on most all vehicles are exaggerated in the 1st place, and the transaction price is far and away lower.

9. There is a very legitimate question about what happens to sales once this program's over, since you won't ever be able to go back to the old pricing structure..... but this is something that GM is getting away from anyway, so it's a non-issue.

10. Based on my own experience here in California, dealers here seem to love the new program as much as JasonE and the others indicate. This discounts Buickman's assertion that dealers (at least the few dealers I know in LA, the Bay Area, and San Diego anyway) are screaming and complaining (they don't have to play anyway, right?). GM typically does worse here than in any other part of the country but now sales are substantially up here as well...... oh, and buy the way: Dealers ARE making money in all this!!!!

Bottom line is this:
1. This program works: It's building showroom traffic, moving cars, keeping factories going, and is a straightforward honest deal for car buyers, that doesn't involve any of the hocus-pocus "SOME" dealers relish.

2. GM & dealers will never be able to go back to business as usual: GM will be forced to price vehicles closer to actual transaction price. This also gives GM a way to reign in dealers like the ones who were scalping on the GTO so that when GM's new products come out, there's an option they have to bring things in line. Dealers can still opt out of the program, but again, customers will simply drive to another GM dealer.

Price fixing? Communism? Yeah right. Get a life!

 

Time will tell what is right and what is an illusion.

 

Get this, your full of it if you say this isnt a positive thing for GM. Even if your not making as much money for each sale, think of how many more cars your selling and how many more people this has caused to buy in the future.

 

We prostitute ourselves and the market and you think it's wonderful, how shallow.

 

Just went to get my car serviced at a local dealership. Here's what I immediately noticed:
0 Cobalts (Coupes or Sedans). Last time I was there 3 mos. ago, they had 4 sedans, 1 coupe.
3 Malibus LS (loaded @23k), 1 Maxx. Last vist 9-10, all models.
1 Impala, a fully loaded SS. Last vists 4-5, different trim levels.


This lot was literally picked clean, of most cars. There were a bunch of SUVs though. This promotion IS working, and in So. California at that!

 

You know, if you crunch the numbers on this, GM really isn't giving more away than they have in the past with rebates. This is especially true if you fully finance a vehicle, as we have done. Our GP for instance, was financed GMAC for 60 months at 0% financing. How much money do you think GM gave away on that? Now if you look, you will see that the 0% is gone on just about every model, save the really pathetic ones like Aztec and Sunfire.

Yes it will. It seems as if you are the one putting up illusions. The hard sell simply has not worked on these forums as well as you thought it would, has it? Thing is, the people here are the smart customers. You know, the ones who don't pay MSRP, and know the invoice on a vehicle. Thus, you shouldn't have expected to sell your plan here by pretending omniscience and employing scare tactics.

The good salesman always knows their customer.

 

You attract hordes of customers new and old, clear out inventory and make slightly less money and you think its terrible, how greedy.