GM has a plan to keep Pontiac buyers...
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Joined: Sep 2001
Posts: 2,030
From: Frankfort, KY U.S.A.
Well, after perusing clubgp.com for a couple minutes earlier at work, and eBay this evening, I've found...
1) A VERY influential, hard-core GP owner and a long-time clubgp contributor just bought his new Maxima...
2) A Nissan dealer in Colorado Springs, CO has a gorgeous '97 GTP for sale on eBay, as a FRESH TRADE
3) A bunch of clubgp'ers complaining in a thread they have no idea what to buy, other than non-GM brands.
So, how much of this is happening EVERY DAY, across the country, with Pontiac owners? Good luck keeping us, GM...
1) A VERY influential, hard-core GP owner and a long-time clubgp contributor just bought his new Maxima...
2) A Nissan dealer in Colorado Springs, CO has a gorgeous '97 GTP for sale on eBay, as a FRESH TRADE
3) A bunch of clubgp'ers complaining in a thread they have no idea what to buy, other than non-GM brands.
So, how much of this is happening EVERY DAY, across the country, with Pontiac owners? Good luck keeping us, GM...
Hey Jason, I was looking at this the other day, at a car lot close to me. A2002 40th Anniversary GTP Coupe. Very well cared for, just under 100K. Looks like someone held on to it for a while, I just wondered what they traded it in on?
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Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 632
From: NC
I work primarily for Chevrolet, but I do understand that it is GM. My first position forGM was at the corporate level. None of my friends who worked for individual divisions had a problem that I was involved with helping grassroots racing for Corvette. The gent who had much to do with Corvette suspension and the C5R/C6R racing is also the guy who had a lot to do with the Caddillac CTS-V cars developed for Speed World Challenge. I don't know if my harping that Cadillac should be racing cars it sold rather than prototypes helped make that happen. Point is, it was a GM effort.
That's what I mean when I say Pontiac fans are IMO, my opinion, GM fans. Whether or not Pontiac fans view themselves that way, I don't see tham as abandoned, and I don't want to have any of those folks feel their kind of car isn't something GM wants to offer. I'm not alone in those feelings.
Pontiac fans have every right to be disappointed. Being consumers certainly means that they can choose not to do busness with any other GM division.
Anyone who has ever owned a Pontiac has owned a GM vehicle. A particular "flavor" of a GM vehicle, but GM nonetheless.
I'm hoping the Pontiac fans will keep an eye on what comes from any of the remaining GM brands and judge if any of that Pontiac attitude and flavor shows up elsewhere.
I don't expect loyalty just because it's a GM. I would hope folks would look and determine what car does it for them regardless of the nameplate.
The folks that did Pontiacs are still around. If Pontiac going away makes anyone feel they no longer matter to GM? It's not the case. This I know for a fact.
That's what I mean when I say Pontiac fans are IMO, my opinion, GM fans. Whether or not Pontiac fans view themselves that way, I don't see tham as abandoned, and I don't want to have any of those folks feel their kind of car isn't something GM wants to offer. I'm not alone in those feelings.
Pontiac fans have every right to be disappointed. Being consumers certainly means that they can choose not to do busness with any other GM division.
Anyone who has ever owned a Pontiac has owned a GM vehicle. A particular "flavor" of a GM vehicle, but GM nonetheless.
I'm hoping the Pontiac fans will keep an eye on what comes from any of the remaining GM brands and judge if any of that Pontiac attitude and flavor shows up elsewhere.
I don't expect loyalty just because it's a GM. I would hope folks would look and determine what car does it for them regardless of the nameplate.
The folks that did Pontiacs are still around. If Pontiac going away makes anyone feel they no longer matter to GM? It's not the case. This I know for a fact.
Not to sound strange or anything, but I really do appreciate that.
I own classic Chevies, my family has been a Chevrolet family since before I was born. However, as I got more into the hobby (classic cars) I began to really love Pontiac as a division (not specific car lines) more than Chevrolet. Then, when GM said that Pontiac would be receiving Zeta and Alpha to go along with a Kappa II Solstice, I really became a believer.
To people like me, the enthusiast Pontiac was to be "our division". Chevrolet (with the exception of a few obvious models) was to be the Toyota alternative (which they are becoming: new Malibu, Equinox, Cruze and Traverse signal the beginning of a new era, IMO) And I think that's why a lot of us are so pissed at GM. They dangled the carrot in front of us, the people who have had the loyalty to support them and even fight for them online and in our communities. And then they shut the door in our faces. They could've EASILY made Pontiac into something of the division that it should've been as early as 2005, but they chose not to. I also think it would've been pretty easy for the brand to become a niche player.
I think the solution to keeping Pontiac buyers (the real GM fans, not the sorority girls in G6s) is easy but not cost effective and not likely to happen.
GM needs to give us a worthy SS/Z-- sub brand for Chevrolet. They had a pretty good one going with the Cobalt SS, HHR SS, TB SS and Camaro SS. But alas, all we're left with now is the Camaro. The vehicles should have more performance and better (more aggressive) styling.
As for the female/other clientele.... I *still* think Buick has the best shot at getting them with the new Regal, Astra and CUV. Chevrolet, in it's current form, is just too plebian for these folks.
As for me; I used to be faithful to only GM (for new car purchases). But now, I can't say that I am. As much as I would LOVE to see them succeed, I'm not really interested in MOST of their line up. Hopefully, that will change.
Last edited by FUTURE_OF_GM; Jul 12, 2009 at 03:12 PM.
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 1,502
You really should check US sales before making that assumption.
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Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 203
From: U.S.A.
I work primarily for Chevrolet, but I do understand that it is GM. My first position forGM was at the corporate level. None of my friends who worked for individual divisions had a problem that I was involved with helping grassroots racing for Corvette. The gent who had much to do with Corvette suspension and the C5R/C6R racing is also the guy who had a lot to do with the Caddillac CTS-V cars developed for Speed World Challenge. I don't know if my harping that Cadillac should be racing cars it sold rather than prototypes helped make that happen. Point is, it was a GM effort.
That's what I mean when I say Pontiac fans are IMO, my opinion, GM fans. Whether or not Pontiac fans view themselves that way, I don't see tham as abandoned, and I don't want to have any of those folks feel their kind of car isn't something GM wants to offer. I'm not alone in those feelings.
Pontiac fans have every right to be disappointed. Being consumers certainly means that they can choose not to do busness with any other GM division.
Anyone who has ever owned a Pontiac has owned a GM vehicle. A particular "flavor" of a GM vehicle, but GM nonetheless.
I'm hoping the Pontiac fans will keep an eye on what comes from any of the remaining GM brands and judge if any of that Pontiac attitude and flavor shows up elsewhere.
I don't expect loyalty just because it's a GM. I would hope folks would look and determine what car does it for them regardless of the nameplate.
The folks that did Pontiacs are still around. If Pontiac going away makes anyone feel they no longer matter to GM? It's not the case. This I know for a fact.
That's what I mean when I say Pontiac fans are IMO, my opinion, GM fans. Whether or not Pontiac fans view themselves that way, I don't see tham as abandoned, and I don't want to have any of those folks feel their kind of car isn't something GM wants to offer. I'm not alone in those feelings.
Pontiac fans have every right to be disappointed. Being consumers certainly means that they can choose not to do busness with any other GM division.
Anyone who has ever owned a Pontiac has owned a GM vehicle. A particular "flavor" of a GM vehicle, but GM nonetheless.
I'm hoping the Pontiac fans will keep an eye on what comes from any of the remaining GM brands and judge if any of that Pontiac attitude and flavor shows up elsewhere.
I don't expect loyalty just because it's a GM. I would hope folks would look and determine what car does it for them regardless of the nameplate.
The folks that did Pontiacs are still around. If Pontiac going away makes anyone feel they no longer matter to GM? It's not the case. This I know for a fact.
GM killed Oldsmobille (one of the most beautiful cars my family ever owned was a 1967 Delta 88 fastback two-door coupe) then they killed the Firebird (the first brand new car I ever owned was a 1973 Forumla 400) and now they've killed Pontiac completely...pretty soon GM will look just like Toyota/Lexus or Honda/Acura or Nissan/Infiniti.
That may or may not make them profitable but from where I'm sitting; it also doesn't make them look like anything special.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 184
To date - I've owned nothing but Pontiacs. However the Pontiac of recent years(since 2006) bares little resemblance to the Pontiac of the 1960's -1990's - when they were truely the "performance division".
That said - I also consider myself to be a fan of GM as a whole. And my 2nd favorite GM division has always been Chevrolet. Now that Pontiac is History - I'll likely go with a Chevy.
Besides for the better part of the last couple of decades - Pontiac where basically Chevys with a different skin, different interior & a different badge. If GM truely wants to keep the hardcore Pontiac fans - then all they need to do is offer Performance models of the current Chevrolet line - Badged as the SS models. But then they are already doing that.
That said - I also consider myself to be a fan of GM as a whole. And my 2nd favorite GM division has always been Chevrolet. Now that Pontiac is History - I'll likely go with a Chevy.
Besides for the better part of the last couple of decades - Pontiac where basically Chevys with a different skin, different interior & a different badge. If GM truely wants to keep the hardcore Pontiac fans - then all they need to do is offer Performance models of the current Chevrolet line - Badged as the SS models. But then they are already doing that.
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From: USA
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From: Van Nuys, Ca.
I don't think the general idea would change much f you chose 2005.
However if you're throwing out years due to absurdity 2005 would be the first one in the crapper. Over 17 million cars were sold that year and the SAAR peaked at 17,796,847 in December.
The only thing more absurd than those sales numbers is the fake "wealth" people were using to buy them.
http://www.autonews.com/assets/PDF/CA4271120.PDF
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Joined: Dec 2005
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Mazda6 71,447
G6 124,844
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As for Pontiac's marketshare, a lot of it probably went to Nissan. Smaller bits went to many other places ... Mazda, Honda, even brands like VW or Mini. And let's not overlook the pricing factors - Hyundai/Kia probably captured some of these sales as well.
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