IMPALA64

Wow, thanks! Great site. Sounds like GM and Holden have been together from the start.

ProudPony

Ude,
You are understandably, and justifiably proud of the fact that Oz is the country producing the Holden Monaro/Potiac GTO. It is an awesome car - no doubt. Truth is, I am jealous of you guys down under right now... both GM and Ford guys down there have a lot to be excited about.

You gotta understand how some of us feel up here though. The US has been the auto-maker-supreme of the world for almost a century. We have a lot of historic pride. We created classic cars like the Vette, T-bird, Camaro, Mustang, Firebird, Torino, Chevelle, GTO, Charger, Daytona, and on and on. It's just disheartening to see ALL of the "American Classics" being changed into just "classics", or sometimes even worse - just plain ol' "common cars" (ref Nova, Malibu, etc.). I'm not defending anybody's position, just trying to point out that some American's still want to have pride in their domestic offerings and see heritage continue - just like you do for Oz too I'm sure. But admittedly, it's getting harder to do that every day, what with foreign companies building assembly plants on our shores, our domestic parts being made in other countries, and imports that outperform and cost less than our domestic offerings, etc.

So as for your quote - why dont you just come out from the sart and say you don't like the fact that is made in australia.... simple. - For me the words are right, but the reason is not hatred or discontent with the product or with Oz - NOT AT ALL. In fact, just the opposite is true. The reason is that I feel we here in America ARE CAPABLE of doing as good a job, if not better than anyone else in the world - but we don't anymore, for whatever $tupid rea$on$. We develop an awesome engine and have to ship it somewhere else to see it put to good use? We develop state-of-the-art race cars and suspensions, but can't mass-produce stiff unibodies with gripping independent suspensions? We build space shuttles and space stations but can't design molds with parting lines out of sight or control fit/finish in our interiors? We develop electron microscopes and map human DNA but we can't get gaps, squeaks, and rattles out of a car? WTF? We should be ashamed of what we, as a country, have allowed to happen to our auto industry - we have egg on our face, lots of it.
THAT is why I hate that the slick, fast, luxurious, well-built performance car that we deserve, and have named after an American Classic, has to be designed and built in Oz and shipped here.

You guys are simply rockin' down there with the Monaro, the Barra Falcon, the Utes, and with what sounds like a very exciting future full of HiPo goodies on both sides. Potential 7.0L engines and GTHO's are enough to wizz-off any true American Musclecar fan right now, especially GM guys who have just lost the common-man's economical performance car, but I think the hatred/jealousy stems from what we have let ourselves become domestically, not what has been accomplished in your country. I hope you can understand where I'm coming from.

Peace,
Proud

Ude-lose

i agree proud...

but the aussies are here to help by offering the monaro, not to brag that we can build better cars, or that U.S. cars are POS, just that we were called apon by GM to deliver the Monaro as a GTO and thats what we have done or are doing.

We have basically one performance vehicle per Make .. eg Holden makes Commodore /Monaro/Ute/Wagon/Statsman etc etc are all based on the same platform, same as Ford has the Falcon/ fairlane / Ute etc etc.

compared to the U.S. that has so many brands and models under each Maker GM / Ford / Chrysler, which have sub brands eg GM has chev, pontiac, buick, which in term have their respective models..

Holden is all we have, so thats what we try to develop and make it the best of its kind.

I wish we had such a huge selection of cars to buy like the U.S...

ProudPony

Personally, I think I would rather have a few super-nice rides at fair prices rather than having boat-loads of sh1+ to choose from!
Personally, I think you guys still have better performance choices overall than we do here in the US. I'd have no problem driving an '03 Monaro or Falcon - especially if I didn't have to pay export, shipping charges, or tarriffs! None whatsoever! The real value in those cars is just unmatched here stateside IMO.

The Commodore and Falcons of yore were nothing to be sneezed at performance-wise or dollar-wise. I saved the vid-link you posted a while back about the GTHO - the one from the history channel where it does about a 200' long linear dual-tire-burn from a dead stop on a shipping dock... OMG! I love seeing footage of old Holdens and Tickfords at play.
I have often contemplated having just one early '70's XG or GT brought over here to go with my early '70's Mach 1 Mustangs - they share the same 351-C, 9"-rear drivetrains and many interior parts, and I think it would just be neat.

And here's yet another boost for Aussie-car lovers...
Mad Max is coming back!
I'm trying desperately to find out what his new car of choice will be in the flick... anybody got a lead?

jrp4uc

I don't feel the car's foreign construction should be an issue. Why do we not have more people disowning their Canadian-assembled Camaros and Firebirds? And before the obigatory response, "they were designed here..." etc comes up, what would be the difference in bringing in an Australian designer to draw up the next GTO for us? Do you all honestly believe only American designers work for American car companies? It's an American that works for BMW that came up with the Z4. A Japanese designer penned the new Viper. Are Italian designers a step above Australian? Does that make the Hyundai Tiburon a better car because that's who assisted in its design?

People hold beliefs in the category of import vs. domestic for a myriad of reasons. While some reasons may have credible merits, most are based on misinformed assumptions. To think this GTO will be inferior because it is made "over there" is ridiculous. In fact, every review I have seen has said this car (Monaro) has improved quality over the Pontiacs it will be lined up with. While it may not be BMW-quality (hence, $10k discount), it will certainly be a car worthy of its position and $30-35k price tag.

GM is a North American company in a global business. To think there are many "All-American" cars being made from the ground up, from any of the the big 3, is just being naive. In fact, I'm sure there are many advantages from their stand point and the customers that are being taken for granted, likely including the ever-important price of the vehicle.

As an aside, the $25k-car powertrain argument is a non-issue. What does that make of the Corvette from which it was originally derived? Nor is the "snickering" a factor with a $35k Pontiac. The only discredit might be that GM pushed so many WS6s and SSs at this price point when they shouldn't have been (IMO), perhaps lessening the perception that this time, GM has a car that is actually worth it.

redzed

It isn't about design. The beauty of buying a domestic RWD GM product was that you had a proven product that was easy to order. I just had to send a fax to my local Chevy dealer and I had my new car 4-6 weeks later. (Order codes, invoice price, no dealer advertising co-op fee, done deal.) No hassle, no negotiation, and no worries.

If I bothered to read Consumer Reports ahead of time I knew everything that was wrong with the car, which I just normally dismissed anyway. My buying decision, for the Camaro, was largely based on the performance numbers and the reviews in Car & Driver. The testdrive was just to see if I could fit in the car, more confirmation than decisionmaking. When I finally picked my dealer, I never ventured into his showroom until I picked up my car.:wink:

There is something heartwarming to know you're getting an unbeatable deal, the exact car you want, and supporting North American autoworkers. To me, whether a car came from Michigan or Quebec didn't matter.

If I have to wait for a Pacific crossing, or take current inventory pot-luck, you can count me out of most any Australian-American car. If GM wants to play the import game, I'll just buy an import.