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View Poll Results: Would you rather have CAFE or a gas tax?
Keep CAFE the way it is. No new taxes
40.74%
Dump CAFE, raise tax on gas, let the market decide what it drives.
59.26%
Voters: 27. You may not vote on this poll

Bob Lutz quote got me thinking about CAFE & fuel taxes

Old Jan 22, 2007 | 10:01 PM
  #61  
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Originally Posted by SCNGENNFTHGEN
E85!
Only one part of the solution.

Originally Posted by R377
Oil is a finite resource that every nation in the world uses. If we don't buy their oil, there's plenty of others that will. The middle east won't be bankrupted (in fact, they'll continue to grow richer) until the oil wells start to dry up.

Besides, they don't need oil money to cause trouble. Terrorism can be done remarkably cheaply. The fact is, their hatred of the west is bred into their culture (or more specifically, their religion) and they'll continue to try to destroy us no matter what their cashflow situation.
They'll go bankrupt if we develop alternative fuels which other nations can also adopt. Our ability to create the technologies we need in times of real crisis is amazing, as long as we see it as a crisis. Otherwise...

You are right that terrorism is cheap, but terrorism exported to the US from the Middle-East is not. The chaos that would follow the loss of exports to the US alone would be enough to turn their attention closer to home. Their issues are mostly local despite the blame they cast around the world - this way they get the chance to solve them, however they choose to.
Old Jan 22, 2007 | 11:35 PM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by R377
The fact is, their hatred of the west is bred into their culture (or more specifically, their religion) and they'll continue to try to destroy us no matter what their cashflow situation.
I think that's what we're expected to believe, but the more I read, the more I disagree.
Remember, they used to say the same things about Russia...now we know better.
I hate to say it, but the world will be a much better place when this hardliner, older generation dies off.
My sister's son has a termed, "terminal" illness(we're hoping science catches up) anyways...I recently had a chance to sit and talk with some Muslims at a Ronald McDonald House, and they were just like you and I. They believe in God, same God as us called by another name, and they weren't hateful at all, some of the nicest, meek people I've met. And we talked a little about what's going on over there...
They did feel thet Americans have become complacent about what our gov't does, b/c we don't try to stop them from stirring up trouble over there. And our tax money funds it. Like when Rumsfeld gave WMD's to Sadam in the '80's to fight Iran, and before that, Russians..They know it's our gov't and not the people, responsible too. I just hope we can make through the rest of Bush's term in one piece.

I've also seen a car on Metacafe that runs on watered down gasoline, soon to be just water, and he welds and cuts with a 100% water powered torch. He has engineered an electrolosis machine to separate the hydrogen from the water somehow.
Old Jan 23, 2007 | 08:56 AM
  #63  
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Thumbs down

Originally Posted by 90rocz
I think that's what we're expected to believe, but the more I read, the more I disagree... They believe in God, same God as us called by another name, and they weren't hateful at all, some of the nicest, meek people I've met. And we talked a little about what's going on over there...They know it's our gov't and not the people, responsible too. I just hope we can make through the rest of Bush's term in one piece.
Wow simply wow. You could not be anymore wrong about the subject. There are words to describe a person like you but I think I will refrain from calling you what you really are.

I spent 3 years in the Infantry and pulled two tours in Iraq. Honestly you cant get any closer to the "what's going on over there" than that. I joined to see for myself just exactly what was going on. Let me tell you from someone who actually knows what he is talking about. There "god" is quite different from the God spoke about in the bible that most Americans are familiar with. I agree with you that they do not seam hateful. They are masters of deceit and lies. In one second they go from a handshake and a smile to having a detonator and a undershirt of explosives packed with ball bearings. They always look the other way when they kill each other and Americans. There is no way to properly describe just how polar opposite and fundamentally different Americans and Iraqs are. Do I have disagreements about the war? Yes. Are they founded in actual facts? Yes. The whole GW is bad argument has grown tiresome and relays the fact that you have no knowledge on the subject.

Yeah blame Bush and the US govt for Iraqs being third world self butchering animals. Your opinions on economics and war are shortsighted, gullible, irrational and emotionally driven by "facts" that you have been told.

Last edited by Ponykillr; Jan 23, 2007 at 08:59 AM.
Old Jan 23, 2007 | 11:30 AM
  #64  
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Originally Posted by 90rocz
I think that's what we're expected to believe, but the more I read, the more I disagree.
Remember, they used to say the same things about Russia...now we know better.
I hate to say it, but the world will be a much better place when this hardliner, older generation dies off.
My sister's son has a termed, "terminal" illness(we're hoping science catches up) anyways...I recently had a chance to sit and talk with some Muslims at a Ronald McDonald House, and they were just like you and I. They believe in God, same God as us called by another name, and they weren't hateful at all, some of the nicest, meek people I've met. And we talked a little about what's going on over there...
They did feel thet Americans have become complacent about what our gov't does, b/c we don't try to stop them from stirring up trouble over there. And our tax money funds it. Like when Rumsfeld gave WMD's to Sadam in the '80's to fight Iran, and before that, Russians..They know it's our gov't and not the people, responsible too. I just hope we can make through the rest of Bush's term in one piece.
Our cultures may share the same god, but their faith is very different from ours. The Koran has countless verses that tell the believers they must destroy people that do not believe as they do. That they should not treat other religions with respect, and in fact that they must eradicate other religions. Tolerance is in no way part of the muslim religion.

A good book to read on the subject is Sam Harris's The End of Faith. It takes an objective look at all religions and shows how detrimental they really are to our society.

Originally Posted by 90rocz
I've also seen a car on Metacafe that runs on watered down gasoline, soon to be just water, and he welds and cuts with a 100% water powered torch. He has engineered an electrolosis machine to separate the hydrogen from the water somehow.
I'm not familiar with this so I'll pass comment except to note that it takes more energy to separate hydrogen and water via electrolysis than you will get in return.

[Homer Simpson] In this house we obey the laws of thermodynamics! [/Homer Simpson]
Old Jan 23, 2007 | 11:58 AM
  #65  
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From what I have seen (very little) the electrolysis machine has some good attributes but still requires the use of a lot of electricity to produce flame. The use of electricity still requires massive consumption of fossil fuels.

There seems to be some sort of controversy over a car built by a guy in the 80s that worked on a similar process. In that case there is a JFKesque assassination theory surrounding the inventors death. Regardless I have yet to see any credible implementation of any type of electrolysis powered vehicle.
Old Jan 23, 2007 | 12:06 PM
  #66  
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Originally Posted by Ponykillr
There seems to be some sort of controversy over a car built by a guy in the 80s that worked on a similar process. In that case there is a JFKesque assassination theory surrounding the inventors death.
So this car he built was a convertible
Old Jan 24, 2007 | 06:05 PM
  #67  
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I'll only say, I have read the entire Koran, and studied History and the origins of religion for years now...and most of it returns to early Egypt and Babylonia.

Water Torch??
Here you go:

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/335674..._fueled_torch/
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