6th gen Camaro wish list.
02-18-2008, 08:57 AM
#31
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Well, no one said it would be easy.
Alpha will be smaller than the 5th gen. And, at least some of the early styling proposals, are said to be very agressively styled.
For further RWD smaller coupe references, (which meet crash standards), I suppose we can also consider the BMW 1 and 3 and the Infiniti G37.
Alpha will be smaller than the 5th gen. And, at least some of the early styling proposals, are said to be very agressively styled.
For further RWD smaller coupe references, (which meet crash standards), I suppose we can also consider the BMW 1 and 3 and the Infiniti G37.
02-18-2008, 08:58 AM
#32
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Count on the production cars being slightly larger than the concepts though in most dimensions.
Last edited by Z284ever; 02-18-2008 at 09:07 AM.
02-18-2008, 09:06 AM
#33
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Charlie, the biggest difference between the 5th gen and Alpha will be width not length. You were one of the people who were most for the width of the concept (which is way too wide) to keep the proportions. Production is still too wide. I dont get yer logic sometimes...
Although Bob Lutz has stated that the Alphas will be 1 series competitors, they'll probably be more like 3 series sized. So, shorter than the production Camaro.
Also, I was directly in front of the the backstage door, when Lutz drove the concept on the stage - I was shocked at how W_I_D_E the car was, almost afraid that it might not fit through the door. Anyway, I'm not sure who you're thinking of, but that wasn't me.
02-18-2008, 10:43 AM
#34
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Not true on either count.
Although Bob Lutz has stated that the Alphas will be 1 series competitors, they'll probably be more like 3 series sized. So, shorter than the production Camaro.
Also, I was directly in front of the the backstage door, when Lutz drove the concept on the stage - I was shocked at how W_I_D_E the car was, almost afraid that it might not fit through the door. Anyway, I'm not sure who you're thinking of, but that wasn't me.
Although Bob Lutz has stated that the Alphas will be 1 series competitors, they'll probably be more like 3 series sized. So, shorter than the production Camaro.
Also, I was directly in front of the the backstage door, when Lutz drove the concept on the stage - I was shocked at how W_I_D_E the car was, almost afraid that it might not fit through the door. Anyway, I'm not sure who you're thinking of, but that wasn't me.
At any rate, Dropping from 79 inches to 71 of a 3 series for a difference of 8 inches compared to 186 length of the concept down 178 of 3 series also 8 inches. The same, but you are right about length being more of a difference when you adjust for production numbers. Still Dropping to 72 in in width would have been nice.
02-18-2008, 11:15 AM
#35
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If Alpha is about the same size as a 3-series, I don't see any problem with the 6th gen being that size, maybe a little longer.
I'm not so sure a 4-cylinder Camaro should ever be in the lineup again. A base model fuel-efficient V6 would be better image-wise. A performance V6 (turbo, DI, etc.) could take the place of the entry-level V8. The top car MUST be a V8. It is vital to the Camaro's image.
I'd like to see the 6th gen be lighter and smaller than the 5th gen by a considerable amount. Instead of ~3800 lbs., I'd like to see closer to 3300-3400 lbs. I'd like to see a focus on awesome handling. Don't neglect engine power for the sake of CAFE, though - 400+ HP in the V8 model should be doable, with decent fuel economy to boot.
I'm not so sure a 4-cylinder Camaro should ever be in the lineup again. A base model fuel-efficient V6 would be better image-wise. A performance V6 (turbo, DI, etc.) could take the place of the entry-level V8. The top car MUST be a V8. It is vital to the Camaro's image.
I'd like to see the 6th gen be lighter and smaller than the 5th gen by a considerable amount. Instead of ~3800 lbs., I'd like to see closer to 3300-3400 lbs. I'd like to see a focus on awesome handling. Don't neglect engine power for the sake of CAFE, though - 400+ HP in the V8 model should be doable, with decent fuel economy to boot.
02-18-2008, 11:19 AM
#36
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Well this was answered before I asked. Many of your posts seem to talk about how heavy the production car will/should/could/might be. I was begining to think you knew something extra on that but I'm glad to know it's an guess, educated or not.
02-18-2008, 01:15 PM
#37
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W/ the impending CAFE regs, I'm sure thoughts have already been expressed at this point on the possibilities good and bad.
We all have to come to grips w/ the fact that there are several REAL possibilities out there.
1) GM quickly revamps the car and comes out w/ a lighter, less powerful more CAFE friendly Camaro.
2) GM, like other manufacturers (rumored that Chrysler/Dodge has already made it clear they will simply have to pay the CAFE fines b/c it will be cheaper to pay the fines than to develop the new technologies needed for their products to net 35mpg carline) decides to pay the fines associated with not meeting the new CAFE regs, and continues to produces heavy, overinflated high horsepower cars. This isn't obviously the way GM is going due to the termination of planned RWD Zeta chassis vehicles.
2) GM knowing they have until 2020 to get to 35mpg carline average runs the 5th gen into the ground on a very long production lifecycle. They sell the 5th gen until they basically cannot any more be it due to CAFE or crash regulations.
--- At the end of this cycle they can either now release a new lighter 6th gen after milking the 5th gen for everything it was worth like a cash cow after investment is paid for (likely will be done in the first 2-4 years)... or they decide yet again there is not a business case to proceed with a new Camaro and once again we are left without a Camaro to buy.
Unfortunately we all have to realize that our government is doing this to us and to the auto manufacturers. They are creating these mandates to force the hands of the auto makers to create new technologies, new processes, etc to that we decrease our need for oil, and further more foreign oil.
We all have to come to grips w/ the fact that there are several REAL possibilities out there.
1) GM quickly revamps the car and comes out w/ a lighter, less powerful more CAFE friendly Camaro.
2) GM, like other manufacturers (rumored that Chrysler/Dodge has already made it clear they will simply have to pay the CAFE fines b/c it will be cheaper to pay the fines than to develop the new technologies needed for their products to net 35mpg carline) decides to pay the fines associated with not meeting the new CAFE regs, and continues to produces heavy, overinflated high horsepower cars. This isn't obviously the way GM is going due to the termination of planned RWD Zeta chassis vehicles.
2) GM knowing they have until 2020 to get to 35mpg carline average runs the 5th gen into the ground on a very long production lifecycle. They sell the 5th gen until they basically cannot any more be it due to CAFE or crash regulations.
--- At the end of this cycle they can either now release a new lighter 6th gen after milking the 5th gen for everything it was worth like a cash cow after investment is paid for (likely will be done in the first 2-4 years)... or they decide yet again there is not a business case to proceed with a new Camaro and once again we are left without a Camaro to buy.
Unfortunately we all have to realize that our government is doing this to us and to the auto manufacturers. They are creating these mandates to force the hands of the auto makers to create new technologies, new processes, etc to that we decrease our need for oil, and further more foreign oil.
02-18-2008, 01:30 PM
#38
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Well, it's more than pure speculation. There are "numbers" floating around. Numbers anywhere from Mustang GT-like to Challenger SRT-like.
02-18-2008, 02:55 PM
#40
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Instead, I believe this thread was created as more of a 'complaint platform' for the vocal minority here who are upset with the 5gen.
02-18-2008, 03:13 PM
#41
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That's a wide variance don't you think? I would suspect if the floating numbers were between the GT500 and SRT then there would be reason to fret. We'll all find out soon enough.
02-18-2008, 03:16 PM
#42
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It sure is. Then again, the Mustang goes from Mustang GT to Challenger SRT-8 weight. (Mustang GT -------> GT500/500KR). So who knows, maybe all those numbers are right.
02-18-2008, 03:19 PM
#43
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I wouldn't say "upset" with the 5th gen. I think there's a few people on here who are diehard Camaro enthusiasts, and want the car to succeed on every level - and if that means being critical of the car, than so be it.
02-18-2008, 03:28 PM
#44
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If Alpha is about the same size as a 3-series, I don't see any problem with the 6th gen being that size, maybe a little longer.
I'm not so sure a 4-cylinder Camaro should ever be in the lineup again. A base model fuel-efficient V6 would be better image-wise. A performance V6 (turbo, DI, etc.) could take the place of the entry-level V8. The top car MUST be a V8. It is vital to the Camaro's image.
I'd like to see the 6th gen be lighter and smaller than the 5th gen by a considerable amount. Instead of ~3800 lbs., I'd like to see closer to 3300-3400 lbs. I'd like to see a focus on awesome handling. Don't neglect engine power for the sake of CAFE, though - 400+ HP in the V8 model should be doable, with decent fuel economy to boot.
I'm not so sure a 4-cylinder Camaro should ever be in the lineup again. A base model fuel-efficient V6 would be better image-wise. A performance V6 (turbo, DI, etc.) could take the place of the entry-level V8. The top car MUST be a V8. It is vital to the Camaro's image.
I'd like to see the 6th gen be lighter and smaller than the 5th gen by a considerable amount. Instead of ~3800 lbs., I'd like to see closer to 3300-3400 lbs. I'd like to see a focus on awesome handling. Don't neglect engine power for the sake of CAFE, though - 400+ HP in the V8 model should be doable, with decent fuel economy to boot.
On a theoretical Alpha 6th gen, I'm sure that GM would want to share powertrains with the other Alphas. I guess if a 4 cylinder base motor is good enough for Cadillac...
Anyway, a primary goal would be, to make Camaro a CAFE positive car line. An Ecotec or turbo Ecotec version would go a long way towards accomplishing that. Maybe even a turbo diesel version. The 2.9L that CTS is getting, would make a smaller, lighter Camaro a remarkable performer - all while getting 35 mpg or over.
I'd hope a 6th gen could be engineered to accept a V8. Currently Alpha is not.
Last edited by Z284ever; 02-18-2008 at 03:36 PM.
