How ironic....SStokerAce was in that engine masters program

He would've won too...but a loose bolt caused him to lose oil pressure and he didn't want to keep dynoing it.

I'll lett him tell the story...but just wait til next year when he builds the big blocl

 

thats bad a$$...it would be cool to do that but i dont have the money or the dynoing facilities to do all the R&D....

 

SStrokerAce, (Bret) was a participant in PopRod's Engine Masters Challenge. His engine lost oil pressure during the dyno competition and he withdrew.

"Shoulda, coulda, wouldas" aside, his engine was very competitive with the winners based on his development dyno testing. There's a write-up on him in Feb 2003 Popular Hot Rodding.

I was skeptical that he could run a true 11.7:1 static CR and dynamic around 9:1, but he proved to me that it could be done, as did others.

The top engines in that contest, which was scored not on peak hp and torque, but on the average hp plus average torque from 2500-6500, showed more grunt from 366 cubes than most big block NA pump gas engines you've seen in magazines and in cars.

Bret's engine idled without a lope below 900 rpm, and had torque from 2500 on that was truly impressive.

Yeah, $15,000 to $20,000 is about right to duplicate one of the top engines. IMO, that's not unreasonable for that much grunt on 92 octane.

If you don't already know, Bret and I are related. I'm very proud of his accomplishment.

Jon

 

O.k.

The top 2 guys had power numbers of around 610-620 at peak and TQ of 530 ft lbs. No way you could get 580-590 peak on a 365 cube engine. Follow the old lb ft per liter rule. 90-100 is about what you can expect max in race engines. This contest had about 88 with the winners, I expected 540 with coatings. That would have been 90 ft lbs per L with a 365 (6.0L) engine. Not bad considering the rules and application.

My peak TQ was about the same without coatings, so that means alot to me. My HP # was about 40hp down, but it was a contest about average power and torque, not about peak HP. I had a cam to get 610hp, and it sits in my shop still not in the engine. BTW that cam specs are what Rich is looking at now. The thing is I found that the average is better if I don't sacrafice power below peak TQ for HP up top. Were I had those guys was below peak TQ, alot of little tricks went into making that better (one of them was a 9:1 dynamic comp ratio on pump gas), and since I didn't place nobody really knows them for next year. ;-)

Anyways, yeah I ****ed up and must have missed the TQ spec on the oil pump stud. I can't figure out how because I TQ things 3 times. I will now have a wrench that can get in there better and some Loc Tite on oil pump studs now. That and a better checklist for the engine buildup.

As it sits now it was a top 5 engine, (my guess was 3rd) but that's the top spot for non coated engines. If it was coated I really think it would have won. Oh well just proves to me the design was dead nuts.

Anyways, yeah the contest is fun, It teaches one alot about building BAD *** STREET MOTORS, and that's why I post here because that is something we are all looking for.

We all wish we had the $ to get in this contest, belive me it's not cheap to win. You can't expect a $2000 engine to compete with a $20K engine.

I'm hoping to get the big block buildup all financed and rolling, it depends upon alot of things. I am siked for next year, but I think that the new rules are going to be fun and since that stupid nut came loose I have been thinking about next years engine.

BTW That 365 SBC is for sale and I'll basically take what it's worth in parts for it. ($15K) If it won, It would most likely be about $5-6K higher. Let me correct that, if it won the $75K that came with the win is what it would take on top to buy that one, but I would build a 400 version of it for someone for $20K

Anyways, thanks. That contest was awesome.

Bret

 

Bret

Rich Krause

 

Quite a number of "race" small-blocks are at 1000 and better. I happen to know of a 498 cid small block which has put out 932 hp on 93 octane utilizing a Brodix BD2000 cylinder head and quite a bit of engineering.

Take care,
Chuck Riddeck

 

I would hope it's at least a BD2000, dam a 498 cube small block is interesting. Must be a tall deck block with a huge bore, but how huge?

114hp per L, that is really good for a huge small block. Those heads help. I would guess a 400+cfm head to do that.

Bret

 

well i may have remebered it incorrectly but i can almost swear in the last Popular Hot Rodding issue it claimed Joe Shermans motor made about 58X torque....oh well..good luck next year, also, how big are the motors gonna be for nexts years competition? i wont be that suprised if its an oval port motor that wins it if its still 2500-6500...

 

It was 530 something. I should scan it in but I'm too lazy.

Oval Port Big Block? Who said it was even going to be a Chevy? Maybe a Hemi? Maybe a Mopar, maybe a FORD or a BOP? Who knows. Everyone will try something different. I don't care about different I want to win.

470 cube limit, 2500-6500, almost the same rules except the lifters have to be flat tappet. (which is there to take out costs, but it just adds ALOT more costs, If they wanted to make it cheap, they would allow solid rollers. It's not like we don't run those now. BTW they are outlawed because they are not "street" parts. Someone tell that to Jason Short!)

Bret

 

13.7 bar BMEP is standard fare for well developed street engines. That is the output of the engine in question. 144 naturally aspirated hp per liter also sounds a bit sketchy... but it's been done and those numbers will rise with time.

Take care,

 

Yesir, and that engine is pretty easy to get another 10 hp out of too. Power Commander, Akrapovic, and a few other tweaks.

-Mindgame

 

OR maybe with an ARATA!!!!

Hey Bret.. did you do anything this year?

 

sorry to bring this one back...
well its been a while but out of no where the name hit me. Dennis Faerman. like i said before i don't know what kind of gas it was on, i just know that my friend said that guy knew his stuff.

 

I've heard good things about that guy...

BTW- I saw a naturally aspirated motor on the SAM dyno put down 999.9hp a few weeks ago...

 

BTW.....

RMRE's Darrin Morgain said..... "a 396 SBC with Little Chief heads can make 1090hp NA"

So it can be done, but a buddy got a price quote on those... $10K a pop for the heads, plus you need a special block.... I think I'd look up Kaase for a BIG motor before I did that. Hell 815cubes and 1600hp sounds like a better deal for that kind of bill!! Still way cool to see a 1000+hp NA small block

Bret