*caution* lunati cranks are bad
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 6,518
Really. What Ken said
What did they do before and where did they go now?
There are some guys on here that can tell you if it's BS or not pretty quickly if you give us that info.
In fact if you want send us a broken piece and we will tell you what they do to it and if it's done wrong.
Not sticking up for them because I think they are overpriced, just don't like seeing a company get bashed without some hard evidence.
Bret
What did they do before and where did they go now?
There are some guys on here that can tell you if it's BS or not pretty quickly if you give us that info.
In fact if you want send us a broken piece and we will tell you what they do to it and if it's done wrong.
Not sticking up for them because I think they are overpriced, just don't like seeing a company get bashed without some hard evidence.
Bret
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From: pa
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 203
From: York, PA
No offense buddy.... But all lunati cranks are PGN'd not heat treated. Sounds like you were fed a line on this deal. Also, even if the crank was not PGN'd it would have nothing to do with it breaking. Also Plasma gas only effects hardness to depths under .100.
Rumors about mysterious breaking cranks makes a lot of people look bad for no other reason. I would sure like to know more about this, and see some pic's of these cranks if you don't mind.
Dennis
Rumors about mysterious breaking cranks makes a lot of people look bad for no other reason. I would sure like to know more about this, and see some pic's of these cranks if you don't mind.
Dennis
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,591
From: PA
Dennis,
Do you know of any pages that explain this PGN process? In general, doesn't have to be specific to lunati cranks. I just searched google for a couple of minutes and couldn't come up with anything, not even what the acronym stood for.
thanks,
brent
Do you know of any pages that explain this PGN process? In general, doesn't have to be specific to lunati cranks. I just searched google for a couple of minutes and couldn't come up with anything, not even what the acronym stood for.
thanks,
brent
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 203
From: York, PA
basically..in lamens terms, it is a low temperature hardening process, that uses a high intensity RF field through argon to create ionized argon (plasma) . the steel being the reactor, causing a compressive hardening at a depth .2-.3 % of the surface area. since it uses mechanical alignment instead of thermal alignment, tempering is not needed to restore molecular (flexibility). Easy to tell on a aftermarket hardened crank, if the journal surround is not blued, then the crank is more than likely PGN'd or iduction aligned.
(trying to explain as simple as possible)
Dennis
(trying to explain as simple as possible)
Dennis
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From: Hell was full so they sent me to NJ
The message linked above:
A few questions:
"We built 2 mild motors...." - Who is "we".... engine builders? A shop? Couple guys in a garage?
".... both cranks broke in two weeks." - Describe the break.... where, how, under what conditions?
"We called them and spoke with allison she said they changed there heat treat process and was sorry so she is sending us two "old stock" cranks made before june/03." - Can we assume "them" is Lunatti? Who is "allison".... customer service, chief engineer, secretary.....?
A post like this, without some real info, is of limited value. Yes... If I were in the market for a Lunatti crank, I would certainly call them and verify all of the above... but it would all be a little more credible... particularly with regard to "Advanced Tech", if it was handled in a more thorough manner.
We built 2 mild motors (under 500 rwhp) and both cranks broke in two weeks. We called them and spoke with allison she said they changed there heat treat process and was sorry so she is sending us two "old stock" cranks made before june/03. The problem is they are getting them to hot making them brittle.
## Dont take it wrong. I do not wish to bash any company. I like lunati and they are doing what they can to fix this problem. The perpose of this is because like me i know alot of you are doing your winter stroker buildup's. I dont think it would be a good thing for anyone to spend all that time and money to have the motor last 2 weeks. Then have to tear it out and back down again when i can give you the heads up till they fix the problem. I wish lunati well. I love to know that they see a fault and are fixing it.
## Dont take it wrong. I do not wish to bash any company. I like lunati and they are doing what they can to fix this problem. The perpose of this is because like me i know alot of you are doing your winter stroker buildup's. I dont think it would be a good thing for anyone to spend all that time and money to have the motor last 2 weeks. Then have to tear it out and back down again when i can give you the heads up till they fix the problem. I wish lunati well. I love to know that they see a fault and are fixing it.
"We built 2 mild motors...." - Who is "we".... engine builders? A shop? Couple guys in a garage?
".... both cranks broke in two weeks." - Describe the break.... where, how, under what conditions?
"We called them and spoke with allison she said they changed there heat treat process and was sorry so she is sending us two "old stock" cranks made before june/03." - Can we assume "them" is Lunatti? Who is "allison".... customer service, chief engineer, secretary.....?
A post like this, without some real info, is of limited value. Yes... If I were in the market for a Lunatti crank, I would certainly call them and verify all of the above... but it would all be a little more credible... particularly with regard to "Advanced Tech", if it was handled in a more thorough manner.
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Joined: Apr 2003
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From: PA
Thanks Dennis.
Even knowing what the the acronym stands for its hard to find mention of it on the web! A lunati link was the first one to come up. My curiousity may lead me to the engineering library before work tonight.
-brent
Even knowing what the the acronym stands for its hard to find mention of it on the web! A lunati link was the first one to come up. My curiousity may lead me to the engineering library before work tonight.
-brent
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 1,991
From: pa
Originally posted by Injuneer
The message linked above:
A few questions:
"We built 2 mild motors...." - Who is "we".... engine builders? A shop? Couple guys in a garage?
".... both cranks broke in two weeks." - Describe the break.... where, how, under what conditions?
"We called them and spoke with allison she said they changed there heat treat process and was sorry so she is sending us two "old stock" cranks made before june/03." - Can we assume "them" is Lunatti? Who is "allison".... customer service, chief engineer, secretary.....?
A post like this, without some real info, is of limited value. Yes... If I were in the market for a Lunatti crank, I would certainly call them and verify all of the above... but it would all be a little more credible... particularly with regard to "Advanced Tech", if it was handled in a more thorough manner.
The message linked above:
A few questions:
"We built 2 mild motors...." - Who is "we".... engine builders? A shop? Couple guys in a garage?
".... both cranks broke in two weeks." - Describe the break.... where, how, under what conditions?
"We called them and spoke with allison she said they changed there heat treat process and was sorry so she is sending us two "old stock" cranks made before june/03." - Can we assume "them" is Lunatti? Who is "allison".... customer service, chief engineer, secretary.....?
A post like this, without some real info, is of limited value. Yes... If I were in the market for a Lunatti crank, I would certainly call them and verify all of the above... but it would all be a little more credible... particularly with regard to "Advanced Tech", if it was handled in a more thorough manner.
2.) Yes "them" is lunati not lunatti
3.) It broke between the 1st and second counter weight on both cranks under normal driving.
4.) I dont know who allison is them gave her to me when i called.
(side note) I thought of all people you would not act like a jerk as you are one of the most respected guys on this board along with rkrouse. If you want more answers call them yourself i was just trying to be helpful
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Joined: Feb 2000
Posts: 1,445
From: Seattle, WA
Originally posted by amean94ta
4.) I dont know who allison is them gave her to me when i called.
4.) I dont know who allison is them gave her to me when i called.
(not trying to be mean... just pointing out that proof-reading a message board post is low on most people's priorities... even when they think it isn't).On a more serious note, I wonder why a heat-treating process used for all crank journals would only fail in the same spot (1st and 2nd counterweights)... and not randomly.
The confusion grows more with the info Dennis posted that Lunati doesn't even heat-treat their cranks at all...
Are you sure the block mains are all in alignment? weird that both would fail in the same spot unless it was block machining or assembly error. If Lunati admits the hardening process was messed up I suppose its fair to say, although I havn't talked to them... it just sounded weird (and I think you need to read Injeneer's post again... I don't think he was trying to be rude, he asked the same questions that were going through my head
)
