you can call me narrow-minded...you can say that i have no knowledge or whatever u said. u need not be offended because i dont like hondas. im saying the fbody is a better car that ur hatchback. u can call me arrogant whatever dude. i do my own thing at the track. i dont have a group of buddies or anything like that. i dont go yoyoyoyo phHAt honda....or dude sweet 'stang or 'maro. i go to race.....whether its a honda or a "ferrari" as you like to bring up numerous times. if i want cheap speed im going to have an f-body. if i want luxury performance, i'll get an M coupe. they are nice cars. i wouldnt mind having one. to race out..............no. drive a cheap gas saving honda hatch....sure i would. would i race out......no. keep tearin up and modding ur honda. I'll stick to not doing much with my pretty much stock ls1 and faster than ur as* honda. bye bye.

 

Was this post encrypted or something?

 

Alright well if you want to get down to being "factually"...

I think it's silly to take a car designed to be a gas-thrifty commuter car and spend loads of money to first swap an engine, then add an expensive turbo kit on top of all the other mods needed. Why not start out with a car originally designed with the intent of being a sporty, performance car? Now I'm not saying you have to get a V8 muscle car, but like I've said in the past, I would choose to modify an Integra/S2000/Prelude way before a Civic.

I think that a Civic Hatchback screams nothing more to a majority of people than "economy car". Can it be made fast? Sure. Anything in the automotive world can be made fast, minivans running 11's for example. I will always be bitter towards Civics because they are the highest percentage of modified Hondas while really being the only car designed by Honda not to be "sporty" (Si withstanding). Bottom line the Civic was built to be an affordable economic car and IMO it makes no sense that it is modified much more often than a Prelude or Integra. So I don't understand why people choose an conomic car to modifiy when their own manufacturer produces much better options.

I would rather have an M3 then my SS as well. But I would much rather have my SS then your Civic. Maybe you fail to realize that the SS is more than just a cheap F-Body with a nice engine, but a car that has had a long and glorious history in automotive performance and one that I feel proud to own. I like having guys with classic 60's muscle cars giving me compliments on my ride. A thought-process like this may not mean anything to you, but it does to me. At 22 I'm much more proud to drive my SS now than I ever was in my Talon; I don't feel like a boy-racer anymore but someone with a classy ride that has gotten a lot more compliments in 2 months from non-car people then the Talon ever did in 3 years.

An F-Body is both a better platform to build a drag racer from, and a car that has had a much more important place and prestige in performance history. There's your facts. As for opinions, it also looks a hell of a lot nicer and meaner than a Civic Hatch and draws much more attention. If you want to get all pissy over my opinion, be my guest. I never discredited the performance capabilities of your car... just that there is a LOOOONG list of performance cars I would much rather have then a Civic HB. But as long as you love your car, then what does it really matter what I think anyways, right?

 

I will try to quantify it. Compare a stock '02 SS Camaro to a stock '02 Civic (not Si, just base Civic). The Camaro is better in these ways: faster acceleration and top speed, better handling, better braking, more sporty looking, better to get in a wreck in, better to pick up chicks in, more fun to drive, more head turning, better sounding, better heritage, bad boy image, better drag racing platform, etc. We all know the Civic is better than the Camaro in a # of ways as well: gas mileage, price, resale value, safer because it's slower, insurance prices, reliability, spark plug change, conservative image, easier to live with on a daily basis, easier to see out of, no stupid hump in passenger floorboard, etc.

 

amen.


my new z looks alot nicer than my old one. its going to stay that way too. the more dumb stuff u do (meaning body/exterior and interior) the more people laugh at you and dont take u seriously. u get more respect from keeping ur cars looks like way it came from the factory. ive got more compliments off the new one then i have the old one...and ive only had the new Z a week.

 

I would never consider the Prelude to be sporty in anyway. Its a sorry *** car. FWD, 4-banger in the heavier honda.
Being an EX-import ricer myself, a civic can be made faster than any of the options listed. If i was on the import road again, I would with no doubt choose a civic over a integra, s2000, or prelude. (Of course, Supras TT and RX-7 TT not being in my list of import choices)
However after owning a Z28 Camaro, there is a WORLD of difference between owning a muscle car and a import econobox. Dont get me wrong, Civics can be made fast and to be handled like a dream but a Z28 gives all that to you PLUS the feel and looks of a REAL performance car. IMHO.
Bottom line, its based on what we want in a car and at what prices we can afford. Sure, if you want a Viper or Ferrari, you could probably own one instead of modding up your Civic/Camaro but can you handle the ONGOING insurances ? Will you have enough to upkeep the vehicle ? The last time I heard, a clutch job for the Ferrari is about 1500 bucks. (LABOR only)

We shouldnt be bashing each other for what vehicles we drive, instead just giving out humble opinions on what we feel.

 

Honda marketed the Prelude as it's "sports" car. Stock for stock it's faster than any Civic by far. Now I agree if you're going for all out speed (ala track-only car) then yes a Civic Hatch would be the best choice due to it's weight. But for street driving, I stick by my opinion. For one, you start out with the engine that alot of Civic guys will have to swap into their cars to being with, but more importantly to me is that it's just a better looking and nicer all-around car overall. Regardless of how fast a car is, if it looks like crap then I don't really care. Chalk me up as a person who values appearance just as much as performance.

I see so many modded Civic EX Coupes with their whopping 127hp engine. THAT is what I'm talking about... why the hell do these people even bother? At least doing the basic mods on a GSR/Prelude have you in the 14's and with a much nicer looking car to boot IMO.

 

The prelude was teh test bed for a lot of crap from Honda they eventually didnt need....ATTS...4 wheel steering...different stereo options etc...it was always weighed down and too expensive for younger people to modify.....insurance and initial purchase price were a big factor almost as much as weight

Talking about the civic not being "performance" minded is silly...it has won more championships for Honda than the prelude, integra and S2000 COMBINED...yes COMBINED...the civic has been around for 30 years and has continually made progress both on the circuit and on the street.

Just because your unfamilair with this history Blunt doesnt mean it isnt there.....the name Honda is a BIG name in motorsports...with a very successful WORLDWIDE racing focus. F1..JGTCC...N1 ...Formula 2000..motorcycles....dirtbikes....ATV's...hell even championship winning shifter karts are powered by Honda

My civic has a longer wheelbase, wider track and shorter overhangs than most cars including the prelude/S2K/Integra....its also the lighter of these cars...has the most headroom...and is the cheapest to insure...maintain and fix

US civics are watered down no doubt....but your telling me the Civic wasnt "performace" minded when the Civic Type R pretty much dominates its class and shares the same chassis (especially suspension geometry) with my chassis...a simple motor and brake change and you have a car thats practically worshiped for handling and balance and extremely predictable breakaway

If you did more racing than street driving than I think youd appreciate the civics more Blunt.....I dont really care if susie scoccer mom thinks my car is a go-kart....she's a soccer mom who doesnt even know what DOHC stands for?

Basing your car buying decisions on others "perceptions" is silly....I buy what works for me....a car thats balanced and predictable and is cheap to insure works for me....I dont really care what people who have no clue think because the people that "get" my kind of car are the same people who love racing....any and all racing.....not just drag...my civic is not a "drag" car....but that doesnt mean I cant "drag" race with it and :gasp: win a championship my rookie season drag racing

Camaros and Mustangs are NOT muscle cars...they are PONY cars and are also classified as GT cars for racing....if you want to compare them to GT cars we can do that....but youll see it as a GT whos characteristics arent those that are sought after....

Now as prime american muscle...sure a solid axle 13 sec car is great.....not my style really....I am a little more understated and would rather you expect to win and find out the hard way than drive a car you "expect" to be fast....also I said M coupe...not M3...the M3 is for wussies....the M coupe is a whole breed different

3000lbs (BMW excess lux crap / figure 2600lbs in serg mode) ...two seats...front engine...rwd....hatch....about the size of my civic and even lower.....with phenominal handling limits and a 3.2L motor thats proven...not an LS1...but its pretty easy to push 300+ft lbs from it without much effort...thats a GT with my style....small...low...big motor..bigger tires

 

What are the definitions of muscle car and pony car?

 

Arguments involving honda hatchback drivers are funny. They never seem to recognize the fact that it TOOK A WHOLE NEW MOTOR TO MAKE THEIR CAR RUN WORTH A FU<K!!!!

Maybe they're not aware of it because the B16 or the B18 fairy stopped by one night and put a new motor in their car while they were sleeping. Then the next morning the awakened to "m/\D tiTe dom3stiC buStinG perFoRmanCe, y'all!!!!" But for all they knew it was the stock motor with an intake and header!!!

Honda guy: Hey domestic owner, I'm not very impressed by the performance of stock vehicles from ford or GM, after all, my civic hatchcrap is only bolt ons and a new motor away from staying right there with you or beating you!! It's sad when you think how easy it is for me to hop my car up, it's only replacing the whole motor!! Then you will bow down to my craptastic econobox commuter car!! It'll accelerate like a rocket, handle like it's on rails and last longer, because it's japanese

Domestic guy: <brain on overload from bullsh!t that was just spewed by honda guy>

 

LMAO!!!!!! Here we go again with another 10 pages of Civics vs. Domestics.

 

Hmm lets rethink who invented the process of motorswaps.....Hot Rodders...hmm...take out the old motor...drop in a better one...make a slow car...fast....

And dropping in a VTEC motor in a civic would differ how? Oh thats right its the same ****ing thing

Never mind that The LT1 and LS1 were the fastest camaros ever produced...or that they are 8 cyls or 5.7 liters......lets focus on the need for the super 1.8L motor it takes to keep up something a little fuzzy here?

Why is it nobody talks about the older camaros? The super quick 15 and 16 sec wonders with 5+ liters?

The MAJORIY of pony cars are slower than these "rice" burners....thats a fact....so now your trying to compare a 5.7L GT car with a FF 1.6 or 1.8L car and trying to make light of A) its a naturally aspirated 1800cc motor B) only has 4 cyls yet keeps up if not outruns cars with 2 and 3 times the motor and double the cyls

Wow impressive......if the little Japanese cars are that quick with 1800cc's I wonder how fast those 2.4L J bodies are....they must break the damn sound barrier....cause they are american

If all that mattered was collecting timeslips than people would drive pretty mundane cars....quick in a straight line but thats about it....pretty boring

 

ONCE AGAIN, and hopefully for the god damn last time.... who in the UNITED STATES drive an f'in Civic Type R? That's right, NO one. Even you said in your post that the US has watered down the Civic... news flash Sergio, you and I live in the United States, not Japan. Jesus I don't see why you always bring up the CTR like it's available to the 280 million people in this country.

If that were the case, then yes I agree the Civic is a potent car. But your 110hp EK Hatch stock was not, a Civic EX is not, and even the holy riceboy car the Civic Si is not a potent car compared to any of Hondas other offerings. That's why I wonder why it's still modified tenfold over any of the Hondas, with its looks being subpar to the rest as well. "But with a simple brake and motor change..." Hah with a simple motor and brake change I could have a 427 in my car making in excess of 500rwhp NA. But that wouldn't be impressive in your eyes.

I know about all Honda's history in peformance racing, as well as their street bikes. But please tell me, WHAT IN THE BLUE HELL DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH THE MASS PRODUCTION CARS HONDA BUILDS? I put that one in caps to really get your attention. What does a Honda formula racer have to do with the 110hp EK Hatch that you bought? I find it funny that you always bring up these silly irrelevant arguments. What does a race car that you will never drive on the street have to do with your car? Please enlighten me.


As far as my car... I didn't buy it for other people's "perceptions" of me. I bought it because it is a car I find to be a great combination of performance and appearance in a sensible package for modding further. I do not find your car appealing to me in this regard one bit. If I were buying a car strictly for gas-economy reasons, your hatch would be at the top... or if I were building a SCCA racer, it would receive consideration. But in terms of having a fast, awesome-looking and sounding car that I think is great as well as many others I know, your car wouldn't even be in the same region regardless of how fast it is/can be. Dude I'm sorry if you don't like my opinion, but it's just that, an opinion. I will never see myself buying an EK Honda Civic Hatchback to modify into a performance machine. It's not my idea of a "sweet" car. It fits the bill as a great "daily-driver" though.

 

What "rice" burners are those? Comparing a motor swapped Civic to a stock pony car again?

 

blah blah blah 1800cc's keep up with stock V8s, blah blah blah. That's great serg, if my car was a 2000lb sh!twagon then I wouldn't need a V8 to haul *** now would I? What in the fu<k does the size of the engine you would swap in to a hatchcrap have to do with the fact that stock civics like yours are slow pieces of garbage that are made for economy and they need a motor swap to keep up with stock "GT" cars as you call them?? I'm glad that GM left room for improvement in my engine! That way I can port the heads, swap parts etc, it makes it feel like mine. I don't need to buy a high strung four banger to make me feel like my car is worth something.

I'd like to go ahead and take a moment to bow down to the almighty "civic type R". For those of you who don't know, this little front wheel drive wonder is practically the envy of every race car driver out there. Once Mario Andretti was quoted as saying to his race team "damn boys, too bad driving a civic type R in the races this season is not allowed, because if it was I could sure clean up, these other drivers wouldn't know what hit 'em!!" Also, John Force was quoted as saying "I really wish I could drag a civic type R this year, I don't know how honda does it, but through their superior engineering, and the use of the letter R they have created an unparralelled drag car, forget a blown hemi V8, honda four cylinder front wheel drive powAr is where it's at!!!"