Hey guys, i need some help. im starting a new puild up. im wanting to run an all forged 355 setup with LE2 h/c package. So i was wondering where i could get a high quality rotating assembaly for a great price. I dont want a shortblock cause im on a budget. But i do want quality. If you guys could give me some idea that would be great. thanks.:

 

so whats the final goal?

any nitrous? compression? blower etc.

 

Umm... i wanna run nitrous but only a small shot like a 100 or something. So im guessing i will need a dished piston? idk. im 16 and just trying to learn the ropes so i can start my build after christmas. No blower or anything like that. umm.... compression ratio im not quite sure on. what do you guys think would be best as far as cr goes? This car will be my dd but will see the strip every now and then. I want to build a budgeted and reliable motor. Any advice or suggestions? Im open to anything.

 

a stock rod will work with a stock crank, get a forged piston. I would put the money in the heads/cam.

search around for anyquestions you have plenty of info around

get a flat top piston

 

Alright Thanks man. Would what would that setup run cost wise? CR wise? And how reliable would it be with the nitrous?

 

This is the forged 355 that i just built using the stock crank. I didnt buy the parts from Karl, i bought them from JEGS. This is all you need to build a stout 355. Karl charges 1190.00 for this kit, its well worth the money.



The kit is designed for you to build your own 355LT1 utilizing your stock GM 350 crank. The kit features premium forged Mahle pistons/rings/pins/locks, SCAT 4340 forged I-beam rods with 7/16" rod bolts, Mahle/GM main and rod bearings, full LT1 Rebuild gasket Kit as shown above, (minus the stock Mahle rings)
Have your machine shop bore and plateau hone your stock block to 4.030, align hone the mains, square deck the block to 9.010", install cam bearings and oil galley and core plugs. Also have your balance shop balance your stock crank for the SCAT rods and Mahle power pack.
The -5cc flat top Mahle piston would give about 11.8:1 static compression ratio if using a 54cc chamber head with .029" B-body head gasket and piston in the hole 0.010". If the cylinder head combustion chamber is 58cc then static compression ratio would be 11.2:1 .


The 355 kit features the following parts.
Mahle piston "PowerPak" #SBC250030F05 (3.48 stroke, 6.000" rod, 4.030 bore)
The Mahle PowerPak features graphal coated forged flat top pistons, 1.5mm, 1.5mm, 3.0mm plasma moly file fit rings, F-1 style round wire locks and piston pins.
SCAT 6.000" 4340 forged I-beam rods with 7/16" cap screw style rod bolts #2ICR-6000-7/16
[+ $280 for USA Howard's Forged Sport rods #SP6000]
Mahle main and rod bearings
GM/Cloyes oversized stock crank timing sprocket
GM/Cloyes stock timing chain
Victor Reinz or GM B-body head gasket, (.026" or .029" compressed thickness respectively)
Head bolt kit
Felpro printoseal intake manifold gasket set
All other gaskets to complete engine rebuild as shown in the LT1 Rebuild Kit photo above.

 

What Kind of Power are you making?

 

Looks like a nice setup.

 

That combo received a little bit of ink (page 39) in the January 2008 Car Craft in John McGann's LT1 7-page write up. I told John during the interview I had just added up all cost details on a budget 355 LT1 re-build and it was all total $2400 bucks, (all machine work and the kit mentioned above and evey little tid-bit) Kit is not really for sale any more but can certainly be duplicated by going to Jeg's/Summit.

Spend good money on quality piston/rings.
Spend good money on heads/cam and especially valvetrain.
Go fast.

Karl Ellwein (Ellwein Engines)
LOUD/FAST/REAL

 

That setup is almost exactly like mine, I wasn't aware of the writeups but pieced it together myself for a good N/A setup.. see sig.

I wouldn't add more than a 100 shot to it since you will be at or around 500rwhp and that may be a bit much for the stock crank.

I am very pleased so far with it.

remember that the LE2 package is running $1750, my machine costs were around $1400 for boring, decking, spin balancing and assembly of shortblock. The rods, pistons, pump, and pan are around $12-1300, then the gaskets, pushrods, rockers, injectors, and the like is another $5-600.. throw in at least a mailorder tune and you are at or over $5000..

 

if you look on the list of fastest lt1's you will see a mid 9 second slip, its a 355 with a stock crank and a 300shot. I wouldn't worry a bit around 500rwhp with the stock crank, many blower guys take to 600rwhp+. The stock rods and pistons are crap though, replace them. Any decent forged piston~500-600 and cheap forged rods ~300 (eagle SIR maybe) and your bottom ends set.
If your on a budget and dont need to bore the motor you may get away with a hone only. It would cost you those 5 extra cubes though. The top end of the motor is what it shine, a le2 setup with supporting mods will be 390-410rwhp. And into the 11's with a real 60ft. good luck

 

You are getting caught up in marketting and need to step back and get a better understand of what it is you are asking about before you can go any further.

A shortblock is a block with rotating assembly and is exactly what you are wanting to build.

If I had the car I have now when I was 16yo I would not be here today, would have ended up as a cross and some flowers on the roadside.

 

mdacton gave you good advice. Put the money in the the top end. Unless you are building a very high output motor (which is 500+hp or 7,000+rpm in this context) the stock crank and rods, IF they are in good shape, are fine. Get a good set of pistons which give you the desired CR and are specced out for the intended use (NA, nitrous, or boost). There are a number of companies making good pistons, those I have personal experience with and would reccomend include Diamond, Probe, Venolia, and JE. Mahle is highly reccomended but as I have never used them I cannot comment one way or another.

As far as cost, keep in mind that the "little" stuff always seems to add up to more than you think it will. Budget close to $400 for gaskets, fluids, incidentals. A good "rebuild kit" (which you may or may not buy as a whole kit) including pistons, pins, bearings, and rings is going to run in the $1,000-1,500 range depending primarily on what pistons you select. Most shops are going to be in the $4-500 range for disassembling, cleaning, doing basic inpection and basic machining (essentially honing for the new pistons and balancing) of your existing shortblock and another $3-500 for reassembly. So, you are looking at the following as a cost estimate.

Rebuild "kit" $1-1,500
Machine shop $4-500
Assembly $3-500
Misc. $3-400
Total $2,000-3,000

It will cost more if you decide to go internal balance as the balancing itself is more and you would need a new flywheel/flexplate (or the cost of neutral balancing what you have).

Another word of advice that you all should listen to: it is MUCH better to have the engine shop doing the machining buy all the parts, especially if they are doing the assembly. The big reason is that if they buy the parts, THEY are responsible for everything fitting together properly. I can cite multiple times where customers bring in the wrong parts (example: a two piece seal crank and they have a one piece seal block). If they made the mistake, which they are MUCH more likely to do than the shop is, they have the hassle and cost of returning/exchanging the parts. Otherwise, you will have to do it or pay the shop at their hourly rate to do it. Also, they can probably get the parts at about the same price you can but make a few bucks on the deal, which will endear you to them instead of having them talk about the "cheap bastard with the Camaro" and that is not a bad thing.

Rich

 

^^ I always get the shop to get my parts, just for that reason.

Depending on the compression you want I would not deck the block. That will save you some money and you don't really need it. I have used SRP pistons I think they are good bang for the buck IMO. Have heard the same about mahles but never used them.

Your money needs to go in heads/valvetrain. Engine is just an air pump. Comparable parts same cc piston, same stroke crank you could spend a ton more to get the same results. The regulation of the air is the key.....top end and cam are everything.

 

Another vote for going through a knowledgable shop. Ruling out a short block, and attempting to pulll together all the parts yourself, unless you are extremely knowledgable in engine building, will cost you more in the long run. I've been fooling around with small block Chevy's for close to 50 years, and I went to a shop to have my engine built. The right shop brings a ton of knowledge to the table.

As far as running a small shot of nitrous, that does not require a dished piston, as you seem to have assume. Yes, you want lower compression ratio for a forced induction engine, but not for nitrous. N2O loves compression. What static and dynamic compression ratio you whould be shooting for depends on how the engine will be used.... does it have to pass emissions? .... is fuel mileage a consideration? .....are street manners important? .....will it run on "pump gas"? ....etc.