JustNO - I am definately not saying those are a bad head at all, in fact I think they are a great head. My point was just the for the original poster of this thread, he could go the TFS route for less $$$. I think the AFR heads are a good head.

Bret - That's what I thought, I thought with the 210s, they didn't actually come with a 210cc runner with the bare castings OR the race ready package, I thought they just had enough material to BE ABLE to be opened up that far, and that the Comp ported package was the only one where they were. Is that correct?

 

I have the AFR 190s and totell you the truth 6 years ago when I bought these I would have loved to have had the choice of the TFS head at that time.
I'm also still waiting to see someone port a set of the Edelbrocks out. I think a set of those ported would be really nice on a stock cubed motor or a 355.

We should all be happy that they are still making aftermarket parts for our "old" , "undersold" design.

 

Is there any such thing as bad head? Lets not get into that here! But there is. OUCH

Anyways....

The 210 is the same casting as the rest.... I think even the 227. The differences lie in the machining of the heads and the seats installed in them. The 210 and up have larger valve seats, and the 227's just have the pushrod pinch not machined over as far. They can go out pretty far, but the ports are so small you could put a 180cc port in there without too much effort. As cast these things are scary small, they don't even look like a port.

Bret

 

I can really understand that, When I first received my heads I looked them over pretty good, and though they were just the standard complete AFR 190s the only machining in the port was in the Bowl and chamber as far as the ports go.(except for the obvious valvejob and valvequide) There is alot of meat there for porting though right?

 

The valve spacing is a .250 offset intake for the 190, 195, and 210s. The 220s are a .375, and the 227s are a .450

 

Basically the same casting though, you just place the guides in the heads in a different spot.

You wonder why the AFR's are a brick? How else do you get that many different options out of a casting?

Bret

 

Here is the big difference, LT4 manifolds are required for AFR195's and up. These are hard to come by now, so a Trickflow head with lt1 manifold will be a good option. I dont knowif the TFS heads allow as big combustion chambers as AFR's (74cc). I have a aset of LE ported AFR210's and I am not worried about you TFS guys

 

No doubt, I am sure if lloyd had a hand in them, they are probably bad as hell.

 

Honestly, I have been talkin to two guys that are looking to turbo their LT1's and I have recommended the TFS heads/LT1 intake combo to them. For the money they are great. I got a sweet deal on bare AFR210's-$800, so it was a nobrainer for me.

as fa as flownumbers, my AFR's done by LE make a little more than his TFS heads, but not much more.

 

Take a step back and a few deep breaths, and think about that statement, which couldn't be more true. If you start off with a bare AFR and TFS casting, and have them both worked to their fullest potential, do you really think there will be a big difference between the 2? Its just a 23 degree head, and you will only go so far with it. If you are lookin for that edge over what everyone else runs, start lookin at 215RR, 18*, 15* SB2.2, ect. This thread is about as good as "which cat back do I use?" or "whick CIA do I use?"



Nick



Nick

 

a 215rr is a 23* head.. Not all 23* head's are created equal... Trust me on that one.. But as far as AFR/TFS.. they both have great potential.. Just TFS is a better choice for the $$$..

 

If you start off with a bare AFR and TFS casting and have them both worked to their max potential, then the one with the greatest port volume and valve size will win out, obviously. At this point, though, the manufacturer just supplied a chunk of aluminum . . .

 

So then it would be down to which chunk of alum was shinier.

 

I realize that the 215RR is a 23* head, its just not what most guys run, including myself, as opposed to the 215 RR as it costs more, and the supporting hardware to run it costs more (shaft mounts, intake to support the heads, like a single plane). I dont see how one is a better choice over the other as far as price. If you start off bare, where both castings are close in price, and have either casting worked, they will be very close in $$$, and wont be cheap to have done right. Most of the time when you save a little money here or there in this area, well, in the end you always get what you pay for.


Nick

 

Because as I said AFR is living off an OLD reputation. People are actually begining to look for results rather than blindly believe they are best. The OEMs stepped up and they didn't keep up plain and simple. Same can be said for other BIG aftermarket companies "cough" Edelbrock "cough".