OK, I just took off the first valve spring measured everything and put on the 918's. Again I have 787 retainers and stock locks. THe brass thing mentioned earlier was actuall a steel locator seat. the 918 fit over the stock locator seat only if the ID of the spring is lightly ground and rounded. with the 787's and stock locks the spring measured 1.730. The stock lock with these retainers compressed the spring further than stock, which left .050 additional valve stem sticking out the top. I can see that I need the 10 degree retainers and +.050 10 degree locks so I can gain that additional .050 on the spring.
One would think the guys at Comp Cam would know what the hell they're talking about. They recommended the 787's when the +.050 locks are a must have.

 

A number of companies make +.050 seven degree keepers. Trickflow is one Crane is another. I bought the Crane's for my setup because that is what was available at the time.

 

thankz man, just it time. I'll check into it.

 

Theoretically, yes. But as we can see, not all springs are made the same. The whole idea is to get the most out of your springs which means getting the shortest install height while maintaining a good safety factor to prevent coil bind. You also want all the springs to be installed about the same height, if possible.

 

NONONONONONONONONONONONONONONONONO! our heads are set up with the stock springs at ~1.76! I have this spring combination on my car and it is working fine at .576 lift with the installed height at 1.75.

+.05" 10* locks.
Comp locators which are .06"


using the stock spring locators is NOT recommended, using no spring locator is retarded whoever said that should be shot with 918 valvespring.

you MUST use NSA roller rockers as the +.05 locks set retainer almost level with the tip of the valve! ask me how I know...............................

to everyone who said they seached far and wide for this information and couldn't find it... it IS there in a thread started by truedualws6 and it outlines everything you'd ever want to know about installing 918s in a stock lt1 head.

 

That about sums it up.

Wish I had known this before installing the 918s in my car. Two different guys at Comp Cams told me the 918s fit fine into the stock locators, but when I installed them I definitely noticed they do not fit that great on the stock locators. It's nearly impossible to get the spring to sit completely flat on the locator. It's funny how Comp Cams' help line is such a crap shoot

With the stock locator, I didn't need the +.05 locks to obtain the 1.75-1.76 install height; but would have gladly bought the +.05 locks and locators for a better fit.

Thomas.

 

If the guy at Combination Motorsports is saying not to use anything under the springs he needs not to anwser the phones. You HAVE to us something undr the spring ot the head will not last very long. The spring will bore thru the head. Installed height is not as important as you might think. The big deal with it is making sure you DO NOT coil bind or let the retainer hit the valve seal. Both are VERY VERY VERY bad. If your cam is smaller then 565 lift you can use any retainer/lock you would like. you will have enough room. At this point I have done enough heads that custom valves are easy to get. My installed height is 1.800 and the retainer to guide is 1.130 leaving me a total of .670 available if the springs are stable but there not! .630 is totaly not a problem.

 

I have posted my experiences with the beehives many times on this board. This thread seems to reinvent the wheel on stuff that is available with a search. I even posted a picture of the crappy fit of the stock locator. I trial fit, measured
and posted the installed heights with both the 7* and 10* hardware. For a stock head, the 10* hardware and +.050 locks is the only way to go.

Edited to add the following:

Parts needed to install Comp 26918 beehive springs on a stock
aluminum head LT1 (for iron heads just omit the spring seat).

7 degree hardware with 4705-16 spring seats (1.73" installed
height):

787-16 retainers
648-16 locks

10 degree hardware with 4705-16 spring seats:

795-16 steel retainers, or
794-16 titanium retainers
611-16 locks (standard), 1.70" installed height, or
614-16 locks (+.050), 1.75" installed height

For either installation you will need spring seats:

4705-16 spring seats, .062" thick

And this:

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showt...ighlight=26915

 

I have 1.6 SA RR's. I'm going to use the 7* +.05 locks.
How much valve tip must stick up above the retainer for it to be safe to run these RR's???
This would really suck if I have to now buy the NSA RR's!
Or, could I just put guide plates on the SA RR's?

 

I searched the boards and planned for over a month before installing the 918s & 1.7RR; I guess I missed this bit of info from your posts. I even started a thread which detailed my install from planning, through install, to dyno results.

For those of us using the stock locator, what are the risks here? I assume the install height measured with the mic will not be accurate, and possibly lateral loading of the spring could occur? With my max lift at .520", I wonder if it's worth going back in and replacing the locators with the 4705 part and swapping out the locks for +.05" ones?

Thanks for the info,
Thomas.

 

Comp does not make 7* +.050" locks. Only the 10* super locks come in
a +.050" flavor. I can not help you with the SA question as I am running
NSA rockers. Some of my valve tips are pretty short with the +.050"
locks so I would imagine that you have to measure each one to verify
you have a good safety margin. Otherwise you will need to go NSAs.

 

Crane and trick flow make the 7* +.05 locks. trick flows are $18. at summit

 

For the guy who said machine down the shim under the valve....do not do this, the locators are hardened. If you machine it, the hardening process has been destroyed and the steel will be too soft. Also, do not touch the valve springs with a grinder to make them fit the locator.

Also, bluecamaro, have you measured your installed height yet? With the parts you listed, this should not give you an installed height of 1.80, but closer to what everyone else is getting, 1.74-1.75.

Hmm, about using NSA roller rockers. On my setup, I used the gm bowtie SA roller rockers with +.050 locks and no problems here. I am going to pop off a valve cover though and do an inspection.

I suppose using longer valves with possibly some standard locks would get close to the ideal 1.80 installed height. This would be a good option when redoing a head.

Howards cams sells a set of 7 deg +.050 locks, forged steel.

 

I just received the 7 degree locks from Trick Flow thru Summit. The parts were miss packaged so that I got a stock style lock. Beware the 7 degree locks thru Trick Flow will be GOLD color were as the stock style were black.
Summit did amend the order it just cost me time.

 

I'd do that right quick man... I was using the GMPP 1.6s and I specifically checked for clearance between the rocker and the spring retainer, looked fine when I installed them. Pulled the valve covers 300 miles later to lash, and i see a bunch of aluminum floating around, pull a rocker and see big grooves worn into them.

remember i was using the comp +.05 locks as well, hope all that crap doesn't get into your bearings or clog your oil pump, when I changed the oil it was all glittery now someone explain why I still have fantastic oil pressure?!?!?!

also thank you truedualws6 for chiming in, seems like you're the most knowlegeable on this subject, I just learned from ya also I'm still driving 60 miles a day in stop n go southern california traffic with the CC306!