yeah....but its still not easy don't forget drivetrain and suspension....everything has to work together

 

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1987 Trans Am GTA S/ST
434ci sb Motown block w/brodix alum heads and intake
Low 10�s at 130 in quarter, mid 6�s at 108 in eighth
750 alcohol carb w/Rupert belt drive system
8 pt. roll bar
5 point camlock harness
Auto meter silver face gauges
9 inch ford w/430 gears and moser axles and detroit locker
Ladder bars w/AVO adjustable coilovers
4 wheel disc brakes
16x32 goodyear slicks
Powder coated centerlines
MSD 7AL-2 ignition
Cheetah shifter w/biondo electric shift solenoid
5 gallon fuel cell in rear, braided line up and return to tank
Powerglide w/TCI brake
ATI 8 inch 5500 convertor
6inch hinged fiberglass cowl hood
Mega 450 delay box
Hooker super comp coated headers
Borla exhaust system
Coil over front struts and tubular lower a-arms
Will separate. Have title and is fully streetable
$26000 tk or $18000 rolling

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Look at what this has and his times

Not a person posting has a big tire ,434CID all aluminum engine car but ya all say it's easy and cheapr than $30,000 BS been there

 

You need a rear end unless you want to be changing gears weekly. Mid 11's shouldnt be too hard to do. 10's on motor on a daily driver would be reaching pretty far.

 

Thanks for the reality injection! Please don't include moi in "ya all". $30,000 won't come close if you are building it new from scratch unless you are a super parts scrounger and can do basically everything yourself.

BTW: "fully streetable" is like

Rich

 

Thanks Rich.

ROFLMAO No you weren't included. You KNOW what it takes 'cause ya been there.

Fully streetable to me is I can make it light to light without a ticket or stalling all the time.
Anything else goes.
If I want to get on it--when my eyes clear up I shift.... and wonder how I got this far down the road

 

Like you say, I haven't been there. That said, I trimmed out all of the things that you need in order to do it, and left on the list all of the things that particular guy decided to spend extra money on to make his car the way he wanted to.

A carbureted 434ci small block? Bet that cost a pretty penny. Quite a bit more than installing a forged stroker kit in an LT1.

A 9" Ford? Could have saved several hundred by going with a Dana 60.

The shifter probably makes the car more consistent, but not any faster. A '94+ LT1 car won't need the electric shift solenoid, either.

I'm not sure what the IHRA/NHRA regs say about when you need a fuel cell, but I think a car running in the 10's doesn't need one yet.

Powerglide -- again, probably makes for a nice, consistent car, but you can run 10's on a CPT-built 4L60e that costs much less, and a two-speed trans isn't going to make for a very streetable car these days.

The delay box is, again, all about consistency, and not strictly necessary to run a 10.xxx ET.

 

If I wanted a 10 second NA car that was streetable I would not consider an LT1. Assuming we are limited to small blocks, I would think about a gen I but probably go with the LSX architecture. The head choices for an LT1 are too limited and the displacment is as well. Of course, there are some great gen 1 heads that can be converted, so that would be an option if you already had a good LT1 shortblock or something of that sort. By far the most feasible route to the "10 second NA street car" is a big block. But that has a number of issues in the context of a 4th gen.

Back to the original post: people react strongly to posts like that when someone seems to think that slapping a few parts together will get you there. It seems to diminsh the blood, sweat, tears, and years that they know goes into something like that. A more logical approach for the poster is to buy a nice set of heads with a complmentary cam and go from there. That's unless he has $30,000+ sitting around to dump into the project all at once. In that case, he also needs to involve a pro to avoid a mismatched pile of very expensive parts.

BTW: the two quick "street" cars at the track the other day were NOT NA. The 10 second car was a nitrous car and the 9 second ride has a YSi blower.

 

It will not be easy to hit high 10's or low 11's with your setup.

I have a 383 stroker, with a converted LT1 intake. 11.0-1 compression with a healthy cam and I have a best of 12.35 n/a and 11.53 with a 50hp shot of nitrous.

My car looks completely stock from the outside but the engine is not stock. I have the stock gm 10bolt but it will not live for long doing 1.59 60ft's.

I can't imagine the time it has taken me to get this far, never mind the money.

What I have found in the 4 years of racing is this. What ever money you think it will take to build an engine, almost double it. There are always little things that nickel and dime you to death.

Sorry to be negative.

Good luck!

 

My car does exactly what you are wanting. Let me tell you first hand that whatever your highest estimate is add 30% to it to get close to the real cost. I did many many hours of research on my combo to get the numbers I run. My car is more of a street car than most as I still have heat, stereo, etc. However, with a th400 and 3.70's with a 28" tall tire I am still limited to around 60mph on the highway and that gets annoying fast at 3000rpms. I do not have power steering, power brakes, or AC but those items really didn't change the way the car feels to me except the brake pedal is a little stiffer. I wish I would have kept the AC but it just took up too much room under the hood. Another thing, the fumes from my car are at times unbearable. I smell like I have been dipped in gas after 30 minutes or so of driving.

Don't get me wrong but I love running low 10's on a tank of pump gas anytime I crack open my bottle (run c16 in a 1 gallon cell up front).
On the street though you would have way more fun with a mild heads/ cam car with a 100 shot. You could get really low 11's maybe a high 10 at full weight (~3600lbs with driver) in a truly streetable daily tolerable type configuration.

A lot of times I wish I would have kept the 6 speed but I broke it running only mid 11's on the 11th pass and did not want to keep breaking parts so I replaced it.

Technology has advanced a lot since my combo was finished (2001-2002) but my combo works very well for what it is in my heavy car.

I use my car solely for the street now and put about 1500 miles a year on it (mainly winter as it is way too hot in the summer). I have not ran it at the track since july of 2005 but it has a few street passes on it. I use it as more of a cruiser car. I will eventually tune in the 200 shot to get a 9 sec pass. However, I am in no hurry because when you start going fast stuff breaks and I enjoy having a nice running car and not having to spend all kinds of money keeping it running due to track breakages.

Just to give you a quick and dirty idea of costs (these are older costs as there was not as many off the shelf parts available when I was building my combo).

Heads cam intake valve covers rockers $4000
355 bottom end with parts and machine work $2300
58mm tb $500
36lb injectors $220
Tune $500
Headers and exhaust $1400
Manual steering and manual brakes with new lines $1500
Shocks and springs hals $650
Front k member and a arms $750
Rear LCA, TA, PB, anti roll bar $1500
Ford 9" with spool $2000
Th400 with scattersheild and 9" converter $2400
Driveshaft $400
Wheels and tires $1200
Nitrous kit $1000
Fuel system for nitrous and 255 intank for car (built from scratch) $1400
MSD box $250
Total $~22,000

Safety stuff
new front seats and 5 point harnesses $300
Full cage CM $2600 installed
Battery relocation kit and wiring ,etc $600

And there are countless other miscellaneous expenses like chassis setup and others I just fogot about (I also did all of my own work except for assembling the shorblock and welding the cage/chassis) so if you are not able to do the work yourself expect to pay double for the above.

Total without including the car or misc expenses $~26000
Price of car bought new in 1996 $21000
So about $47000 total invested from 1996 to 2002.

If I would have had to do it over again I would have saved all of my money and bough a 2008 Z06 and had all the power and streetability.

Good luck on whatever you decide!


Going fast is cool if you have the money and can sustain the costs of racing/etc.

Take Care,

 

Here's a breakdown of my 11.30 street car.. cost wise... I scoured the forums for DEALS left and right and was able to pull this off relatively cheap.

355 LT1 shortblock, Mahle forged pistons, Scat I beam rods, stock crank lightened/polished, NEW from a board member that did not use it.. $1800 shipped

Milodon oil pan: $200

LE2 Heads w/ LE3 cam $2k including the core heads I sent in

LE Ported intake: ~$250?

Valvetrain: Comp Hitech pushrods, promag SA rockers, guideplates, replacements for my crappy 918 springs: ~$700

Hooker LT's + X-pipe: $1000 (I got the xpipe used in trade for my old Ypipe setup.. I bought these headers 6 years ago)

Built 4L60E from CPT, including shipping.. around $1600

Yank PT4000: $800 shipped (not counting converters I've had in the past)

15x10 prostars with slightly used M/T DR's: $450

15x3.5 prostars up front $350 w/ tires (new)

Ford 9".. normally a $2500 part.. I purchased for $500 used... never find a deal like that again...

Right there you have about $10k going on the CHEAP in an automatic to get low 11's. I have left out misc stuff that has gone into the build..

I'm going to keep working towards making this a 10 second N/A street car, but it's going to take more time and more money to get there.

I haven't even counted up saftey equipment, which is going in this month so I quit getting kicked off the track. 6 point roll bar, 5 pt harness, fire jacket..

Did I forget to mention I did ALL THE WORK myself w/ the help of my good buddies?

I still need a better tune, a 58mm TB, suspension, and a couple of tweaks here and there but I'm going to do my best to hit those 10's for way less than most have....

 

I'm trying to get a 10.9999 out of my set up, too...My set up is more expensive than Javier's, but I think we are both looking for the same thing: more, with less...If I can get mid 1.40s out of my 60', which can happen with my new suspension, tires, and gears, seeing as I was 1.55 with stock springs and shocks, I will be damn close...

Neither one of us have anything fancy, just a good combo that works...Getting the car scaled, and suspension preload set on Saturday...Track rental scheduled for the 26th...We'll see what happens...

--Alan

 

Agreed. More with less has been my motto ever since I was a cam only car.

Nothing fancy in our setups.. they just work. Just LT1 castings with LT1 intake manifolds in pretty much full weight cars.

 

Javier's car is a great example of what I consider a good running 355 car.

A 383 done right the way his is would perhaps be a click or two quicker, but only if it was set up as well as his is.

Yes, the parts required to build a low 11, high 10 car are expensive, but it's every bit as important to make sure that the amalgam of parts you're bolting together performs well also. In short, the combination MUST be well thought out. This is where the trial and error, many hours and dollars' worth of tuning and track time, broken parts, etc. comes into play.

Javier has been on here quite a while, and his car performed very well (very low 12's I think) with a cam, bolt-on's, and a good converter. Since then, as I'm sure he will tell you, it's taken a complete driveline rebuild and new motor combo to shave off another second to put him where he is now. His car is nothing more than a 100 shot of N20 away from high 10's, but it will take much more time and effort to shave away those last 3 tenths to get him to a 10.9x N/A. Actually, looking at the DA in his sig, it may take quite a bit.
The combination it takes to run mid/low 11's in an LT1 NA is essentially a known quantity, and many people have done it. However, to run a half-second to second quicker, takes much more time, effort, and money.

 

Running 10's all motor on a 23* head and pumpgas smallblock is ALOT harder than people think. You don't just pick up the phone, make a standard order and run 10's(unless you call Shafiroff, get a 540 and drop it in a 3000lb car)


I am knocking on the door of 10.90, took alot to get there....and yes my car is a STREET car, runs on pumpgas and I put 450 miles on it in 4 days at a cruise in Mississippi, not many can say that. And it what HOT! Temps were in the low 90's on the beach.

My car is HEAVY, 3800lbs with my big *** in it, if it was 3500lbs with driver I would be in the 10.80's no problem. I will make it there...my piddling with it has made it quicker. And I have some more learning to do yet, only been to the track 2 times...first time out 11.25@120, only got 5 passes in. Second time at the local 600ft track(.35 off a true 1/8 mile) and it ran a 6.71, which equates to a 11.08(ish)

Ed Wright and Rick Abare are NOT good examples here, they sway towards full blown racecars, I would say that neither of those cars could have followed me around the 4 days I put 450 miles on my car in the heat and in HEAVY traffic. Especially with as much rawhiding and racing as I did during that time, hell I almost killed a set of drag radials... in 4 days!

Making the car durable is what costs, having it broken all the time SUCKS...buy the good **** up front once and enjoy the car.

Search and wait on good deals, they are out there.

Gonna be hard with a six speed, the heavier the car the more driveline parts it is gonna destroy, it will make good numbers on the dyno, but getting it down the track is a whole different animal.


David

 

if you want to go 10 seconds in the quarter, forget about using a car for under 10 grand, just get a bike. a crotch rocket with 1100 or more ccs should do the trick.