MS4 Cam
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 12
From: Kaneohe, Hawaii
MS4 Cam
I want to go with an MS4 cam using stock heads with PRC double springs and 7.4250" chromoly pushrods. Will this setup work or do I need to look into aftermarket heads and new rocker arms or can i just do the springs, retainers, and pushrods. My LS1 is currently all stock with the exception of a ported LS6 intake manifold, BBK 80mm throttle body, and SLP lid. I plan on keeping the motor NA and I want to try and sqeeze a little over 400rwhp out of it. Let me know what you guys think or if i should go with another camshaft. I want to go pretty aggressive with big power
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Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 2,022
From: MD
There is no need for aftermarket cylinder heads, or even ported stock heads for that matter. However, that cam (moreso than the smaller stuff) will greatly benefit from better than stock heads, AND more compression. It will do OK with stock compression, but you really should utitlize 11:1 or better.
Do NOT use aftermarket rocker arms. Use the stock rockers. Have them rebuilt by Harland Sharp or use Comp Cams trunion upgrade if you have the money, but the rebuild certainly isn't necessary.
A couple of other things to note:
- You don't list headers in your mod list. Do you not have them? Installing the MS4 without them would be waste. If you want to keep stock manifolds there are better choices out there. Also, the LS6 intake will restrict that cams powerband. It will want to peak around 6700-6900, while the manifold will hold it back to 6300-6400rpm. You may want to reconsider the Flowmaster catback as well
- A 3400 stall probably won't be enough. You can get away with it, but you should have it restalled to 4000+ if possible.
Finally, cam only automatics rarely see 400rwhp. If they do, it's with the converter locked and on a friendly dyno. Cam only with an LS6 intake and no headers and you'll be lucky to see 350rwhp. Build the combo the right way: you cannot just throw in a big cam and expect gains when you build the rest of the engine and drivetrain mildly. Long tube headers, FAST intake, and a higher stall torque converter are all things you should consider. If you don't want all that, go smaller on the cam.
Do NOT use aftermarket rocker arms. Use the stock rockers. Have them rebuilt by Harland Sharp or use Comp Cams trunion upgrade if you have the money, but the rebuild certainly isn't necessary.
A couple of other things to note:
- You don't list headers in your mod list. Do you not have them? Installing the MS4 without them would be waste. If you want to keep stock manifolds there are better choices out there. Also, the LS6 intake will restrict that cams powerband. It will want to peak around 6700-6900, while the manifold will hold it back to 6300-6400rpm. You may want to reconsider the Flowmaster catback as well
- A 3400 stall probably won't be enough. You can get away with it, but you should have it restalled to 4000+ if possible.
Finally, cam only automatics rarely see 400rwhp. If they do, it's with the converter locked and on a friendly dyno. Cam only with an LS6 intake and no headers and you'll be lucky to see 350rwhp. Build the combo the right way: you cannot just throw in a big cam and expect gains when you build the rest of the engine and drivetrain mildly. Long tube headers, FAST intake, and a higher stall torque converter are all things you should consider. If you don't want all that, go smaller on the cam.
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Registered User
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 12
From: Kaneohe, Hawaii
Sorry I forgot to say that before I do the cam I will have Texas speed 1 7/8 long tube headers with a true dual setup. The FAST intake manifold is definitly somthing i want to get but right now i just dont have the money for that. I picked up my LS6 intake manifold for only $100 off an airforce guy with an LS1 Rx7. I would get aftermarket heads as well but once again its a money issue.
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Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 2,022
From: MD
Sounds good. Again, don't go in expecting 400rwhp. It's rare to make a legitimate 400rwhp through a cam only auto, much less one with a higher stall torque converter and a 12 bolt. Worry not though, it will probably run better than the dyno numbers indicate!
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Joined: Dec 1999
Posts: 2,022
From: MD
Oh, one more thing!
I have an MS4 cam, albeit with ported heads and higher compression and a few other things. Before I had my FAST setup I had the LS6 and BBK throttle body... I could not get the BBK throttle body to work right no matter what we (tuner and I) tried. Startup, cold idle, and hot idle were all affected by the poor IAC passage design of the throttle body. I gave up and sold it, bought a ported stock throttle body and all the little problems went away.
The BBK worked fine on my old mild setup (221/221 cam), but not with the more demanding MS4.
I have an MS4 cam, albeit with ported heads and higher compression and a few other things. Before I had my FAST setup I had the LS6 and BBK throttle body... I could not get the BBK throttle body to work right no matter what we (tuner and I) tried. Startup, cold idle, and hot idle were all affected by the poor IAC passage design of the throttle body. I gave up and sold it, bought a ported stock throttle body and all the little problems went away.
The BBK worked fine on my old mild setup (221/221 cam), but not with the more demanding MS4.
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