BFG's? or is time to replace the Nitto's with ET Streets?
01-06-2004, 08:12 PM
#31
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Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Newark, Delaware
Posts: 3,634
Hey Russ, what's been up? Yea...Met me, and humbled me. Your "bolt-on" 12.43 made my 'bolt-on" 13.1 look slow at the GM High Tech meet. Eh...It still put me 9th, but I couldn't equal my 12.82 best.
LOL...With 11 of the countrys fastest "bolt-on" LT1 car there, Russ still got bored enough to try to out 60 ft. Jim McIlvaines Suburban...ON FOOT!
To relate this to this thread, I will admit that Russ had the fastest bolt-on car in the country, and he was running BFG Drag Radials...Very Very BALD drag radials.
Thanks for the tire comparison input. It seems we had different results, but the main point is we both tried all 3 tires. That's the only way you can make a VALID comparison, right? What works on one car doesn't neccessarily mean it'll work on another.
What started the whole controversy between me and "Mustang Boy" was the fact that I've ran all 3 tires.. I have a whole folder of timeslips to show the comparisons...All ran on the same car, same combination, same track.
Did I get a liitle pissed? Yea! When some idiot with a 14 second Mustang tries to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about...Yea, I get a little confrontational.
My offer still stands, Steve. When you think you've got your car running really really good on the motor, let me know. Quarter mile times talk...Bull**** walks. Don't come to a gun fight with a knife.
BTW, the 12.05 was ran in crappy weather with it still not tuned right. You'll be chasing an 11.80 car the beginning of the season.
Frank
LOL...With 11 of the countrys fastest "bolt-on" LT1 car there, Russ still got bored enough to try to out 60 ft. Jim McIlvaines Suburban...ON FOOT!
To relate this to this thread, I will admit that Russ had the fastest bolt-on car in the country, and he was running BFG Drag Radials...Very Very BALD drag radials.
Thanks for the tire comparison input. It seems we had different results, but the main point is we both tried all 3 tires. That's the only way you can make a VALID comparison, right? What works on one car doesn't neccessarily mean it'll work on another.
What started the whole controversy between me and "Mustang Boy" was the fact that I've ran all 3 tires.. I have a whole folder of timeslips to show the comparisons...All ran on the same car, same combination, same track.
Did I get a liitle pissed? Yea! When some idiot with a 14 second Mustang tries to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about...Yea, I get a little confrontational.
My offer still stands, Steve. When you think you've got your car running really really good on the motor, let me know. Quarter mile times talk...Bull**** walks. Don't come to a gun fight with a knife.
BTW, the 12.05 was ran in crappy weather with it still not tuned right. You'll be chasing an 11.80 car the beginning of the season.
Frank
01-07-2004, 11:09 AM
#32
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: Reno, NV
Posts: 97
Originally posted by 12SCNDZ
What started the whole controversy between me and "Mustang Boy" was the fact that I've ran all 3 tires.. I have a whole folder of timeslips to show the comparisons...All ran on the same car, same combination, same track.
Did I get a liitle pissed? Yea! When some idiot with a 14 second Mustang tries to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about...Yea, I get a little confrontational.
My offer still stands, Steve. When you think you've got your car running really really good on the motor, let me know. Quarter mile times talk...Bull**** walks. Don't come to a gun fight with a knife.
BTW, the 12.05 was ran in crappy weather with it still not tuned right. You'll be chasing an 11.80 car the beginning of the season.
Frank
What started the whole controversy between me and "Mustang Boy" was the fact that I've ran all 3 tires.. I have a whole folder of timeslips to show the comparisons...All ran on the same car, same combination, same track.
Did I get a liitle pissed? Yea! When some idiot with a 14 second Mustang tries to tell me I don't know what I'm talking about...Yea, I get a little confrontational.
My offer still stands, Steve. When you think you've got your car running really really good on the motor, let me know. Quarter mile times talk...Bull**** walks. Don't come to a gun fight with a knife.
BTW, the 12.05 was ran in crappy weather with it still not tuned right. You'll be chasing an 11.80 car the beginning of the season.
Frank
You started this name calling and bashing. Fun huh? That guy that said you were a cool guy must have met you after your PMS subsided for the month.
01-07-2004, 12:08 PM
#33
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Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: Belmont North Carolina.
Posts: 594
Originally posted by 12SCNDZ
I'll type slow so you can understand this.......
As stated earlier...A fuel injected Slugstang needs some kind of power adder to see low 12's...Let alone doing it with a 95,000 mile short block. Be realistic, Steve, what do you think you could do to your turd to get it in the low 12's? Tie it to a top fuel dragster?
I'll type slow so you can understand this.......
As stated earlier...A fuel injected Slugstang needs some kind of power adder to see low 12's...Let alone doing it with a 95,000 mile short block. Be realistic, Steve, what do you think you could do to your turd to get it in the low 12's? Tie it to a top fuel dragster?
Originally posted by 12SCNDZ
Anytime you think you've got an all motor car that'll run with me, bring it to Cecil County...With ALOT of money! We'll see who gets "spanked".
Anytime you think you've got an all motor car that'll run with me, bring it to Cecil County...With ALOT of money! We'll see who gets "spanked".
I got a real slow LS1 that might be able to break into the 12s and give you a run....you game?
Originally posted by 12SCNDZ
BTW, what are you doing in a Camaro Forum? Dreaming about the day you can get a real car?
BTW, what are you doing in a Camaro Forum? Dreaming about the day you can get a real car?
Last time I checked it was a free God Dam Country Frank and people are free to choose what car they like or what bulletin board to frequent. I get the same crap from some ignorant Ford guys when I visit stangnet. Some times you will get one that asks that same stupid fuggin question and I think to myself...
Is this guy actually that caught up in his own little world that he cant stop to think...
Hmmm...
Maybe this guy used to own an LT1 when he registered here, is planning to purchase one or, or, or, or maybe he already owns one and just does not post it in his sig so ignorant MFers like you can ask stupid questions.
Mike
01-07-2004, 01:23 PM
#34
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 989
To Mikie's post above 
I agree with Steve. I have asked the question myself and had at least a dozen people tell me that BFG DR hook a little better then Nittos but don't last as long or handle the rain as well. I don't think that anyone was questioning Franks personal results but many others got slightly different results then he did. At least with the Nitto 555 DR vs. BFG DR.
Personally I like the Nittos. It's a nice Drag Radial that you can get some mileage out of. To the original poster I would go with ET Streets for the track and then maybe Nittos for the street. Once I get some more power in my car I'm gonna have a real complicated tire setup. I'm going to run street/snow tires in the fall/winter, Nitto DR in the spring/summer and ET Streets at the track.
It'll be expensive for me but I'll be safer in bad weather and get max traction in good weather.
Good Luck
I agree with Steve. I have asked the question myself and had at least a dozen people tell me that BFG DR hook a little better then Nittos but don't last as long or handle the rain as well. I don't think that anyone was questioning Franks personal results but many others got slightly different results then he did. At least with the Nitto 555 DR vs. BFG DR.
Personally I like the Nittos. It's a nice Drag Radial that you can get some mileage out of. To the original poster I would go with ET Streets for the track and then maybe Nittos for the street. Once I get some more power in my car I'm gonna have a real complicated tire setup. I'm going to run street/snow tires in the fall/winter, Nitto DR in the spring/summer and ET Streets at the track.
It'll be expensive for me but I'll be safer in bad weather and get max traction in good weather.
Good Luck
01-07-2004, 01:35 PM
#35
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Join Date: Nov 1998
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 3,252
Good Afternoon,
I have also used all 3 tires, though only the 2 drag radials on my current car. I like to think I have a decent perspective with drag radials, as the class I have raced in since 2000 (NMRA Factory Stock) requires Drag Radials. ET Streets are a big no-no, and will get you booted in a hurry. Based on my experiences, this is how I would rate the tires:
Best Street tire: Nitto. Hands down. I got 15k out a set recently, and sold them with plenty of tread left. I wouldn't even consider a BFG DR for a daily driver.
Best Drag tire: ET Street. Hands down. Hooks just short of a full slick (has a bit stiffer sidewall).
Best DR for the track: BFG. Wouldn't call it hands down, but I wouldn't even consider running Nitto DR's in class, as they don't hold nearly as well. My best BFG DR 60 ft is 1.62, and I've gone as quick as 11.85 @ 112 mph on them with an internally-stock, no-power adder 99 Mustang Cobra. For those interested, March 2002 issue of MM&FF has details (Cobra shootout). Wanna see em work? Here's a (poor) scan from that article...
It should be noted that most of us prefer bald - very bald - BFG DRs. I try and drive mine on the street for several hundred miles prior to racing them.
That said, Nitto's certainly can be made to do well at the track, but based on my experience, testing, and observation, they do not have the potential hook, nor the consistency of the BFGs. Of note, every single competitive Factory Stock car - every one - wears BFG DRs. We've all tried Nittos, but to get the best ET, we all chose BFG.
Of note, better hook is quite a bit more critical on a stick car, as you will hit the tires harder than an auto - even one with a good converter. That means you may indeed get good 60 fts with the Nittos, and if that works for you, then by all means go for it.
Hope this is beneficial to someone.
Bob
PS....Underestimating a certain type of vehicle - especially one that is very close to you in performance - is foolish. There are two guy's in NJ with "bolt-on" GT's running 12.1s. The first is a 2000 GT that has gone 12.15, the other is a 2001 GT that has gone 12.17. Both have stock shortblocks. Stock, unported heads (not "race ported" heads with big valves) . Stock cams (not Comp Cams, not regrinds, but original, never removed cams), etc, etc. There are three that I know of with ported stock heads and mild cams that have gone 11's (ranging from 11.7 to 11.9)
Stick your head in the sand and call others slow if you want, but it is likely that saying such things will come back and bite you.
Good day.
I have also used all 3 tires, though only the 2 drag radials on my current car. I like to think I have a decent perspective with drag radials, as the class I have raced in since 2000 (NMRA Factory Stock) requires Drag Radials. ET Streets are a big no-no, and will get you booted in a hurry. Based on my experiences, this is how I would rate the tires:
Best Street tire: Nitto. Hands down. I got 15k out a set recently, and sold them with plenty of tread left. I wouldn't even consider a BFG DR for a daily driver.
Best Drag tire: ET Street. Hands down. Hooks just short of a full slick (has a bit stiffer sidewall).
Best DR for the track: BFG. Wouldn't call it hands down, but I wouldn't even consider running Nitto DR's in class, as they don't hold nearly as well. My best BFG DR 60 ft is 1.62, and I've gone as quick as 11.85 @ 112 mph on them with an internally-stock, no-power adder 99 Mustang Cobra. For those interested, March 2002 issue of MM&FF has details (Cobra shootout). Wanna see em work? Here's a (poor) scan from that article...
It should be noted that most of us prefer bald - very bald - BFG DRs. I try and drive mine on the street for several hundred miles prior to racing them.
That said, Nitto's certainly can be made to do well at the track, but based on my experience, testing, and observation, they do not have the potential hook, nor the consistency of the BFGs. Of note, every single competitive Factory Stock car - every one - wears BFG DRs. We've all tried Nittos, but to get the best ET, we all chose BFG.
Of note, better hook is quite a bit more critical on a stick car, as you will hit the tires harder than an auto - even one with a good converter. That means you may indeed get good 60 fts with the Nittos, and if that works for you, then by all means go for it.
Hope this is beneficial to someone.
Bob
PS....Underestimating a certain type of vehicle - especially one that is very close to you in performance - is foolish. There are two guy's in NJ with "bolt-on" GT's running 12.1s. The first is a 2000 GT that has gone 12.15, the other is a 2001 GT that has gone 12.17. Both have stock shortblocks. Stock, unported heads (not "race ported" heads with big valves) . Stock cams (not Comp Cams, not regrinds, but original, never removed cams), etc, etc. There are three that I know of with ported stock heads and mild cams that have gone 11's (ranging from 11.7 to 11.9)
Stick your head in the sand and call others slow if you want, but it is likely that saying such things will come back and bite you.
Good day.
01-07-2004, 04:52 PM
#36
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Easley, SC, USA
Posts: 291
Holy double post Bob!
My LT1 went low 12's in crummy weather on BFG's, with just a handfull of bolt ons.
I now go low 11's with stock ported heads and a mild hyd roller cam. Cool eh?
I agree with pretty much what you say there, except the ET street being best drag tire. I say the ET Drag is, and you can tell a difference when you run them.
My LT1 went low 12's in crummy weather on BFG's, with just a handfull of bolt ons.
I now go low 11's with stock ported heads and a mild hyd roller cam. Cool eh?
I agree with pretty much what you say there, except the ET street being best drag tire. I say the ET Drag is, and you can tell a difference when you run them.
01-07-2004, 05:01 PM
#37
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Join Date: Nov 1998
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 3,252
Howdy Green....your car is quite impressive - congrats. 
I agree with you on the ET drags. However, the original post only referenced BFG DRs, Nitto DRs, and ET Streets. As such, I didn't bother to mention the ET drags.
PS....fixed the double post.
I agree with you on the ET drags. However, the original post only referenced BFG DRs, Nitto DRs, and ET Streets. As such, I didn't bother to mention the ET drags.
PS....fixed the double post.
01-07-2004, 08:38 PM
#38
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wilmington,DE
Posts: 126
Like I said before too, look what years your pointing out. A 2000 compared to franks 93'. I know a cars year dosent mean a whole lot but it took ford 6 years to run with franks 93'. And its still not enough. I have met frank too and he put a custom shift kit in my car which he did an awesome job with, and is a very cool guy.
01-07-2004, 10:22 PM
#39
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Join Date: Nov 1998
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 3,252
Do you seriously want to make that arguement? Along with being lame, I can play too - and the outcome will the same. Further, I can use my car for comparison.
88 Mustang Coupe (I'm the original owner). 100% stock shortblock. Ported stock heads with 1.90/1.54 valves, Comp Cams Cam, headers, slicks, gear, etc. 11.93. Maryland International Dragway, Nov 97. The car went 12.5's back in 94 without ever lifting a valve cover.
It goes without saying that the above was without a power adder.
Again....the "it took Ford x years to catch up" or "it took GM x years to catch up" is simply not a good arguement. In fact, it's pretty damn silly.
No offense. BTW, not saying he's not a "cool guy". I am saying that it is foolish to underestimate vehicles that are very close to you in performance - regardless of the year.
88 Mustang Coupe (I'm the original owner). 100% stock shortblock. Ported stock heads with 1.90/1.54 valves, Comp Cams Cam, headers, slicks, gear, etc. 11.93. Maryland International Dragway, Nov 97. The car went 12.5's back in 94 without ever lifting a valve cover.
It goes without saying that the above was without a power adder.
Again....the "it took Ford x years to catch up" or "it took GM x years to catch up" is simply not a good arguement. In fact, it's pretty damn silly.
No offense. BTW, not saying he's not a "cool guy". I am saying that it is foolish to underestimate vehicles that are very close to you in performance - regardless of the year.
01-08-2004, 09:43 AM
#40
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wilmington,DE
Posts: 126
I know your not saying he's not a "cool guy" that was directed to others that are bashing him and dont even know him. I dont think its silly to comapre car years. I was more reffering to stock cars and how they were built off the assembly line. Not after modding. Your 88 mustang I doubt runs 14 seconds flat stock, while franks 93' and my 95' easily can. Im saying chevy made a faster car to start with in 93' than fords gt in the year 2000. Thats what I am trying to say. We all have our opinons and it seems like you know what your doing with cars and theres nothing wrong with a guy that loves cars as much as I do. I just give chevy credit for builder a faster car.
01-08-2004, 10:02 AM
#41
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Join Date: Nov 1998
Location: Knoxville, TN
Posts: 3,252
Originally posted by BlackIce
Your 88 mustang I doubt runs 14 seconds flat stock, while franks 93' and my 95' easily can.
Your 88 mustang I doubt runs 14 seconds flat stock, while franks 93' and my 95' easily can.
Im saying chevy made a faster car to start with in 93' than fords gt in the year 2000.
I just give chevy credit for builder a faster car.
01-08-2004, 10:20 AM
#42
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wilmington,DE
Posts: 126
Thats the fastest I ever heard of a stock 88 5.0 run. But those are good times I still think a camaro might take it most of the time with a half decent driver. Not so much bashing ford as saying I think chevy did a little better. As for the future the ford vs. chevy battle should be very interesting. But once again we have the corvette, probably the best sports car ever assembeld.
But only time will tell.
P.S. I would mind having an 03 cobra for its speed. But for speed and looks I would take a ram air trans am any day.
But only time will tell.P.S. I would mind having an 03 cobra for its speed. But for speed and looks I would take a ram air trans am any day.
01-08-2004, 10:27 AM
#43
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Rochester, NY
Posts: 989
Originally posted by BlackIce
I know your not saying he's not a "cool guy" that was directed to others that are bashing him and dont even know him.
I know your not saying he's not a "cool guy" that was directed to others that are bashing him and dont even know him.
I'm not going to try and argue that he is or was cool with you. That's neither here nor there. But he came on and bashed a respected member of this board for offering an alternative opinion that didn't match his. But more importantly he did it in a very childish "my car is faster then your car so I'm better" kind of way.
Now if he came out and said something like:
"While I respect yout right to speak your opinion I actually have used all three tires on a F-Body. Those were the real life results I have had even if others before me posted differently."
Something like that would have been a much more "mature" response. Instead he resorted to making fun of Steves car, telling him to leave a site he is more then welcome at, challenging him to a race for cash he knows he can win and calling him an idiot. To me he is not cool and he certainly wasn't cool to Steve.
All I know is if you want to convince people of how "cool" he is then good luck. You got your work cut out for you unless he happens to apologise for flying off the deep end over a statement that was in no way meant to insult him.
01-08-2004, 10:37 AM
#44
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Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wilmington,DE
Posts: 126
I dont know exactly how frank meant it but chevy and ford guys give each other **** all the time about each others cars. Meet frank and you'll know he's a cool guy. Others were bashing frank as hard or even harder than he was. I dont want to get in the middle of this but I think franks a cool guy and Im gunna leave it at that.
01-08-2004, 11:24 AM
#45
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Join Date: Sep 1998
Location: Newark, DE.
Posts: 458
I will not say anything about the above posts as I am not biased at all on which car anyone drives. I like anything fast. I mess with Ford guys everytime I go on the street...especially when they see my tag . Hell, the guy who built my motor is an all out Ford guy who has an 8 sec rennigade mustang.lol. BTW I have seen many stock 5 speed mustangs run high 13's and 14's with a good driver. The notchbacks are even easier to get into the 13's stock as they only weigh about 3000lbs fully loaded. They usually run around 98 mph in the quarter as compared to 101-102mph for the 4th gen f-bodies.
I'm only mad at GM for not making the F-body as light as the earlier mustangs.
As for drag radials, I have used BFG's and they didn't hook for me and I only run ET Streets now and have no probs hooking at the track. You should wait and try the MT Drag radials that are due to come out soon. They look like a pretty good tire from what I've seen.
Later
Matt
. Hell, the guy who built my motor is an all out Ford guy who has an 8 sec rennigade mustang.lol. BTW I have seen many stock 5 speed mustangs run high 13's and 14's with a good driver. The notchbacks are even easier to get into the 13's stock as they only weigh about 3000lbs fully loaded. They usually run around 98 mph in the quarter as compared to 101-102mph for the 4th gen f-bodies.I'm only mad at GM for not making the F-body as light as the earlier mustangs.
As for drag radials, I have used BFG's and they didn't hook for me and I only run ET Streets now and have no probs hooking at the track. You should wait and try the MT Drag radials that are due to come out soon. They look like a pretty good tire from what I've seen.
Later
Matt