http://www.insideline.com/cadillac/a...the-works.html


2012 Cadillac ATS Still in the Works

Published Jan 27, 2010

Poor So-So Pretty Good Good Excellent 3 Ratings DETROIT — Cadillac is moving forward with the often-teased ATS, a model slated for a 2012 debut and aimed straight at the Infiniti G37, Mercedes C-Class and other German and Japanese competitors in the entry-premium segment.

"We're finalizing the four-door showcar of the ATS first," a well-placed source told Inside Line. "Then we'll follow quickly after with a wagon, a coupe and a convertible."

A debate regarding the convertible is whether to go with a folding hardtop or a sturdy weight- and space-saving ragtop in the style of the last Audi A4 and the new A5/S5. The source said Cadillac is currently "not too sure about the compromises of a folding hardtop."

Whether we see the ATS sedan prototype in October in Paris or December in Los Angeles remains unclear, but the source hinted at L.A. as the right spot for the biggest splash.

Inside Line says: The crisis and GM bankruptcy seemingly haven't made Cadillac falter in its plans. — Matt Davis, Correspondent

 

This is excellent news. Hopefully the wagon looks decent and the convertible comes in at a decent price.

 

I hope that GM doesn't blow this.

 

RAGTOP!

Think trunk space, roof down.

They can add the BMW 1-series to the list of perfectly executed softtops.

 

HARDTOP 'vert!

 

Wonder what the powertrains might be?

I really hope these cars are easy on fluff and heavy on "fun to drive".

 

In regards to whether or not to... hard top should be the approach, taken. To arrive to the party in anything else is to arrive decidedly under-dressed.

 

Its interesting we heard not long ago that Alpha was to get major efforts on the steering, and now it seems that Alpha is 2 years away from a [showcar] and not a [concept car]. If we're lucky, that means a production version in later 2013. That could work well for GM.

The C350 tops the scales with 268hp from a 3.5L V6 and 3600lb. The G37 Sport tips in at 3640 and 328hp. The BMW 335i tips in with 300hp at 3605lb. The Merc and BMW start at 40k. The infinity Sport is $37k. That should help shed some light on pricing. Price it likely in the $32k-$38k range.

I'd bet we get the same two V6's (or very similar) offered in the CTS. Going with a V6 will over a boosted I4 will keep the center of mass farther back, which is critical to alpha. Roof height might be a smidge lower as well. Price the smaller one starting at $32k, the bigger at $34k or $35k. The bigger will snag 330hp, which will be good to compete with. If the chassis keeps in line with the competition, we're talking a 10"-12" shorter than the current CTS and likely 220lb lighter.

With the GenV launching in 2013, you could fire off an ATS-V in 2014. Compared to the BMW and Merc - the M3 with 414hp and 3726lb or the C63 AMG with 450hp at 3924lb (oof!). Who knows where an ATS-V would fall weight wise, but power would be like taking candy from a baby.

Could be a fun little bugger.

 

I read the article as talking about an appearance at this year's Paris or LA autoshow, then an introduction in 2012.

 

the wagon seems like wasted time and money to me. Do the other manufacturers offer a wagon in a car this small? Maybe thats where theyre coming from. I love wagons, and if it wont cost much to develop and sell alongside the others than im all for it. The cts wagon is awesome, but i know there is a m5 wagon and a bigger merc wagon that its compeditive with.

oh and i'd say go with a ragtop. I love folding hardtops in just about every way, but it usually makes a trunk useless, and it seems to add way more to the cost than a normal ragtop. As long as its a quality top it will be fine... heck rolls-royce and bently use cloth tops, and if its good enough for them its good enough for caddy

 

Yes, though not all of them offer that wagon in the U.S. The ATS will be an ideal size for Cadillac to go global with, so they need a wagon to have a full line in Europe.

 

I'm with Vlad ....

 

The only well-done hardtop I can think of belongs to the Mazda Miata Touring. It adds something like 60 or 70 lbs, IIRC, and because it is enclosing such a small space, it is able to fold in two and fit in the same hole, just in front of the trunk, as the soft top standard on other Miatas. Otherwise, hardtops SUCK, especially when the car has a back seat. That makes for a whole lot of extra real estate to cover, and a whole lot more top that must somehow be folded / stowed. The hardtop G37 convertible is over 4000 lbs! Same for the 3 Series, droptop, I believe, and the idea of a 4000 lb 3 Series simply blows my mind.

As Vladimir pointed out, Bentley and Rolls can use soft tops. I say let Caddy use one too.

Make it a well-insulated (quiet), multi-layer soft top and reap the weight savings.

 

G37 is a bigger car than 3-series or C-class. Its competition appears to be CTS.

However. BMW offers 3-series wagon, and Audi has A4 avant. Not sure if C-class here sells in a wagon form. I'm undecided if Cadillac should make ATS wagon.

As for convertible... Ragtop please. Lighter, more spacious, cheaper. Need say more?

What puzzles me with G37 convertible, first, yes, its weight, and second, the performance it is able to deliver. I'm dumbfounded how a 4000 lbs vehicle with a V6 engine that produces 330 HP can do 0-60 in less than 5.5 seconds. And quarter mile at around 14 flat. It has similar torque number to LT1 Camaro, and yet is 500 lbs heavier. Something is not adding up.

 

Hardtop convertible. I don't buy the "a ragtop is lighter" argument. Its a Cadillac, not a Corvette or a Camaro.