Maybe I should put an American flag on my other foriegn car in my driveway after reading a couple responses here I guess all of the people in the armed forces who drive foreign cars right now are also hippocrites.

 

No, generally they're ignorant of the economic situation and are cutting their own throats without knowing they're doing it. But hey, they're usually young and relatively poor, so hopefully they're situation will improve and they'll get wiser.

You, on the other hand, have no such excuse. The economics of the situation are readily available to you, and the objective facts have been brought out here more than once.

But, that's fine... that's the way our system works.
You're entitled to be as dumb as you want to be in this country.

 

It's called "justification." Humans are not rational animals, they are rationalizing animals.

To the import apologists who seem like they can't get enough of this board, an open question: why are you here? Is there some sense of cameraderie or intelligence that you can't find on the import boards, or do you just like stirring things up?

 

I have owned 14 GM cars in the past and love the Camaro. I currently drive 2 foreign cars and one GM. But certain uptight people here seem to think if you own foreign, you should not be allowed to post here.

I get a kick out of reading posts by Pacer etc. who claim I have to buy domestic or I am cutting my own throat. And military people are poor and uneducated and have an excuse to drive foreign and are just "misguided" That was real rich.

 

I hope the next job lost to foreign competition is yours, my friend.

Please, buy 2 of those American flag stickers for your import car. I hope someone takes at least one off and shoves it...well...nevermind.

Arguing with someone over driving import versus domestic is pointless. You chose to throw your $$ to the Japanese, whereas a lot of us choose to keep it here. Defend your decision all you want...but a better sign of patriotism would be buying a car from an American company, not a $2 flag. But then again, if you're the type to buy that flag merely to **** off others, you obviously scoff at and don't care about the bigger picture anyway, right?

 

And BTW, I get a kick out of Pacer's posts too...he has an amazing knack for stating what's obvious...

Obvious in that he manages to state what most of us think and don't bother to retaliate with Keep it up, Pace

 

When I am called ignorant, and hippocrite and unamerican for buying a non domestic by a few simpletons here, then yes, I will have pleasure in seeing these few people actually get pissed off at an American flag on one of my vehicles, or get all pissy for not me not bowing down to a GM vehicle only ( even if I have owned GM cars steadily for the past 20 years). It is ridiculous to me. Most who post people here are not extremeists who get off on themselves labeling people like that, but when they do, it is pretty funny to watch. I am sure I will buy GM again in the future when they have something I like. Until then I guess I will keep watching idiots pop blood vessels and kick and scream on some of my posts here because I actually own a non-GM vehicle.. oh The Horror! It gives the 5th gen forum a bad rep with the extremeism by a few here.

 

Well, to be fair to the "extremists" ( ), I don't think they are confronting you about owning a "non-GM vehicle"; rather they are taking issue with "foreign vehicles" (like your Lexus, for example). Just to clarify.

 

Chrysler, Jeep etc. is no longer American owned. What are the thoughts of the American only crowd here with this? Would I be defacing a Chrysler with an American flag also?

 

A translation of common import apologist statements:

"America makes crappy cars! I won't buy a lesser vehicle."

Translation: Everybody says America makes crappy cars, so I won't even bother going into the showroom and form my own opinion. And even if I go, I'm so biased by the media that I'm going to put the car under a microscope until I find something wrong with it.

"My last GM car was crap! All the Toyotas I had have been great!"

Translation: My 1975 Olds Cutlass had a crapload of problems. Especially since I never changed the oil. And really after I put that Holley carb on it. Since I'm a little older and wiser now, I follow the maintenance intervals on the Toyota, and I'm too mature to get into the modding game anymore.

"Buying an import made here is the same as buying American. It may even be better, because GM is offshoring too."

Translation: I refuse to pay any attention to facts like these: (a) GM/Ford/and DCX provide 23.4 jobs per 100 vehicles vesus 13.3 for the Japanese competitors (b) GM's contribution to the GNP is 4 times that of Toyota. La la la la they don't exist don't exist.

"If I buy a Toyota hybrid, I'm going to save the environment."

Translation: I close my eyes to the fact that Toyota makes V8 SUVs like everyone else. I won't admit that these cars don't make their advertised mileage. I ignore the fact that hybrid's extremely complex systems are gonna bite me or the next owner. I refuse to believe that a couple of pounds of carbon in the air (typical emissions over a 150,000 mile lifetime of a modern car) is a much better alternative to several hundred pounds of heavy metal battery waste in the ground.

Again, buy what you want. Just don't tell yourself (or your friends) it's the same as buying domestic.

 

Hmm last time I checked my Camaro wasn't built within US borders....

 

This is not news. If anyone has ever read the reports including automotive journalist and industry pundits they would have known that the report is only good as a study of the big three. The statistical representation of the transplants is so small compared to the Big three representations there is little if any value to compare GM, Ford and Chrysler to any other manufacturer. When you read headlines that Nissan is the most efficient manufacturer and GM is behind them and Toyota, it is very misleading. Every time you hear that the Big three lag the Japanese transplants, it is a misrepresentation of the data and does not tell the whole story. There is statisticlly no way to accuratly compare 1 manufacturer represented by a couple plants to GM, Ford and Chrysler where 20 -30 plants are sampled.

GM, Ford and Chryslers participation in the study is to show analysist that they are improving against each other and the few transplants that are involved in the study. But think about it this way, how efficient is GM really if they are only a couple hours off as a company compared to the best manufacturer in the study where only 1 or 2 plants is sample. Just goes to show you the progress GM has made in the last 15 years.

But, I do not blame the transplants for not participating in the study. What value is it for them? There is none.

If blame is to be placed anywhere, blame the press for misrepresenting the facts. Particularly GM, they have come along way when you really look at the study.

 

That is also a skewed and loaded statistic.

1) The Big 3 have corporate Head Quarters here resulting in more head count
2) The Big 3 are over staffed because of contracts.

The number can be used to show how inefficient the US companies are.

A more interesting statics are the data from the American Automible Labeling Acts showing NA content.

Honda Ridgline - 75%
Dodge Ram - 75%
Ford FSeries - 90%
GM 800 PU - 90%
GM 800 Utilities - 61%
Camry - 70%
Saturn Vue - 65%
Honda Accord - 70%
CTS - 70%
Mustang - 60%

I heard but could not confirm that the new Avalon is 90%.

Bare in mind that the % now includes Mexico. So there is a difference between assembled in America and real US content.

 

why the hell would anyone in their right mind actively support a statistic such as this? so it takes 23.4 GM/Ford/DCX people to do what 13.3 japanese people can do?

 

Yea, but, they look like us.