I like both ford and chevy alot.

I liked the looks of the t-bird. Something to spark some attention.

However I do not like the new GTO. I love the fact it has the ls1 but to me it looks like a monte carlo and cavalier. I hate the exhaust on it, the dual pipes coming out right beside each other. I do like the interior but if I wanted a sporty family car I would save for the BMW M5.

 

Has those numbers that you quoted for the SC T-bird been confirmed as production or are they just numbers from a show vehicle?

 

I really don't know what to tell you. The quoted Hp in concept form was 390hp. I'd expect nothing less then 350hp.

What i found amazing was the fact that the S/c 3.9L in the TB concept displaces as much Hp as the bigger S/c'ed 4.6L and 5.4L found in the Cobra and Lightning.

 

I know, that is why I am really unsure of those HP numbers on a production model.

 

100% with you on the price/value point, but ony 25% of T-bird buyers are women.

I think Reno is deads on as far as what Ford needs to change about T-Bird. It isn't a $40something thousand car.

Ford overshot on the price, and assumed that 50 something males wanted a sedate convertible, which the much cheaper Sebring provided in spades. For 32 grand, it's a good car. For 45 grand, fergetabotit!

Personally, I'm still miffed they killed off the MN12 Thunderbird (especially the SC in 95) the same year it beat Monte Carlo in sales despite having the same body (minus nose & interior) for 9 seasons.... oh, I said that already.

 

I would like to see if it is produced with 390/390 hp/tq. The thing you have to remember is that is probably exact numbers from the 3.9L. While it is a little known fact that the 03 Cobra's 390hp rating is a little off, it is underrated kind of like the ls1s are. I have seen bone stock 03 Cobra's dyno 380-385rwhp. Also I have seen bone stock ls1's dyno 310-315rwhp.

 

I like the new T-bird. The car looks a lot cooler in person than in pictures. But the performance is sub-par. They really need a manual transmission as an option, plus beef the performance up a bit. I think I read where the 0-60 time is like 7 secs? Come on, that's awful for a V8. Should be high 5's at least.

 

Lol. Yeah, but the other 75% are men buying them for Women.

 

So if you wanted a sporty family car you would spend $70-80K on a M5 instead of $35K on a GTO Why not just get a rolls royce while you're at it.

 

I was just saying the thing looks like a dang family car. Nothing sporty about the looks. I like the interior and the engine. They should have made the car look more sporty. Also I would rather have a 400hp M5 over a rolls royce, if I had the money of course. You can bet the GTO will at least be in the 30-40K range, which is a little much. But I think all cars are overpriced.

 

If you're 40+ years old give or take, with conservative car tastes and around an $80K salary at least, the GTO is probably targeted at you. Otherwise, it's not, and your opinion counts little if at all to GM. I'm not trying to be rude, just trying to put things in perspective. I'm way out of that league myself, but I totally appreciate the strategy of where the GTO is being targeted. Those GTO show cars are a pretty amazing achievement, considering the Monaro was never designed with a GTO in mind. We'll get a better sense of the GTO's own personality when it comes out as its own model down the road, designed fromt he beginning as its own model.

As to the quote your sig: when your opponent drops out of a competition and you win by default, it's nothing to gloat about. it's like GM steps out of the ring, then Ford starts swinging wildly at the empty air and responding to the cheering crowd and saying "All right, they finally stopped kicking our ***! We're unbruised for once!"

 

kizz- You sir are the first person to say anything about my sig. I put that in my sig for laughs. I do not think ford won and I do not think chevy won. Chevy stopped selling the car for economical reasons. I would not say the Chevy was kicking Fords but either. The point is that Ford still sells the mustang and GM does not sell an F-bod, big deal. The quote was made because the mustang was around before the f-bod and lasted longer than the f-bod, it was not performance oriented in any weigh. Although the new 03 Cobra, stock vs. stock will give in cheverolet that was mass produced and under 50k a run for its money.

Back to Chevy kicking Ford's butt. I look at it this way. Both Ford and Chevy are not that worried about which car is faster but at who makes the most money off their car, hence ford outselling chevy and chevy stop making the car. The GM of Ford and Chevy care about money and not performance. It is us the consumer that worry about the performance aspect. Ford would not be saying we are getting our butt kicked they would say, "man we are outselling our cheverolet counterparts hands down and now that they are out of the game we will probably sell more, so victory for us". They worry about money, and in that they won.

The new GTO is a DISGRACE of what the car was originally. That is all I have to say about it anymore.

 

Mustang has consistantly been in the top 2 or 3 of US performance cars with more than 2 seats since at least 1982 (counting Grand National GNXs & Turbo T/As of the late 80s) . Also, until GTO comes out, is the fastest and probally best handling 4 passenger car made in the US. I would venture to say the Mustang is VERY performance oriented!

Finally, at the risk of starting a GTO debate all over again, if the only thing anyone can gripe about regarding the GTO (despite it being the quickest, fastest, best made, and best all round muscle car ever to wear the name) is that it doesn't look like a previous GTO, then I'd say the car is far from being a DISCRACE.

 

Sorry for adding to the risk, but I have to agree. The GTO will whipe the mat w/ the Mustang if their in the same class.
The GTO still has all the main ingredients the first one had "car-wise". The exterior just looks a lot more 'classy'.

 

I like both GM and Ford to make it clear again.

What I said about the mustang is that bottom line to the companies that make the cars, money counts. Not who has the fastest car but who can sell them. Mustang is Performance oriented but to the general manager of Ford he cares about the money he is making off the car not about if it beats the competition down the drag strip.

I said it was a disgrace because the GTO came out as a sporty looking sports car not a family car looking sports car. I am glad they are bringing it back out. It just is not for me. I want GM to make another Sporty looking car.

Also it could be argued about the GTO whiping the mat with the mustang. Put the 4 seater GTO against the 4 seater 03 Cobra and lets see the gto whipe the floor with that mustang. I want another f-body.