http://www.auto.com/industry/tbird30_20030130.htm

I blame the T-birds poor sales on Retro fad dieing.

I think the retro cars look cool but I would never buy one, they are too much of a fad.

Lack of HP for the price probably turned some people off too.

any $40K sports car sould be able to do 0-60 in under 7.0, under 6.0 for that matter.

Chevy better bump up the HP in the SSR for '04 or it willl suffer the same fate.

the SSR would be worth the $42K if it had a 6 speed manual and 400HP LS6 V8

 

I Completely disagree with you on that. Not because I love the new Bird, but because there are so many other things going against it.

The car was previewed years before it came out (sounds familiar...SSR?).
The car fell on it's face in the begining because of a recall due to excess penny pinching.
It had marginal performance when put against it's competition. It's demographic age was 51 (only 25% are women: http://www.westmichiganmustangclub.com/mustangnews.htm), and men that age tend to buy nice sedans if they want a sedate car.
Ford ran it way too long without any updates beyond simple paint schemes.
Finally, it was too damn expensive for what you got.

I personally don't mind the styling of the new Bird too much, but as a fan of the previous MN12 Thunderbird SC, it's no small pleasure I take seeing Ford have trouble reaching their goal of 20,000 new Thunderbirds when they pulled the plug on the old Thunderbird, which despite being around almost [B]9 seasons, still sold over 70,000 cars[B].

As for the end of so-called retro, I'll point out the Beetle's sales have finally started going soft....but it's been around 6 seasons!




and the sales of other so-called retro cars are still doing modestly well . now 3 season old PT Cruzer and 6 season old Beetle)

 

While I do agree the T-Bird has other problems hurting its sales i think a bit of it could be its style. To me and quite a few people I know it seems like a girls car. Nothing wrong with that other than I don't see Ford really pushing for female sales. I hope retro goes well for Ford because with the new Mustang and potential Crown Vic replacement being retro, as well as the GT. J Mays and Ford have headed in this direction full force. To me its a fad and unless you can afford to make constant changes and quick redesigns retro gets old too fast. Atleast the way Ford has done it. The Beetle is retro but in a very modern way. Also the price is cheap enough that people will buy it reguardless of its looks. The PT Cruiser has a retro theme but not a totally retro style. It does ok again partly because of its cost and partly because of its style. To me modern will always sell but retro sells when the time right. I applaud Bob Lutz when talking about the new GTO said we aren't going for a retro look. And the GTO's all american replacemet won't be retro either. Nor should any potential Camaro. Retro cues is ok but I don't want a 69 Camaro look alike.

 

A retro Camaro in 1999 - 2005 would sell, after that I just don't see it happening, the public would probably get sick of it. Theres a reason why retro design is now retro...

 

"Just say NO! to Retro!" (C) 2003 Darth Xed Industries.

 

...is everything.

If that car was available for $20k base, $25k optioned - they would sell like $.50 hot dogs at a ball game. The first one I ever saw was at the Charlotte car show 2 falls ago, and the window sticker was MSRP + options = $48k!!! NO GOUGING EITHER!
They came down, and are generally in the 30k's, but still...

I don't think we can hang the blame for it's slow sales this winter solely on it's styling. BTW, it IS a mandatory ragtop, and we are having one of the longest, snowiest winters in decades out here on the eastern seaboard. Who's gonna go buy a droptop when the temp is -10*F and the snow is 2-feet-deep?
BTW, did someone mention incentives on trucks/SUV's lately? And record sales... Hmmm...

 

I think the T birds soft sales are cuz:

A: Its funny looking and kinda homely, like a motorboat, high in the front and low in the back. The oversize shiny windscreen header is awful too. The chrome grill looks like it came from a $4.99 model kit

B: Poor color choices

C: Priced too high for what you get looks and performance wise

D: Dealer gouging

E: Cheesy looking interior

F: Bland wheels


The car could be saved tho by:

Making it look less Ski Nautique and more musclecar. Looks are everything in this segment.

Give it something under the hood.

Manual transmission option

Handling package

Lose the cheesy fake alum trim inside and the awful color coded leather inserts.

Some wheels with some rim showing

Better colors

Last but not least a much thinner body color windscreen header with a less bulbous looking front glass.

Reno

PS: Retro has a lot of life left in it. I bet ford sells at least 250,000 of the new retro Mustangs in the first year.

 

Big bet, since we don't know what competition might bring to the '05 party! But I hope you are right.
I'm already saving pennies, don't know if it will be a Mach 1, Cobra, GT, BOSS 302, or even a Shelby, but I'm feeling like one of those (potential) 250k units will be in MY garage at this point.

 

If a 2-seat coupe is going to be marketed to 50-something men, it has to have a few virtues in it, especially for the price. Most guys in this age group who are looking for a car like that are the "mid-life crisis" people. Problem is, the T-bird is too frumpy and has no cojones under the hood, not what a person in a mid-life crisis wants. It just looks like an old man's car. Who wants that?

 

I think the biggest problem with the T-Bird is that its far more expensive than the Chrysler Sebring, the other "Womans Convertible"

It's not that great of a car for the money, either.

 

Well said, Werm--when the T-Bird came out in the 50s, it was a Vette competitor and was not a woman's convertible; if Ford really wanted to go retro, the new car looked fine on the outside (interior if color keyed looked awful), but it needed oommph, like the original. It needed a sub 5 sec 0-60mph, 140 plus top end, and it needed to have a stiff chassis and good build quality. It needed to compete more with the Vette, like it did originally. Maybe a little more comfortable than the Vette, but it needed to PERFORM--and it doesn't.

 

It really surprises me that STV hasn't gotten their hands on a T-bird yet. I'm sure that they could really do it some good.

 

Keep in mind , though, that these are entry-level priced cars, and they are not even close to the production numbers of the leaders in the entry level class, including the dinosaur Cavalier....

PT Cruiser starts in the $17,000's for MSRP
Beetle starts at $15,900...

Granted, Cavalier starts at $14,595, but even look at Grand Am and Malibu and the like....

 

Part of me loves retro and part of me is a little tired of it as well. As much as I'd love to see some retro styling cues in the Gen-V Camaro, I'm all for an evolutionary transition from Gen-IV. They should, however, keep some basic styling features in tact though: long nose; short rear deck/hatchback; RWD V8; 2+2. After that I say, "Go for it!" I want something that'll make me want to run down and buy one as soon as they're available.

And bring back the Z/28!!!

 

The upcoming 390hp/390lb-ft tq S/c 3.9L should take care of the power issue. That should provide enough go to put it in the lower 13's. The chassis and suspension are fairly modern so the handling should be decent. The only problem is the weight. The non S/c'ed TB weighed around 3750lbs. An intercooler and S/c will add even more. It needs to lose some of that fat and weigh in at no more 3500lbs.

Here's an engine shot of the Supercharged 3.9L
http://www.sportscartesting.com/Medi...21_380x285.jpg

The vents on the hood gives the not so aggresive body an aggresive look
http://www.thecarconnection.com/imag...6482_image.jpg

We'll see how the S/c'ed version sells.

I don't think retro is dead yet. The Bug and Pt-cruizers are on every block, and the 2005 mustang so far has drawn a ton of excitement and has a much more loyal following then any of these other retro designs. I really think that the upcoming mustang will be a sales success. I see it as a big improvement over the current sn95's.

Only time will tell.