jg95z28

So much for Edmunds' credibility...

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posaune

Alpha is going to be a global RWD platform, how does GM not step all over itself with offerings from Cadillac, Buick and Chevrolet, especially in the U.S. market?

Cadillac will have ATS sedan and coupe on Alpha and CTS sedan and coupe on Alpha+.
Chevrolet will have the 6th Gen Camaro on Alpha+.

I have a harder time placing the Buick in the lineup for U.S. than the C130RS as a sub Camaro entry coupe. How do you differentiate between Cadillac and Buick Alphas? Buick sedans could take sales from Cadillac. Coupes could take away from Cadillac’s or Camaro.

Do you make it a 2 seater luxury coupe or roadster even?

jg95z28

I tend to agree, while the idea of an Alpha Buick performance sedan sounds good to enthusiasts, I think most Buick enthusiasts moved over to Pontiac years ago, and now those that have stayed with GM are either in the Cadillac or Chevrolet camps.

A Buick halo coupe or roadster might work, but not before we see multiple offerings for both Cadillac and Chevrolet. I figure we'll see the Alpha+ Camaro, before the next CTS (or around the same time-frame) and then the Alpha Chevrolets.

I still want to see a mini-El Camino-type vehicle based on Alpha.

Slappy3243

Maybe the Regal GS will be done the right way this go around. It has 270 HP out of a turbo 4, but it's FWD and the performance numbers are crappy. I know GM has other names they are throwing around, but a Regal GS with a TT V6 at 350 HP with RWD would be pretty nice. I considered buying a Regal GS when shopping for my Mustang. The inside is so nice as well as the outside. The powertrain is a letdown.

HuJass

Who's to say the purported RWD Buick will be on Alpha?
Maybe it will be on Alpha +? Maybe it will be on a version of Zeta?

99SilverSS

Camaro is the volume Chevrolet sister car that should make the business case for an Alpha based Buick.

SharpShooter_SS

Isn't the Alpha CTS supposed to come out next year, which puts it ahead of a Camaro?

It will be curious to see if GM delivers on this latest promise of RWD, or if it derails, as happened with Zeta; I suppose pending bankruptcy loomed large over the former though, but still.

30thZ286speed

This was one of my favorite Buick concepts from a few years ago. I'd love to see something like this make it to production. Buick Velite





I think its a huge mistake that Cadillac doesn't have some sort of convertible or convertible hard top in its line up. CTS or ATS would be great.

HuJass

I can't help but think the Holden Coupe 60 concept would make an AWESOME T-Type and Grand National.

guionM

There is almost certainly work going on at GM to expand the Alpha platform. I got to talk to a couple of people from GM during press days, and while neither could talk about particular cars, nor could they answer actual questions about things like this, there's ways to ask to get a good feel for what's happening.

I brought up the idea the fact that many young people out here are gobbling up used BMW 3 series out here, and that if (say) something like the 130 were made and priced about where a lightly used 3 series would run, there would be quite a potential boom in winning over young buyers, then I watched for a reaction. You could see that the person I was speaking to caught themself before letting something slip, and when they agreed you could tell they wanted to say more about it.

My feel based on the Auto Show and other things, is that we'll see something of the 130 by later this decade. Here's how I see it.

First, GM has to create a lower price version of the Alpha platform. It's one thing to create a lightweight sporty platform for a car that's going to sell mostly in the upper 30K to low 40K range. But it's a different story when you gotta sell that chassis for about 10 grand less. Cadillac's Alpha has plenty of tricks and materials that you can't put into a low cost, high volume car without either losing money or having margins so thin you have to sell hundreds of thousands of them to break even. GM is well into taking cost out now, but don't expect the result to be priced next to Cruzes or even low end Malibus.

Second, GM has higher priority cars that the chassis has to go under. The next CTS is first (over a larger version of Alpha). But I'd expect the first lower cost version to go to Chevrolet for the next Impala with Buick getting a version at about the same time (both larger versions).

It's once resources are freed up after this when i'd think we'd see a production spinoff of the 130, either as the next Camaro or as a stand alone addition to Chevrolet's lineup. That would put it around the 2016/2017MY (2015/2016 calendar). That's 25 to 37 months from now, which given development times and the secrecy now apparent seems about right (it took about 33 months for the Challenger and 39 months for Camaro to get from concept showing to a production line).

posaune

The Alpha+ CTS is a MY 2014 so we should see it sometime next year and most of the engineering should be completed or close to being completed. The Next Alpha we know about is the 6th Gen Camaro which is also supposed to be on Alpha+, unless those plans have changed. That is supposed to be a 2016 so we will see it in CY 2015. The Camaro will need to have some of the really trick, light weight parts taken out for cost savings so there is the potential for cost sharing the development of the more mainstream Alpha parts for a low priced Code 130R.

guionM

Alpha doesn't really have many "trick lightweight parts" that really amount to much. The prime reason the ATS weighs what it does is a combination of very small size (it's barely bigger than a Chevy Cruze) and lightweight steel used in it's construction (which also has next to no stressed expances of large steel stampings (ie: there's no floorpan or firewall) and much of the metal left is punched out to the point of looking like swiss cheese. GM did go over most other components to take out a pound here and only a few grams there, but a Cadillac ATS with a V6 still weighs as much as the larger last edition Malibu V6, 3461 vs Malibu's 3221-3473.

The actual trick pieces are things like: Magnesium motor mounts, aluminum hood, and natural fiber in place of plastic in some areas. But the size of the car and 4 cylinder power means that the differential doesn't have to be so heavy and the rear half-shafts can be much lighter. The radiator can be smaller and lightweight. The brake rotors can be thinner because it isn't going to have to stop as much weight to get the same performance, etc...

The next CTS will benefit from the lighter structure, but the moment you start hanging a V8 on in the chassis, and everything it needs, you'll see a substantial increase in weight.

I believe the Camaro will be lighter in this chassis. BUT Camaro's going to have to shrink...a lot... to take advantage of it.

The V6 Camaro is about 340 pounds heavier than the much smaller V6 ATS. I would wager that if the next Camaro stays the same size as the current one (which is also roughly the same size as the current Mustang...it's massiveness is an illusion) I'd peg the weight loss at half that, or about 170-200 pounds across the board.

Shrink Camaro to ATS size (roughly the 130 concept), and you're into a whole new ballgame.

99SilverSS

I would be happy with a 6th Gen Camaro that's slightly smaller and 170-200 lbs lighter. That's a move in the right direction and I would think essential to the cars survival in a more fuel effecient automotive world.

I just hope GM isn't chasing a moving target if the next Mustang gets slightly smaller and lighter as well. Some of that may depend on if it gets the expected IRS.