Quote from Bob Lutz In Autoweek
01-19-2003, 12:20 AM
#31
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I get you Guion.
I just hope when his stuff comes out and not these little improvements of what he has to work with I can be impressed with them. But I still don't like some of his decisions. So far.
I just hope when his stuff comes out and not these little improvements of what he has to work with I can be impressed with them. But I still don't like some of his decisions. So far.
Last edited by IZ28; 01-19-2003 at 01:05 AM.
01-19-2003, 12:28 AM
#32
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Originally posted by guionM
Some people really need to calm down. It was a joke. A lame one, but still a joke.
Some people really need to calm down. It was a joke. A lame one, but still a joke.
01-19-2003, 12:33 AM
#33
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Originally posted by cmc
You would think Czar Bob Lutz would be more apt at watching his mouth. Straight talk and digging yourself into a rut are two entirely different things.
You would think Czar Bob Lutz would be more apt at watching his mouth. Straight talk and digging yourself into a rut are two entirely different things.
01-19-2003, 08:37 AM
#36
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Originally posted by guionM
I find it hard to believe everyone got peeved over what was obviously an off the cuff joke. If anyone actually believes that he has no intention of bringing Camaro back for another 30 years, I suggest you look up the best shrink in your neighborhood, and make an apointment straightaway before someone tells you the truth about Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. You are taking this way, way too seriously.
Some people really need to calm down. It was a joke. A lame one, but still a joke.
I find it hard to believe everyone got peeved over what was obviously an off the cuff joke. If anyone actually believes that he has no intention of bringing Camaro back for another 30 years, I suggest you look up the best shrink in your neighborhood, and make an apointment straightaway before someone tells you the truth about Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny. You are taking this way, way too seriously.
Some people really need to calm down. It was a joke. A lame one, but still a joke.
Slide over to Ford. Everyone has known the Mustang was in the works for years. "Concepts" were just shown. Ford spent a lot of time interacting with owners and enthusiasts (even going to sites like this) to determine what people wanted. I've never seen anything like it. They've also said that they will be making many special versions like Mach1 and Bullitt. Why is it so hard to find this type of enthusiasm in GM? Instead we get Bob Lutz cracking jokes, a bunch of FWD V6 and SUV "SS" models, 35k performance cars and people saying "Trust Us".
01-19-2003, 09:38 AM
#38
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If you toss out the 30=year comment from Lutz, which, I agree, could be taken as a jab... I think he is doing everything he can.
Like Guion said, at least he is piecing some better performance versions of existing cars together, while he gets the cars he is able to influence from the ground up, ready to go....
Like Guion said, at least he is piecing some better performance versions of existing cars together, while he gets the cars he is able to influence from the ground up, ready to go....
01-19-2003, 10:07 AM
#39
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Originally posted by WERM
It was a pretty bad joke because so many are begging for GM to say just "Yes, we are working on a Camaro. " Instead, we get Mr. Lutz cracking jokes about leaving its biggest fans hanging.
Slide over to Ford. Everyone has known the Mustang was in the works for years. "Concepts" were just shown. Ford spent a lot of time interacting with owners and enthusiasts (even going to sites like this) to determine what people wanted. I've never seen anything like it. They've also said that they will be making many special versions like Mach1 and Bullitt. Why is it so hard to find this type of enthusiasm in GM? Instead we get Bob Lutz cracking jokes, a bunch of FWD V6 and SUV "SS" models, 35k performance cars and people saying "Trust Us".
It was a pretty bad joke because so many are begging for GM to say just "Yes, we are working on a Camaro. " Instead, we get Mr. Lutz cracking jokes about leaving its biggest fans hanging.
Slide over to Ford. Everyone has known the Mustang was in the works for years. "Concepts" were just shown. Ford spent a lot of time interacting with owners and enthusiasts (even going to sites like this) to determine what people wanted. I've never seen anything like it. They've also said that they will be making many special versions like Mach1 and Bullitt. Why is it so hard to find this type of enthusiasm in GM? Instead we get Bob Lutz cracking jokes, a bunch of FWD V6 and SUV "SS" models, 35k performance cars and people saying "Trust Us".
And on another note, why is it that GM feels that it has to maximize the profit on every car? Can't they be happy that the Camaro, before they yanked it, was still making them money?
01-19-2003, 11:47 AM
#40
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It was a pretty bad joke because so many are begging for GM to say just "Yes, we are working on a Camaro. " Instead, we get Mr. Lutz cracking jokes about leaving its biggest fans hanging.
01-19-2003, 01:02 PM
#41
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Originally posted by phantasm99
If GM showed half the enthusiasm for Camaro as Ford does for Mustang....
If GM showed half the enthusiasm for Camaro as Ford does for Mustang....
01-20-2003, 03:03 PM
#42
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Just a hunch, since there's an execution order on anyone who talks about a new Camaro, perhaps these press people should ask about a new rear drive Chevrolet coupe instead of asking about a new Camaro. 
01-20-2003, 08:46 PM
#43
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Originally posted by guionM
Just a hunch, since there's an execution order on anyone who talks about a new Camaro, perhaps these press people should ask about a new rear drive Chevrolet coupe instead of asking about a new Camaro.
Just a hunch, since there's an execution order on anyone who talks about a new Camaro, perhaps these press people should ask about a new rear drive Chevrolet coupe instead of asking about a new Camaro.
the problem about the "joke" that lutz said is..
Many of us feel sad, angry, and felt that Gm let us down, we are still waiting for a response of GM about the Camaro future and then he said that
01-20-2003, 10:39 PM
#44
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I don't understand why I keep reading about GM telling employees to not talk about the new camaro, how there is a gag order. There is no such thing. They talk about it and how it is not going to happen... Get real...
01-21-2003, 08:43 AM
#45
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POINTS TO PONDER...
Originally posted by guionM
The design department is no longer ruled by focus groups, and has more pull than they have had in years (or lifetimes for some of us).
The design department is no longer ruled by focus groups, and has more pull than they have had in years (or lifetimes for some of us).
It takes at least 4 years to develop a car from scratch, and he's been on the job only 16 months!
HOWEVER - loose-lipped comments about a 30-year-nap will fall harshly on the ears of die-hard enthusuasts that feel like they've just lost a friend. If he was a true Camaro-lover, I think he would have that feeling too, and been less likely to smack on it like that. I don't even own a Camaro, but even I felt a little dejected by that comment, joke or not. The Camaro was a very important member of the ponycar family, and I beleive it deserves respect... dead or alive... and those who love them deserve to be treated with respect as well. So while I will defend Lutz on his inheritance of some lame projects, I will not defend him at all over thoughtless comments made about legendary cars that have so many people so emotional right now. That was just wrong. Can you see Bill Ford doing something like that right after his commercials about "loving" the Mustang?
Another point regarding loose-lipped, half-joking, comments made at press conferences or interviews...
Can anybody say "Trent Lott"?
A significant quality that enables one to lead a LARGE group successfully is knowing how NOT to offend or alienate your followers, and knowing when to clam-up.
You simply WON"T see the cars you want till at the earliest 2005 probally as 2006s. Not because someone doesn't care about enthusiast, or is giving someone the big blow off, but because it actually takes that long to make a car.
It may take 18 months after the go ahead is given, but before the meeting that gives that go-ahead, the design, engineering, planning, manufacturing layout, and all the other stuff adds on alot of time. There are things that are actually being rushed towards production, and they won't be out till at the earliest 2005/06.
Do you think Nissan, Dodge, Ford, and others are just going to sit still during this same time period? My bias aside, I think GM has really dropped the ball under Zarella's watch, and lost a lot of ground in the performance and styling markets - Chevy in particular. Couple that with the new attitude of a young Bill Ford and John Coletti's race history and aggressive approach to performance, Dodge's new committments to the Hemi and performance lately, all of the import rocketships with their "high quality" reputations, and it's gonna be a challenge for GM to just "jump back up to speed". These other companies are ON A TEAR right now! I'm not saying GM can't do it - hardly. In fact, I'm sure they can because they have done it before. BUT, it's not gonna be as easy as it was back in the '60s - now we've got Japanese, German, European, Australian, and even Korean companies to compete with, not just the big-3. Getting GM back to the top of the performance pile will take LOTS of hard work, and I personally don't see it happening solely with Lutz' first lineup of "his" vehicles in 18 months or so. But GIVEN - he is on the right track, far moreso than Zarella.
AND THE DETAIL OF THE DAY IS...
Nobody has cued in on the fact that the "30-year-nap" was an intentional jab...
GTO last produced = 1974
GTO reintroduced = 2004
---------------------------------
30-year-nap.................30
MY OPINION - Lutz was trying to divert that conversation to mention GTO's rebirth and throw a sales pitch for GTO. He may want a Camaro back, for $ or loyalty or both, but I think he is more of a GTO guy than a Camaro guy. Camaro will be a significant card for him to play in a few years after GTO and Chevelle(?) newness wears off. IMO, Camaro is now one of Lutz' "Aces up the sleeve" to play when the game gets tough. Any good poker player will tell you, you don't play your best card until you have to.
Again, not singling out your post for scrutiny guionM - but you write so clearly and cover the bases well enough to bring out details that others may miss. That makes for great material to build on...
Please take my comments as "debate material from another POV", and not as a personal attack or rebuttal, because I really do agree with more of your post than I disagree with. It's just dull and moot to point out what's already been covered. Thanks!