One down......


One to go.........

 

This here horse has been beaten to atoms.

GM does not lose horsepower wars.

Next.

 

Yeah, god forbid they bring back the last strategy that actually outsold mustang. That'd be crazy....


BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I'm a die hard chevy guy, and i wouldn't touch a 4th gen with a ten foot pole, no matter what the bang for the buck factor was. Performance does not make something the best ever, it's too easy to make ANYTHING go fast to care what it comes with from the factory. I'd rather drive a turbo civic than a 4th gen.

I only come to this forum in hopes of news that GM isn't going to repeat the 4th gen fiasco again. After all, i'm going to need a convertible in a few years...

 

Probably awful drivers, considering my 02 GT is good for low 14s to 14 flat with essentially no mods (cheese dick K&N air filter and SLP loudmouth exhaust which amounts to what .0000000000000000000000000000000000001 hp)

 

[QUOTE=guionM]What HP are you expecting? Horsepower figures for ALL cars are climbing. That 340 hp or so the 4th gen was making will be made by smaller V8s in a matter of months.[/QUOTE

Honestly a 400 (ish) HP rating, and yes i realize small block output has increased a good amount since 2002.



Yes i realize this as well, point being is. With other cars having such a high allowance of room in the ways of HP from the companys flagship cars (EX: Viper to a Vette) even if they put the HP to 450, tradition tells us the Camaro will be no more then a SAE rated 400-425. Same can be said for the Cobra Vs GT40. 450HP cobras are a very real threat in the near future especially 2007.



..... It was mentioned as a ceiling for the HP on other dodge products. I was mentioning the Viper as DCX's flagship car. where did you even remotely see a comparison...



Yes, but with the Mustang Shelby hitting the 500HP mark (or close to) i dunno if Ford will choose to keep its faithful steed its flagship, and the GT-40 just a dreamers car.





I would hope so, but with respect to the C5, in a two model year period anything more then a 50HP jump Especially with new SAE ratings seems a little unrealistic. which would theoretically leave the 07' Z28 in the 400 range.


heh, say 15 years ago the Impala would comback as a V6 frontwheel drive standard sedan with a spicy V6 model with a Performance V6 pumping out a amazing 230HP carrying the name SS, and hardcore fanatics would say you sir are insane, but GM pulled that one off... did they not?

Point is nothing is impossible with GM at this point.

2#. I wasnt comparing, i was using it as an example..




True true, but im looking at it from a performance stand point, not every teenage boy wants one because girls think mustangs are Hot, which was the case in my group of friends, and hell in my general area. The 1995-2004 mustangs sold real well, because they where Eye-catchers, and alot of people where nestalgic. Dont act as if it was a "Better all around package", some things catch the publics eye and some dont.

GTs have done consistant 14's in front of my eyes, just the way it is.





where did i ever say my LT1's where stock? with gears and headers pipe and DR's i was putting two lengths on 05's at the track for 13.7-13.4's.

and im pretty sure a Stock 1997 SS would do alot more then Out accelerate a 2005 mustang, unless ofc these new stangs are outperforming there NA Cobra 2000-2002 (??) counterparts...




GM set the bar high with the F4's performance, and setting it lower in todays world would accomplish what? When i think of camaro perfomance i think of 68-71 then 93-02. I have very little experiance with Third Gens . When i was growing up, the standard Z28 was one of the fastiest modern cars on the road, its what ive grown to know and expect.





I know all to well these storys, my grandfather was an engineer in the drivetrain department in GM from 1960-1996 and has shared the storys of what some did to keep the line alive, I understand and appreciate these cars history, and thats why i have high expectations you should as well.

 

The Ying to my Yang, im glad someone understood my concerns.

 

IMHO, and usually remains the same with most die hard GM guys i know in real life is, the 305 was a bad choice to have optioned for the performer Z28, standard camaro option? Sure. Z28? No. It really just wasnt a suitable motor for a optioned up sports car, sorry.

4th gen fiasco? please enlighten me.

 

I would like to see a ~400 hp base car with moderate tq, and a ~450 hp high performance model with 500 lb ft tq with flared fenders, like the c6 z06.

 

I hope they don't put a cap on engines like they used to. I hope since the caddy cts-v elimated that and if I had the money and really desired I could special order an ls-7 for a ton of money maybe 45,000 or 50,000 if really desired

 

that prototype that kid made a few years back of the orange and black 69' inspired camaro was the best retro design ive ever seen.

If that car hit the streets, dealers couldnt keep enough on the lots.

 

I agree, NO V6!

LS4 - Base (RS)
LS2 - Z28
LS7 Detuned - SS
Supercharged LS1 - IROC Z <---- ( for my personal amusement)

Honestly, if you dont want a V8. Theres plenty of smaller motor in nice cars GM has to offer...

 

heh, and every pimple faced 16 year old f-body fan cries, you gotta have a V6 for the yutes.

V6 base
300 to 350 for the entry V8 car
400 for the high level V8 car
500 for the "you know the dealer is gonna mark this up gotta have it model)

 

True, V6 definatly needs to be in place.

 

I'll start with your last question. The 4th gen sold worse just about every year it was out. Despite being faster and better handling than the mustang, it's total lack of styling, cheap interior, and continuation with the *** dragging seating position long past when it was popular, lead to noone but die hard guys buying them. Yeah, 20-30k total camaros per year in this millenium was a fiasco.

As for the suitability of a 305 in a Z28, it outsold LS1 fbodies didn't it? Hell, one year worth of sub-160hp LG4s probably outsold the entire LS1 camaro production. I'm not going to check the stats, someone here will correct me anyway, but i bet it's close.

And that's what this is about, selling cars. You're smoking crack if you think the fbody will survive if it comes back to the same kind of volume the 4th gen had. Give it a handful of engine options in a uniquely styled chassis with a nice interior and people will buy them. Believe it or not, the average camaro buyer cares a lot more about the car not being an uncomfortable ugly POS than if it can run 12s stock.

 

What if you wanted a stick?

Also, as to your concerns about historically nothing matching Corvettes hp, I'm sure you know that isn't really the case anymore. Even if it were something Chevrolet tried to enforce, with the presense of the Z06, I would think the base Corvettes hp number isn't as hallowed as it maybe once was. Note: GTO, CTSv, STSv, SSR, Trailblazer SS, and more to come.