Supply and demand is the law here.

There's no doubt in my mind that oil companies intentionally keep supplies low to drive the price up.

 

I agree. They can't directly effect prices, but they have sole control of demand (specially since it's not government regulated).

 

Uh...ya....and who would get to decide who was the "more known intelligent members" and who wasn't? Pretty easy to know what category you fall into, of course.

Bob

 

Proud....no doubt that there are corrupt people in "big oil", or any other industry. I'd suggest the same applies to the institution that some would want to control "big oil" and other industry - namely, the Gov't. That's one big reason that I am VERY leary of any such thing. I'd prefer to NOT have the weasels guarding the fox house, so to speak.

Assume you mean that have sole control over SUPPLY. And I agree...if you also take into account the Saudis, the Brits, the Venenzualans (sp), the Russians, etc.



Bob

 

Now, now... don't be cheeky, Eric. You took me out of context, a little. You highlighted the nature of how the global economy works in relation to price rises of one our our most dependent commodities... but you fell far short of going into details on how the price could be and/or is being manipulated... which is another subject altogether. Hence my statement, above, plus more. Btw, I do enjoy reading your posts very much, as I do Proud Pony's... so don't hold back on my account, guys.

Price fixing happens a lot in the corporate world but often can be very difficult to prove.

 

Fixed.

http://www.shell.com/home/content/nz...es_prices.html


Unpredictable / extreme weather events



Extreme weather events, such as hurricanes in the US can temporarily reduce global refining capacity. Such reductions and speculation about availability of refined products have caused volatility in refined product prices globally.

 

The $USD is the only real constant in the equation. Although, it's interesting to note that since the $USD snow-dived, the price of crude oil has increased. I wonder if the price increase was the result of a cost readjustment against foreign exchange rates (e.g. Euro vs USD)?

As a side note, when our $AUD was around $US50c, we still had comparatively cheap fuel and low inflation. It's only now that our country's inflation rates have ballooned substantially with the rise in fuel costs. We're definitely heading for a recession, if we're not there already... but how bad will it get? Well it depends largely on the price of oil (it seems).

EDIT: I keep hearing about India contributing to high world oil prices so I dug up this information: http://www.automobileindia.com/cars/statistics/

Also see here: http://www.automobileindia.com/cars/...tatistics.html

It seems that India's market has been growing at a similar rate (or slower) to Toyota's global growth over the same period. To blame India alone for the price increase of crude oil doesn't seem totally accurate to me, if the figures are any guide.

 

My research on passenger cars sold in China revealed this information:

It's interesting to note that China's auto market explosion began in 2002. Then the market slumped and picked up again in 2006.

I don't think that based on these figures anybody can say conclusively that India and China are a valid major reason for the increase in the price of crude oil (assuming auto sales as a guide).

All smoke and mirrors to me.

 

China's oil consumption increased by ~45% between 2000 and 2005. As of this past June, they were the 2nd biggest consumer (the US is first, of course).

India's oil consumption increased by ~10% between 2000 and 2005. As of this past June, they were the 6th biggest consumer (Japan, Germany, & Russia were ahead).

I'd say that is fairly major.

Looking at the other countries that I mentioned....

US Oil consumption increased ~5% between 2000 and 2005, Germany decreased by ~7%, Japan decreased by ~4%, and Russia increased by ~8%. Total world consumption for the same period increased ~7.5%.

I do not know how much production and just as importantly - refining capacity increased (or decreased) during that same period.

Bottom line: India, and most especially China are having a much greater impact on oil now than they were just a few years ago.

Sources:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/en...il-consumption
http://www.swivel.com/data_sets/spreadsheet/1003357

 

Yes, I believe Oil prices are fixed more than not, especially when we seemed to have went on an "Oil Standard", seeing as how gold is in short supply.

My "personal opinion" is:
Since OIL prices affect the prices of everything else in my life, as do every other utility, that it should be labeled a UTILITY and regulated as one.

I don't have all the details but, I'm sure the electric companies still make a healthy profit. Most houses now have to use 200amp service, where 60amp was the norm, say 20 or so years ago.
And demand for OIL will keep rising for sure!

And, every time a commodity or utility is "de-regulated", the prices SOAR, "competition" or "supply and demand" be d@mned. ..even though the very arguement for de-regulation, is lower prices due to competition.

 

It's as obvious as a sunny day. Two gas staions across the street from each other. One gets in a new load of fuel at a higher price...price goes up. Station across the street still has 3/4 full tank, yet their price goes up as well.

They're doing it, that proves it.

 

90rocz....I'd like to see the evidence of commodities being deregulated and then prices soaring. And once again, for the reasons listed above (and others, I'm sure), you can't compare an electric utility with the oil market. BTW....nice link in your sig.

94Camaro_Z_28.....big difference between a locally-owned gas station franchise and the "big oil" companies that we are talking about. Additionally, I would suggest that the opposite also occurs: When the price at the station next door goes down, so does yours.

 

People could decide for themselves.

Your flame/comment about your perception/opinion of my intelligence was completely unprompted and unjustified, by the way. I won't sink so low as to flame back, though it's tempting.

I already admitted I didn't know enough about this subject to comment, and by that measure I have not voted either.

 

Not a flame - but take it that way if you wish. I was not questioning your intelligence. Rather, I was implying that you have an elitist, "holier-than-thou" attitude. However, in deference to Jason, I shall cease this line of discussion.

Oh....I thought you weren't going to read this thread past the point of your original post?

 

Nope. I said I'd like the poll to be public so that I wouldn't have to read the thread. Since the poll is not public I felt compelled to read the commentary in the thread and came across your gem of a comment.

And it appears that even though you're aware that the admins would not approve of your unprovoked flaming, you've continued your flames in this reply. You've contradicted yourself trying to find a way to slide in another jab despite the fact that your negative perception of my intelligence or attitude has nothing at all to do with this thread.

For what it's worth, I understand I have a reputation for being argumentative and stubborn at times. You should realize that you do, as well. In fact that's probably why I apparently rub you the wrong way. You can't stand people that act like you.

Regardless, your thoughts on me and my thoughts on you have absolutely nothing to do with the subject of this thread. So drop it, and move on. Go play with your little voodoo doll with my face taped to it if that's what yo have to do to make yourself feel better.