Now that the Solstice, Sky and Bengal are now approved for 2006, is the Camaro dead?
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 108
From: Plano,Tx
Originally posted by formula79
I don't see Redplanet clicking his heels in joy at the though of a Miata/S2000 type car being the basis for the next Camaro. Matter of fact I would love to see his face if you mentioned the two in the same sentence
I wanna see how big this car is gonna be..the 5.7L designation will be dead soon...what would they use a 4.8L or 5.3L.
I don't see Redplanet clicking his heels in joy at the though of a Miata/S2000 type car being the basis for the next Camaro. Matter of fact I would love to see his face if you mentioned the two in the same sentence
I wanna see how big this car is gonna be..the 5.7L designation will be dead soon...what would they use a 4.8L or 5.3L.
Last I heard it was going to be 400hp, and that would be very good to fight Cobras if used in Camaro.
formula, What about the possible Chevy GTO (Chevelle) wouldn't that effect a return of the Camaro if it sold well?
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,724
From: Hebron, KY
Originally posted by Geoff Chadwick
I think the car's wheelbase and size, though it may allow it run an ls1, would you want it to? The car would be all over the road unless it's bigger then it looks to me. 350hp/350tq in a car that's not much bigger then a miata? Also the suspension and chassis I doubt will be able to handle the power of a modded powerplant, and I should hope Lutz wont let that happen... Yeah. Take the ls1, swap a cam, lifters, headers, catback, and a procharger to like 6psi. Floor it, and the rear end breaks, the car shears in half, and the driveshaft pokes you in the eye...
I think the car's wheelbase and size, though it may allow it run an ls1, would you want it to? The car would be all over the road unless it's bigger then it looks to me. 350hp/350tq in a car that's not much bigger then a miata? Also the suspension and chassis I doubt will be able to handle the power of a modded powerplant, and I should hope Lutz wont let that happen... Yeah. Take the ls1, swap a cam, lifters, headers, catback, and a procharger to like 6psi. Floor it, and the rear end breaks, the car shears in half, and the driveshaft pokes you in the eye...
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
Originally posted by cobraeater
It might have a longer wheelbase, but can you imagine a LS1 in a Cavalier.
That car couldn't support the power of a stock LS1 no matter what you do to it.
The right transmission and rear axle would be needed, but of course neither would fit and the LS1 is too big for the engine bay anyway.
It might have a longer wheelbase, but can you imagine a LS1 in a Cavalier.
That car couldn't support the power of a stock LS1 no matter what you do to it.
The right transmission and rear axle would be needed, but of course neither would fit and the LS1 is too big for the engine bay anyway.
There seems to be the misconception developing on this thread that someone's just going to drop an engine in an alumunum foil chassis car, and that's it. It also seems to be forgotten that till the 3rd gen came out, Camaro shared it's chassis with an economy car & the smallest car made at the time of gen1 & 2's introduction. Kind of like Cavalier today, huh?
We can create all the doomsday scenarios we want out of all of this, and become armchair engineering experts, but I'm going to put a bit of trust into GM's engineering department if they do make a firebrething Camaro out of this chassis. I can't name one car they ever made that was unmanageable on the road. If they are guilty of anything, it's making cars too manageable.
If anything, the 3rd & 4th gen Camaros are the cars that should fold in half when you step on the accelerator. The doors create huge openings, that rear hatch opens like a C5, and the only upper structure you have connecting the front & rear halfs of the car is the puny piece of metal between the t-tops (even hardtops have no roof structure beyond this), so let's not get so cocky about how a car whose engineering we know nothing about yet is going to be too weak for an high powered V8. Solstice is going to weigh just under 3000 pounds with a 4. I think it's safe to say it will have a substantial chassis structure.
I'm pretty intrigued about the prospect of a low cost, solstice based Camaro myself.
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
Originally posted by jrp4uc
All of this sounds similar to the swaps done in Fieros, another car with a strong parts-bin development. I have never heard of any related catostrophes in those cars, so I wouldn't think is as hard to pull off as some believe. Handling wise, yes, there would be sacrifices, but it doesn't have to be a great handler. And let's remember, this isn't a featherweight, 2200-2400lb car like a Miata to begin with. The Solstice already weighs 2900 and what, around 3100-3200 with a V8? Hardly a little rollerskate.
All of this sounds similar to the swaps done in Fieros, another car with a strong parts-bin development. I have never heard of any related catostrophes in those cars, so I wouldn't think is as hard to pull off as some believe. Handling wise, yes, there would be sacrifices, but it doesn't have to be a great handler. And let's remember, this isn't a featherweight, 2200-2400lb car like a Miata to begin with. The Solstice already weighs 2900 and what, around 3100-3200 with a V8? Hardly a little rollerskate.
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,154
From: All around
My car dosent even have the T top bar!
Until I see more info, by the look of it throwing even an LS1 into it would change the weight distribution, and I HOPE there is something to negate my thought.
Also it looks totally un-usable. The mustang has some trunk space in convertible or coupe, and I again, barring more details, cant say much.
Lastly, I dont think it shows any heritage or lineage with any camaro. Not that the camaros always looked alike...
idk... I'm still wondering why GM is expanding the sigma chassis plant so much, I think a stripped down, cheap assed vette with different bodyworks would make a great camaro design, considering the c5 is tried and true to be an amazing design on GM's part.
Until I see more info, by the look of it throwing even an LS1 into it would change the weight distribution, and I HOPE there is something to negate my thought.
Also it looks totally un-usable. The mustang has some trunk space in convertible or coupe, and I again, barring more details, cant say much.
Lastly, I dont think it shows any heritage or lineage with any camaro. Not that the camaros always looked alike...
idk... I'm still wondering why GM is expanding the sigma chassis plant so much, I think a stripped down, cheap assed vette with different bodyworks would make a great camaro design, considering the c5 is tried and true to be an amazing design on GM's part.
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 2,402
From: Toronto, ON Canada
it's not THE solstice, it's JUST solstice
Couple of things - we ought to stop saying the Solstice. The Pontiac Solstice. And then in the same sentence say a Miata. It's just Solstice, without THE.
Or like "Is the Solstice going to be S2000 competitor?"
Thank you
Or like "Is the Solstice going to be S2000 competitor?"
Thank you
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
Originally posted by Geoff Chadwick
My car dosent even have the T top bar!
Until I see more info, by the look of it throwing even an LS1 into it would change the weight distribution, and I HOPE there is something to negate my thought.
Also it looks totally un-usable. The mustang has some trunk space in convertible or coupe, and I again, barring more details, cant say much.
Lastly, I dont think it shows any heritage or lineage with any camaro. Not that the camaros always looked alike...
idk... I'm still wondering why GM is expanding the sigma chassis plant so much, I think a stripped down, cheap assed vette with different bodyworks would make a great camaro design, considering the c5 is tried and true to be an amazing design on GM's part.
My car dosent even have the T top bar!
Until I see more info, by the look of it throwing even an LS1 into it would change the weight distribution, and I HOPE there is something to negate my thought.
Also it looks totally un-usable. The mustang has some trunk space in convertible or coupe, and I again, barring more details, cant say much.
Lastly, I dont think it shows any heritage or lineage with any camaro. Not that the camaros always looked alike...
idk... I'm still wondering why GM is expanding the sigma chassis plant so much, I think a stripped down, cheap assed vette with different bodyworks would make a great camaro design, considering the c5 is tried and true to be an amazing design on GM's part.
I wouldn't worry about GM selling Solstice as a Camaro. A Hummer H2 looks nothing like an Escalade, and Bonneville doesn't look like a Seville or Park Avenue, so I believe GM's studios will be up to comming up with an entirely different look if it were to be the basis of Camaro.
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 185
A fifth-gen Camaro doesn't have to look anything like a Solstice, Bengal, or even the Saturn Sky if it was based on the same platform.
But if you can have a single, all-new, V-8, RWD platform as the basis for these three cars, then tack on a Camaro and Firebird and now you are building 5 cars on a single platform and perhaps at a single plant. Now that just improves the business case for building them, including a new Camaro.
But if you can have a single, all-new, V-8, RWD platform as the basis for these three cars, then tack on a Camaro and Firebird and now you are building 5 cars on a single platform and perhaps at a single plant. Now that just improves the business case for building them, including a new Camaro.
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Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 1,873
From: South Jersey
Originally posted by guionM
We can create all the doomsday scenarios we want out of all of this, and become armchair engineering experts, but I'm going to put a bit of trust into GM's engineering department if they do make a firebrething Camaro out of this chassis. I can't name one car they ever made that was unmanageable on the road. If they are guilty of anything, it's making cars too manageable.
We can create all the doomsday scenarios we want out of all of this, and become armchair engineering experts, but I'm going to put a bit of trust into GM's engineering department if they do make a firebrething Camaro out of this chassis. I can't name one car they ever made that was unmanageable on the road. If they are guilty of anything, it's making cars too manageable.
BTW, I thought the Bengal was FRONT wheel drive.
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 3,698
From: USA
I know for a fact that up untill at least two months ago the Camaro was not planned anywhere near the Solstice platform.....and I SERIOUSLY doubt that has changed if certain people have its way. The Camaro had a rep for bad ergonomics to begin with, I seriously doubt that we will want see a bastardized Delta/Cavalier platform that has been converted to a RWD coupe...coneverted back to a 2+2 coupe.
For the record
Solstice wheelbase =95.1" /length=193.2"
Camaro Wheelbase= 101.1"/length=153.7"
So there is a huge difference in size..and remember an LS1 is pretty much jammed in the Camaro.
Saturn ION (Delta based)
Wheelbase 103.2 in
Length 184.5-185.0 in
Howver keep in mind that most of the length is used in interior space. There is barely enough room for the transverse I4 to fit... A V8 would require a dramatic reduction in interior space aor increase in length...
For the record
Solstice wheelbase =95.1" /length=193.2"
Camaro Wheelbase= 101.1"/length=153.7"
So there is a huge difference in size..and remember an LS1 is pretty much jammed in the Camaro.
Saturn ION (Delta based)
Wheelbase 103.2 in
Length 184.5-185.0 in
Howver keep in mind that most of the length is used in interior space. There is barely enough room for the transverse I4 to fit... A V8 would require a dramatic reduction in interior space aor increase in length...
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 2,979
"But if you can have a single, all-new, V-8, RWD platform as the basis for these three cars, then tack on a Camaro and Firebird and now you are building 5 cars on a single platform and perhaps at a single plant. Now that just improves the business case for building them, including a new Camaro."
We have a WINNER!!!!!! If the engine bay can take an I4 and a V6, a V8 is going to fit also. They can all be built off of the same line, and a plant dedicated to them as a group.
That's probably what it is going to take to get a new Camaro gents.
BTW, I trust RedPlanet enough to know that he could pull a Camaro off of a Bengal/Solstice/Sky platform. Why don't some of you?
We have a WINNER!!!!!! If the engine bay can take an I4 and a V6, a V8 is going to fit also. They can all be built off of the same line, and a plant dedicated to them as a group.
That's probably what it is going to take to get a new Camaro gents.
BTW, I trust RedPlanet enough to know that he could pull a Camaro off of a Bengal/Solstice/Sky platform. Why don't some of you?
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 185
Originally posted by formula79
I know for a fact that up untill at least two months ago the Camaro was not planned anywhere near the Solstice platform.....and I SERIOUSLY doubt that has changed if certain people have its way. The Camaro had a rep for bad ergonomics to begin with, I seriously doubt that we will want see a bastardized Delta/Cavalier platform that has been converted to a RWD coupe...coneverted back to a 2+2 coupe.
For the record
Solstice wheelbase =95.1" /length=193.2"
Camaro Wheelbase= 101.1"/length=153.7"
So there is a huge difference in size..and remember an LS1 is pretty much jammed in the Camaro.
Saturn ION (Delta based)
Wheelbase 103.2 in
Length 184.5-185.0 in
Howver keep in mind that most of the length is used in interior space. There is barely enough room for the transverse I4 to fit... A V8 would require a dramatic reduction in interior space aor increase in length...
I know for a fact that up untill at least two months ago the Camaro was not planned anywhere near the Solstice platform.....and I SERIOUSLY doubt that has changed if certain people have its way. The Camaro had a rep for bad ergonomics to begin with, I seriously doubt that we will want see a bastardized Delta/Cavalier platform that has been converted to a RWD coupe...coneverted back to a 2+2 coupe.
For the record
Solstice wheelbase =95.1" /length=193.2"
Camaro Wheelbase= 101.1"/length=153.7"
So there is a huge difference in size..and remember an LS1 is pretty much jammed in the Camaro.
Saturn ION (Delta based)
Wheelbase 103.2 in
Length 184.5-185.0 in
Howver keep in mind that most of the length is used in interior space. There is barely enough room for the transverse I4 to fit... A V8 would require a dramatic reduction in interior space aor increase in length...
Formula79:
So, if I am reading this correctly, then up until two months ago there were plans for a new Camaro, or at least some people at GM working on one? Do you know the program code name for this?
